Ethical Decision Making in Applied Behavior Analysis: Session 294 with Ilene Schwartz and Beth Kelly
The Behavioral Observations Podcast with Matt Cicoria
Release Date: 03/22/2025
The Behavioral Observations Podcast with Matt Cicoria
In this episode, I sit down with , who conducts research on, amongst other things, improving how we teach, learn, and organize information using behavior-analytic strategies. We explore her career journey, her research on graphic organizers and the Cover, Copy, Compare (CCC) strategy, and the broader implications for stimulus equivalence, educational technology, and effective teaching. In This Episode, You’ll Learn: How Sarah’s unconventional path led her from economics and psychology into Applied Behavior Analysis (ABA). Why note-taking and structured...
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In Session 317, I sit down with Dr. Francesca Delia Espinoza to revisit one of the most foundational—but often misunderstood—topics in behavior analysis: eye contact. We explore why eye contact shouldn’t be treated as a simple objective, but instead understood within its broader social and developmental context. Francesca explains how eye contact is better re-framed as "eye-looking," and why behavior analysts need a strong conceptual foundation for evaluating when, how, and why to teach it. We discuss her recent paper in Perspectives on Behavior Science, which encourages practitioners to...
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Episode Overview In this special episode of the Behavioral Observations Podcast, I had the honor of celebrating the 25th installment of the . This one was particularly meaningful because it also marks the final appearance of Dr. John Borrero in his role as Editor-in-Chief of . I invited John to reflect on his three-year tenure—what he learned from reading an enormous volume of manuscripts, how his thinking evolved, and why adapting our language is essential if we want behavior analysis to reach broader audiences. From there, we transitioned into an...
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Thanks for joining me in Session 315 of The Behavioral Observations Podcast. In this episode, I spoke with Drs. and to dive deep into trauma-informed behavior analysis. Gabi brings her 30-year journey in the field—from undergrad roots to professorship at —while David shares his evolution from child and family therapy to clinical psychology, with a heavy focus on foster and adoptive parenting. Both guests are passionate about closing the divide between trauma therapy and behavioral strategies, and they credit mentors like for lighting the way. We...
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If you follow Behavioral Observations on , you might recall that I had the once-in-a-lifetime opportunity to travel to the 20th Annual conference to give the closing Keynote Address. I could devote an entire podcast episode to talking about all the wonderful people I met, the fun experiences I had, and the amazing sights I was able to take in. One of the biggest highlights though, was the opportunity to sneak in the following conversation I had with a panel of employees from Hawaii's Department of Education. It turns out that the State of Hawaii is doing some innovative work in...
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In Session 313, Dr. Cody Morris from , and the newly re-launched podcast (please also see ), joins me to dive into a topic that has merited quite a bit of discussion in Applied Behavior Analysis. These days, you pretty much have to be living under a rock in ABA circles to not have noticed the increased focus on assent practices in treatment programming. Cody is one of the preeminent authorities on this topic, and in this episode, we talk about the definitions of assent, how assent has been conceptualized in other fields, and how it applies to the work we do as Behavior Analysts. In doing so,...
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In this episode of The Behavioral Observations Podcast, I talk with , former Amazon product leader and current head of product at , a company building AI-powered platforms to improve autism care. Grant shares how his team is developing and tools to shorten waitlists, streamline reporting, and support clinicians in delivering more efficient ABA therapy. We also discuss how Frontera’s app enables HIPAA-compliant behavior tracking, parent engagement, and asynchronous supervision — while addressing the issue of . This conversation highlights...
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In Session 311, I sit down with Christina Nylander and Leah Hussain from to talk about culturally sensitive approaches to Autism intervention. We dive into three case studies that show how flexible, individualized care can make a huge difference in building the rapport that's so important in our clinical work. Along the way, we share strategies for gaining parent buy-in, supporting bilingual language development, and using AAC devices to help children communicate more effectively with their families. Here’s what we cover: The parent...
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In this episode of the Inside JABA Series podcast, we dive into a fascinating discussion on health-related routines for adults with intellectual and developmental disabilities (IDD). Dr. Katie McHugh, Dr. Claudia Dozier, and Editor-in-Chief Dr. John Borrero share insights from their recent study, Synchronous Reinforcement Schedules Promote Tolerance of Health-Related Routines for Adults with Disabilities. The conversation explores how synchronous reinforcement schedules—where reinforcement occurs in real time alongside behavior—can improve tolerance for essential routines like...
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In Session 309, I welcome Dr. Lyndsy Coffield, Director of Client Success at , to share her unique journey in the field of Applied Behavior Analysis (ABA) and her groundbreaking work training law enforcement officers on autism awareness. Dr. Coffield’s path into ABA began with an undergraduate degree in speech pathology, later becoming an RBT and eventually a BCBA. Today, she oversees intake and marketing at a growing clinic network in Georgia while also dedicating her research to improving police interactions with individuals on the autism spectrum. This episode explores the...
info_outlineDrs. Ilene Schwartz and Beth Kelly joined me to discuss the never ending conundrum of navigating ethical dilemmas. As Ilene points out in the podcast, most people know right from wrong, but the types of dilemmas BCBAs encounter are what she calls 'right vs. right' dilemmas...
Therefore, ethical practice requires a continuous decision making process. And in my guests' view, this is not a matter of decontextualized rule-following. In this podcast, we get into these nuances, using Ilene and Beth's newly published book, Ethical Decision Making in Applied Behavior Analysis.
We also discussed a framework for articulating one's values and principles that you might find helpful in your work setting.
Resources for this podcast:
- Ethical Decision Making in Applied Behavior Analysis.
- Rosenberg and Scwhartz (2018). Guidance or Compliance: What Makes an Ethical Behavior Analyst?
- Kelly, Greeny, Rosenberg and Schwartz (2020). When Rules Are Not Enough: Developing Principles to Guide Ethical Conduct.
- Dr. Schwartz's faculty page.
- Dr. Kelly's faculty page.
- BOP's CEUs, with many Ethics events.
This podcast is brought to you with the support of:
- The Profound Autism Summit. The Profound Autism Summit is a two-day conference taking place on April 10th and 11th in Boston, MA. Following on the massive success of the 2024 Summit, the 2025 event brings together leaders from the areas of research, medicine, treatment, advocacy, and education to discuss the needs and support of those with Profound Autism across disciplines and throughout the lifespan.
- CEUs from Behavioral Observations. Learn from your favorite podcast guests while you're commuting, walking the dog, or whatever else you do while listening to podcasts. New events are being added all the time, so check them out here.
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- The Verbal Behavior Conference. Whether you attend in-person in Austin, TX, or online via BehaviorLive, you're going to love this year's Verbal Behavior Conference! Click here to get all the details!
- Behavior University. Their mission is to provide university quality professional development for the busy Behavior Analyst. Learn about their CEU offerings, including their 8-hour Supervision Course, as well as their RBT offerings over at behavioruniversity.com/observations. Don't forget to use the coupon code, PODCAST to save at checkout!