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[Best of Season] AMP 080: How To Use Conversion Psychology To Get Better Results With Joanna Wiebe From Copyhackers

Actionable Marketing Podcast

Release Date: 02/22/2022

CoSchedule started the Actionable Marketing Podcast (AMP) in 2015 and has recorded and published more than 300 episodes. CoSchedule has worked with some of the smartest minds out there that share their stories with you through this podcast. This season, CoSchedule brings back some of the best of the best evergreen content. 

Copywriting can happen anywhere - from blogs to cereal boxes. It includes the whole world of marketing words. Conversion copywriting helps businesses build their business. Conversion copywriting is about getting people to say “Yes” and generating more leads and buyers. It measures results to see if something converted or not.

Today, we’re talking to Joanna Wiebe, a conversion copywriter, creator of Copyhackers, and co-founder of Airstory. She is an absolute authority on copywriting and conversions.


Some of the highlights of the show include:

  • What makes people say, “Yes.” Whether it is clicking or trying something. There are different formulas you can use for this goal.
  • Ask customers, “What was going on in your life that brought you to…” Then, you can identify their motivation.
  • If you put a button on a Web page, people will click it because it is there. Lots of things will move people to click, but rarely lead to conversions.
  • Stages of Awareness: Unaware, Pain Aware, Solution Aware, Product Aware, and Most Aware.
  • Persuasion techniques are typically triggers used at the late stages in hope that you will make people buy.
  • “Don’t put pressure on poor, little button.” It’s going to get clicked, but don’t put too many fancy marketing tricks within it.
  • Where does it go? What will it say? Push the best people to the most highly optimized button.
  • There’s buttons for Calls to Value or Calls to Action. A Call to Action button is to tell the user exactly what you want them to do. For example, Download Ebook or Complete Purchase.
  • A Calls to Value button regards why a customer is performing an action and completes the phrase, “I want to…”
  • Change your button approach depending on the type of medium you are using. It depends on the context for an action or engagement.
  • Map out actions based on context and location - email, Website, blog, etc.
  • Map Calls to Action to move customers to the next stage of awareness.




Quotes by Joanna Wiebe:

“It wasn’t the digital atmosphere we have today in marketing where everything, everything gets measured.”

“The real thing is we want to convert. We want more leads and we want more buyers. That’s what conversion copywriting is about.”

“We can’t do a lot of motivating with copy, but you can take someone’s motivation and turn it into something.”

“People want to click things. Mostly because they just want to move through life and get their problems solved.”