263 -Tom Totten and Building Lifetime Income through ESOPs
Release Date: 04/11/2025
285 - AI and Tech: What's Next for Annuities? Insights from David Novak
That Annuity Show
This episode of That Annuity Show brings together Paul Tyler, Bruno Caron, Tom Buckingham, James Wong and featured guest David Novak, CEO and Founder, Annuities Genius for a candid discussion on the intersection of AI and annuities. From conference insights to next-generation tools, they delve into how technology is reshaping client engagement, driving operational efficiency, and setting the stage for the industry’s next wave of innovation. Learn more at
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284 - Qiyun Cai on Why Insurance Agencies Leave Money on the Table (And How to Fix It)
That Annuity Show
Summary In this episode of That Annuity Show, Paul Tyler and Bruno Caron engage with Qiyun Cai, founder and CEO of Fintary, to discuss the challenges and innovations in the insurance industry, of managing and optimizing compensation and revenue. Qiyun shares her background in insurance and technology, explaining how Fintary aims to streamline revenue growth through flexible compensation structures and automation. The conversation delves into the complexities of multi-level distribution, the importance of data integration, and the need for modern solutions in a traditionally fragmented...
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283 - Portable, Bundled, Digital: Life Insurance for the Next Generation with Capgemini's Sam Chow
That Annuity Show
In this episode of That Annuity Show, Paul Tyler, Tisa Rabun-Marshall, and Bruno Caron talk with Samantha Chow from Capgemini to discuss the findings of the World Life Insurance Report. They explore consumer sentiment towards life insurance, the challenges of product design, and the importance of education in the industry. The conversation highlights global trends, the impact of societal shifts on insurance needs, and the necessity for flexible, bundled products that cater to the modern consumer. The role of technology and digital engagement in transforming the insurance landscape is also...
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282 - Hot Markets, Smarter Machines: Ken Leibow at LIMRA
That Annuity Show
Live from the LIMRA Annual Conference, hosts Paul Tyler and guest co-host, Tom Rios sit down with Ken Leibow of InsurTech Express—a relentless chronicler of what’s actually working across carriers and vendors. Ken breaks down the shift from AI talk to agentic AI doing, with underwriting workbenches embedding decision engines, Rx/MIB data, and scoring to move closer to instant decisions at point of sale. He maps today’s reality in service and claims—AI clearing level-one while humans handle complexity—and explains why annuities and RILAs remain red-hot despite cooling...
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281 - Live from LIMRA - Next-Gen Policy Delivery and The Future of Carrier Communications
That Annuity Show
Live from the LIMRA Annual Conference, host Paul Tyler and guest host, Tom Rios explore the future of carrier communications with Stephanie Warren and Tim Mader of O’Neil Digital Solutions. The conversation looks beyond today’s PDFs to a unified, intelligent platform where print and digital are orchestrated together—with auto-failover (email → mail), real-time delivery confirmation for agents, and 10-year, regulation-ready audit trails. They sketch what’s next: dynamic, personalized content (QR codes,...
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280 - AI, People, and Change: Jim Kerley Live from LIMRA
That Annuity Show
Recorded live on the floor of the LIMRA Annual Conference, host Paul Tyler and guest host, Tom Rios sit down with Jim Kerley, Managing Partner at Clearview Partners, for a candid conversation on what really moves the needle: going deep with AI (not broad), building a clear roadmap, and supporting people through constant change. Jim shares pragmatic guidance for carrier executives—how to future-proof your career, reduce organizational stress, upskill teams, and use industry resources and peer networks to turn transformation into measurable outcomes. If you’re leading strategy,...
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279 - A Discussion on the Future of Insurance Technology with Aspida's CIO and CTO
That Annuity Show
Join That Annuity Show hosts for an insightful discussion with Chief Information Officer, Alex Seidita, and Chief Technology Officer, Jason Pedone of Aspida. Hear about the benefits of an API-first architecture for straight-through processing and how they're exploring AI as a productivity multiplier rather than job replacement. The conversation explores the future of insurance technology, industry-wide data standardization challenges, and why emerging opportunities in RIA wealth channels, in-plan annuities, and alternative investments depend on solving current data friction problems that the...
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278 - Nassau's CIO Joe Orofino on Fed Cuts, AI Risks, and Social Security
That Annuity Show
Nassau Financial Group's Chief Investment Officer, Joe Orofino joins Paul Tyler to analyze the current economic landscape and its impact on retirement planning. They examine how Federal Reserve rate cuts affect annuity products, discuss inflation expectations hovering around 3%, and explore the looming Social Security funding crisis. Orofino explains why higher long-term interest rates benefit the annuity industry and shares insights on portfolio diversification strategies, including concerns about the S&P 500's heavy concentration in AI and tech stocks. Key topics include treasury rates,...
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Rerelease 262 – All Things MYGA with Jeff Affronti
That Annuity Show
Jeff Affronti, president and CEO of FSD Financial Services, joins our show to delve into the current landscape of annuities, focusing on market trends, the purpose of annuity laddering, and common strategies for younger investors. Jeff shares insights on using MYGAs for retirement income, the impact of inflation on annuities, and some of the latest product features and innovations in the industry. The discussion also touches on the risks associated with life-only annuities and the potential for entering the MYGA market. For more information: thatannuityshow.com
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277 - Joe Jordan on Navigating Change In World of Advice
That Annuity Show
Joe Jordan explores the importance of purpose in retirement, the impact of demographics, and the role of technology, including AI. Joseph emphasizes the significance of life insurance and social security in financial planning, advocating for a human-centered approach to financial services. The conversation highlights the need for advisors to adapt to changing client needs and the importance of understanding the emotional aspects of financial decision-making. Listen now where you get your podcasts and at
info_outlineTom Totten, an actuary and serial entrepreneur, shares his journey from a defined benefit consultant to advising companies on Employee Stock Ownership Plans (ESOPs). The conversation delves into the intricacies of ESOPs, their guarantees, and the liquidity risks associated with them.
Tom discusses the purpose of lifetime income strategies, including the use of annuities, and reflects on the evolving relationship between employers and employees in the context of retirement planning. In this conversation, the speakers discuss the benefits of including lifetime income solutions in retirement planning, emphasizing the role of the workplace in providing these solutions.
They explore the challenges of communicating the value of lifetime income to pre-retirees and retirees, the impact of technology on retirement planning, and the benefits of diversification in investment strategies. The discussion also touches on the potential of ESOPs as a means of wealth creation for employees and the evolving landscape of retirement planning in light of alternative investments.