EP461: Pick Only One, Plan Sponsors: Do You Want to Control GLP-1 Volume or Control GLP-1 Unit Cost? With Chris Crawford
Release Date: 01/16/2025
Relentless Health Value
In this second take on episode host Stacey Richter speaks with Dr. Tom Lee, founder of One Medical and Galileo. The discussion centers on the survival of independent primary care practices in the current healthcare economy, the associated challenges, and the paradox of primary care. Topics include reducing ER visits, managing downstream specialty spend, and the imbalance between CMS and commercial carrier payments to primary care practices. Dr. Lee highlights the importance of 'enlightened leadership' and a 'value-focused mindset' in balancing efficient service operations with...
info_outlineRelentless Health Value
This short bonus episode is a side bar conversation with Dr. Tom Lee discussing why retail clinics are struggling with Dr. Tom Lee. They explore the shortcomings of retail clinics in providing longitudinal primary care, despite their convenience for minor urgent care and vaccinations. Dr. Lee emphasizes that true primary care requires consistent, long-term patient relationships and complex management which many retail clinics fail to deliver. They also discuss the economic challenges of running such clinics and the importance of defining primary care's value proposition correctly....
info_outlineRelentless Health Value
Balancing Mission and Margin in Healthcare: A Candid Conversation with Dr. Ben Schwartz In this episode, host Stacey Richter engages in a deep dive with Dr. Ben Schwartz to explore the phrase 'No Margin, No Mission' and its practical implications in the healthcare industry. They discuss the complex relationship between profitability and mission-driven care, the challenges of value-based care, and the role of dyad leadership. The episode emphasizes the importance of transparency, regulatory measures, and trust in fostering a balance between mission and margin. Along the way, Dr. Schwartz...
info_outlineRelentless Health Value
In this Take Two episode of Relentless Health Value, host Stacey Richter reflects on her conversation with Dr. John Lee to explore the challenging intersection between mission and margin in healthcare. They discuss the nuances of cognitive dissonance faced by healthcare professionals, particularly when organizational priorities conflict with patient care. Dr. Lee shares insights on finding a sense of mission within the constraints of the current healthcare system, emphasizing the importance of incremental improvements, team-based care, and peer support. The conversation also...
info_outlineRelentless Health Value
Enhancing Payment Integrity in Health Systems: An In-depth Discussion with Kimberly Carleson. In Episode 481 of Relentless Health Value, host Stacey Richter speaks with Kimberly Carleson, CEO of US Beacon, about payment integrity within health systems. They delve into strategies some hospitals use to maximize revenue without raising rates and discuss the importance of accurate billing. Key takeaways include the high prevalence of billing errors, which can lead to significant overcharges for plan sponsors, often due to documentation gaps and complex coding systems. Kimberly provides...
info_outlineRelentless Health Value
Exploring the Complexities of Pharma Rebates with Ann Lewandowski In this Summer Short episode of Relentless Health Value, host Stacey Richter converses again with Ann Lewandowski about the intricate dynamics of pharmaceutical rebates, or as Lewandowski prefers, post-sale concessions. The discussion delves into the nuances of these rebates, the impact they have on drug costs, and the hidden consequences for patients and plan sponsors. They highlight articles and insights by Austin Chelko and Peter Hayes, touching on how rebates can disadvantage the pursuit of lower-cost generics...
info_outlineRelentless Health Value
In this second discussion with Andreas Mang and Jon Camire of Blackstone, Stacey Richter has an advanced discussion on the intricacies of stop-loss reinsurance for high-cost claimants. This show today, for sure, it’s for plan sponsors and anyone on or about plan sponsors; but also listen if you are serving high-cost claimants some other way. Because what you’ll learn here today is some insights relative to how plan sponsors go about making sure that they can pay you—like if you work for, for example, some clinical organization. There’s a, I don’t know, 101 starting point...
info_outlineRelentless Health Value
Stacey Richter has a second take on the original episode 433 since it is so relevant right now. Stacey engages in a compelling conversation with Justin Leader, CEO of BenefitsDNA, about the opaque practices of third-party administrators (TPAs) and their impact on healthcare costs. They discuss the hidden fees tucked into weekly claims wires, including shared savings fees, prior authorization fees, prepayment integrity fees, pay and chase fees, and TPA adjudication fees. The episode emphasizes the need for transparency, understanding hidden costs, and ensuring fiduciary...
info_outlineRelentless Health Value
Host Stacey Richter discusses the intricacies of stop-loss coverage with Andreas Mang and Jon Camire from Blackstone. The episode focuses on defining stop-loss insurance and exploring its critical role in protecting self-insured employers from catastrophic financial losses. The conversation delves into the nuances of individual and aggregate stop-loss policies, laser claims, and the importance of selecting an experienced consultant to navigate this complex landscape. The episode is essential listening for those managing high-cost claimants and exploring self-insurance options. This is a...
info_outlineRelentless Health Value
In this episode, Stacey Richter explores the impact of trust on healthcare outcomes, drawing from listener contributions and prior episodes of Relentless Health Value. The discussion underscores how trust or the lack thereof affects patients, clinicians, and healthcare systems. Key points include the importance of building trusted relationships, the detrimental effects of antitrust behaviors, and the broader implications for healthcare delivery. Stacey also highlights a bonus show featuring Charles Green on earning and maintaining trust. The episode concludes with an uplifting message about...
info_outlineThis episode with Chris Crawford, CEO of RxSaveCard, is not about the when, why, or how of GLP-1s for weight loss or best-practice prescribing. This episode very, very specifically is about the how and why of the pickle plan sponsors get themselves into often enough where if they impose formulary restrictions to limit the volume of meds that they are paying for, then unit prices go up, which is a thing for GLP-1s.
And this is critical just given how the costs associated with GLP-1s for weight loss contribute to some pretty significant increases in pharmacy trend for plan sponsors who choose to cover the GLP-1s for weight loss.
Chris Crawford and Stacey Richter discuss the challenges plan sponsors face with the rising costs of GLP-1 medications for weight loss. They explore how plan sponsors’ efforts to manage pharmacy trends often result in a tradeoff: lowering unit costs by increasing volume or vice versa. Chris also introduces a potential solution leveraging the growing cash marketplace, where employers can bypass traditional PBM contracts to achieve cost savings. Tune in for actionable insights into the perverse incentives in the pharmacy supply chain and innovative ways to navigate them. (Continued below the links)
=== LINKS ===
🔗 Show Notes with all mentioned links:
hhttps://cc-lnk.com/EP461
✉️ Enjoy this podcast? Subscribe to the free weekly newsletter:
https://relentlesshealthvalue.com/join-the-relentless-tribe
🫙 Support the podcast with a small donation to the Tip Jar:
https://relentlesshealthvalue.com/join-the-relentless-tribe
🎤 Listen on Apple Podcasts https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/feed/id892082003?ls=1
🎤 Listen on Spotify https://open.spotify.com/show/6UjgzI7bScDrWvZEk2f46b
📺 Subscribe to our YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/@RelentlessHealthValue
=== CONNECT WITH THE RHV TEAM ===
✭ LinkedIn https://www.linkedin.com/company/relentless-health-value/
✭ Threads https://www.threads.net/@relentlesshealthvalue/
✭ X https://twitter.com/relentleshealth/
✭ Bluesky https://bsky.app/profile/relentleshealth.bsky.social
Bottom line, there are some really impactful and not frequently delved into perverse incentives at play here. And we’re gonna talk about these today. And these are really key for anybody on or about the pharmacy supply chain in the U.S. to know about. This is very actionable insight.
So, again, there’s an unfortunate tradeoff, as it stands right now, for many plan sponsors. Lower your volume and raise the unit price or vice versa.
This episode is sponsored by RxSaveCard, and a big thanks for that. I really appreciate RxSaveCard for its financial support because this episode covers a really important topic that we probably would have covered anyway over here at Relentless Health Value.
And so, RxSaveCard standing up and offering their financial support to cover it was a really nice thing to do. And I thank them for their generosity.
07:57 What are the two pieces going on with GLP-1 PBM prices and rebates for employers?
10:00 Is the cash price for these name brand drugs currently less than the rebated PBM price?
11:49 Why does the rebate for GLP-1s disappear if employers try to put restrictions on who can receive access to these drugs?
15:07 Where does RxSaveCard come in to play here?
19:55 “We exist to save people money.”
20:45 EP456 with Brian Reid.
21:16 EP356 with Ge Bai, PhD, CPA.
21:37 EP439 with Luke Slindee, PharmD.