Those Who Can't Teach Anymore

"Those Who Can’t Teach Anymore" is an Ambie Nominated, Award-Winning, 7-part podcast series exploring why teachers are leaving education and what can be done to stop the exodus.

Bonus: Presenting Those Who Can't Do 07/19/2024

Bonus: Presenting This Changes Everything 07/12/2023

7: Those Who Can't Teach Anymore 02/22/2023

7: Those Who Can't Teach Anymore Think about your favorite teacher. What were they like? What made them your favorite? Now, imagine if your favorite teacher quit their job before you had them in your life. What would you have lost? Think about what future generations of students will lose if more teachers leave because teachers don’t feel valued or trusted or fairly compensated. If things don’t change, more teachers will leave because they are realizing that they can. In this episode, we hear from former teachers who left education and are happier for it. Music: Theme Song By “Don’t You Leave” by is licensed under a license. “Happening for Lulu” by is licensed under a license. “Soldier’s Story” by is licensed under a license. “Be Nice” by is licensed under a license. “Fireworks” by is licensed under a license. “Faster, Sons of Vengeance, Faster!” by is licensed under a license. “Changing Moment (ID 1651)” by is licensed under a license. Transcript: A quick warning, this episode discusses sexual abuse. During the quarantine, I received an anonymous letter from a former student that had since graduated. After pleasantries, the note says “I’m writing you now to thank you for things that you never knew you did when I was your student.” And then they go on to explain that though I would not have known this, they had been sexually abused by their father, and they had just found the strength to tell someone, cut ties, and start the healing process. They said that my class was a space that made them feel safe, heard, and respected. They wrote that I helped them quote “understand that there are good men, ones that deserve to be fathers.” end quote They were intentional in saying that they didn’t know if I would figure out who they were, but regardless, they wanted to thank me and let me know that I played a part in helping them get through the abuse. Every time I read this letter, it breaks me. I hate that this student had to go through this. I hate their father. I am humbled by the fact that I could be a source of support for this student, and I hope so badly that they can heal. No kid should ever have to experience this, but they do, and because they do, they need adults, teachers, in their lives that can support them, even if those adults are unaware of that support. We need teachers who are themselves supported and happy and in a space that values them, so that they can be as wholly present as possible for students. But at this moment in time, many teachers, so of the people that students need most, don’t want to teach anymore. And that fact is devastating. We’re at the end of this series. We’ve explored a variety of things contributing to teachers leaving the profession - feelings of being devalued, a lack of autonomy, struggles with mental health. We’ve looked at why teachers might be treated the way they have been, from pop-cultural stereotypes to an odd historical inheritance …to having unclear expectations of what education is for. And we’ve even looked at some solutions and where they come from. All of this to make sense of why teachers might be leaving, and to draw attention to the fact that without authentic and relevant change that is not the burden of teachers, teachers will keep leaving. Today, we will hear teachers who left education explain how their lives are now, and we will explore some resources available to teachers who are looking to leave education. And from what I’ve heard through interviews and people reaching out to me because of this podcast, a vast majority of teachers that have left the classroom are much happier. So, if nothing from this season has convinced you that we need to do something to keep teachers in education and something real, maybe this episode will. I am not saying this as a threat, but from the perspective of a realist. Think of it as a natural consequence. Refuse to address and take genuine action to keep teachers, or they will find their way out of education because they can. And in this present moment, they will likely be happier for it. This is the finale to Those Who Can’t Teach Anymore, a 7-part podcast series exploring why teachers are leaving education and what can be done to stop the exodus. I’m Charles Fournier. Here is part 7: “Those Who Can’t Teach Anymore” Camile Lofters reached out to me in the early stages of this project. Camile was a high school English and journalism teacher in south Florida. She left teaching after 15 years in the classroom , and she was one of those people that felt destined to be in the classroom. Camile Lofters: I feel like teaching was in my blood. My mom was an early childhood education major and taught preschool, and, you know, lower elementary school. So I mean, I grew up watching her, and wanting to emulate her. So I would line up my stuffed animals and like, I had a little pointer, and I would teach them things. And when I graduated, I was so excited to start teaching that it was like everything to me. But like most of the people that shared their stories throughout this podcast, Camile left. And even though she is from Florida and most of the other folks I’ve spoken with are from Wyoming and the west, Camile’s reasons for leaving were the same. She pointed to not being trusted or seen as an expert, to politicians that oversteps their role in education, to low pay, to being undervalued, and the list goes on. And like the other teachers, Camile still values education. Camile Lofters: Even though I did leave the profession, I still love teaching, and I still think it's one of the greatest professions. But as we all know, in our country, education system is a little broken, maybe it's a lot broken is a better way to say it. So, I feel like when the pandemic happened, it sort of broke everything wide open forever for a lot of people. I mean, it's not like it's just me. We haven’t addressed the pandemic much throughout this series. Not because the pandemic didn’t have a significant impact on teachers deciding to leave, but because the reasons teachers are leaving didn’t start with the pandemic.The pandemic forced teachers to reflect on what they’re willing or not willing to accept. Camile reflected on whether she could teach for another two decades. Camile Lofters: And the answer used to be yes, I'm going to teach until I’m 60. And when it started to become like I don’t know, and then it was like, definitely not. And I was like, this means I need to do something else. You know, if I'm feeling that way, it's not fair to myself, my family, but also I think to the students. They deserve to have teachers that are really excited to be there. And yes, I am a good teacher and I could go back and still I think do a good job, but I just feel like mentally I would be falling apart and that's not that's not really fair to anybody. You’ve heard this throughout the series. Many teachers are leaving because they know that they aren’t doing their job as well as they want to, so they leave. The pandemic contributed to this. More teachers thought about what they could and couldn’t do anymore. The pandemic made the job more difficult. Skepticism of teachers rose, student and parent behaviors became worse, everyone’s mental health seemed to get worse, and more expectations were placed on teachers. Teachers know this, but when more is put on a teacher’s plate, it’s usually not taken off. Camile felt this, and she also had a daughter in the middle of it all. Camile Lofters: That 2020-2021 school year was just really, really difficult. And so then by the time my daughter was born, you know, in June 2021, I was like, No, this is this, I gotta find something else. So she started the process of looking for something that she could transition into. And she was looking for something that would allow for more financial opportunities. On top of having a daughter, feeling all of the frustrations and stressors of teaching and the impact of the pandemic, Camile wanted to be paid better. Camile Lofters: Pay was a big part of it. It's really disheartening to work so hard for so long and never see an increase in your salary. I graduated from college with all my friends, we were all making about the same amount of money. And now most of them are making double, if not triple you. You know what I'm making. I worked really hard to be a good teacher and constantly doing professional development and looking for new strategies. And so I think it's disheartening to not have that come with any sort of raise and compensation. So I will say that that was definitely a factor when I realized that if you account for inflation, I had basically never gotten a raise, like ever. And her only prospect for a raise was to become an administrator, despite all of the extra work she’d done like designing curriculums. Camile Lofters: And I hate when people say, “Well, you didn't go into teaching for the money.” Well, of course I didn't, but I'm a human being that needs to survive, I have a family and I would like to be able to provide for them. Pay matters, so Camile left teaching and transitioned into a new career where she feels better about the pay. Camile Lofters: So, I've been making a little bit more money, not a ton, but a little bit, and it does matter to me, because there is the potential for me to make more money. In my job, I have the potential to earn more, And there's a lot of room for growth. And so that was very appealing to me, to actually be in a position where there could be more upward movement in my salary. Camile acknowledges that she now has to pay her own health insurance which means her take home pay is about equal to what she was making as a teacher, but that doesn’t matter to her. Camile Lofters: I’m so much happier that it feels different. It feels like I'm making more money. And her transition out of education allows her to continue working with kids, which is something many teachers point to when deciding whether or not they will leave. Camile Lofters: I am the photography manager and sales representative for a school photography company, I was a yearbook teacher for eight years. So the company I work for, actually, I used to be like, a customer of theirs, like I was the teacher, and they were my photography company. And her transition to her new job has been pretty smooth. Camile Lofters: And I love it. It's a great job for me. I use a lot of skills that I already had as a teacher. I already knew part of the business because I was a customer, so I already know the customers want, what they need, that sort of thing. Part of what made her transition smooth was her willingness to learn. The people that I have talked with that successfully left education did so with humility, knowing that they had a lot of great skills, but that they also had a lot to learn. Camile Lofters: So learning the business side of things, I am literally always just sitting in my boss's office whenever possible, just like listening to him talk about the business, because it's just mind blowing to learn. Camile Lofters: And I'm still learning because obviously our company's since it's a school photography company, we follow the school year, and each phase of the school year brings something different. But yeah, I'm really excited about it. I think it's cool to always be learning something new. So Camile left teaching, but she still gets to take part in the things that she enjoyed about teaching. Camile Lofters: And I get to work with teenagers all day long at a really exciting time in their lives. They're doing, you know, they're seeing your pictures and their, or their school pictures. And they're usually pretty excited about that. So just making them feel good. You know, like, establishing a rapport with a teenager is hard for a lot of people. It's not hard for me. It's something I did all day long. So it's been really cool to use my teaching skills in a new way. But the things that are different about education are well worth it. Camile Lofters: I have just a lot better work life balance, now. So my schedule is flexible. If I need to leave early one day, I can just schedule to have an early day or come later or you know, be closer or farther away from home. So that's really nice. I also get to actually speak to adults during the day, which is great. That's always nice. You know, really silly things like I can use the bathroom whenever I want to. And the common rebuttal for why teachers shouldn’t complain about their jobs, you know, summers off, Camile doesn’t mind not having her summers off. Camile Lofters: There have been several people still to this day, who are like, “Oh, well, don't you miss having the summer off?” and different kinds of things like that. And I think at the end of the day, having a summer off is great, but if you feel like you're only living your life in those two months of summer vacation, and then the rest of the year, you're miserable, then like, what good is that? She has more financial opportunities and she feels happier. And contrary to any stereotypes, her leaving education doesn’t mean that she hates kids or that she is anti-education. She has this to say to teachers who are struggling with that aspect of leaving education. Camile Lofters: So I would just say that and that, if you are thinking about leaving the classroom, that doesn't make you a bad teacher. That it's normal to have those thoughts, and that's okay. Camile advocates for teachers as much as she can, and she feels like being outside of the classroom gives her some opportunities to be a little more vocal - especially in Florida where teachers have been egregiously attacked through politically charged legislation like the don’t say gay bill, the stop woke act, the overall rejection of AP African American history, and sadly the list goes on. She uses her social media platform to share her voice. Camile’s sense of relief and happiness upon leaving education is not unique. This shouldn’t be the case. And teachers aren’t quitting to sit around, they are going into other careers, which may make it very difficult to lure them back to the classroom. If we want teachers to stay in education, education needs to be more appealing than the other options available to them. Jaye Wacker, who we heard from in the first episode, left teaching after being in the classroom for three decades. He is now a Senior Public Information Officer at the Wyoming Department of Administration and Information. Like Camile, Wacker feels like life is better. Jaye Wacker: I work for a director, who is one of the themes in Administration and Information that she keeps hammering is work life balance. And I don't feel like teachers have work-life balance in the slightest. Well, yeah, it's balanced, but it's balanced one way you know it. And that's tragic. That's no way to live. It's no way to draw great people into the profession. There has to be a balance. There has to be a…there's something more than the paycheck. Wacker uses the portrait of a single day to explain how his life is different since he left teaching. Jaye Wacker: Sundays, I was the worst person to be around, hard to be around. And whether I was working on my lesson plans for the week or trying to devise something, or even just putting it off, because I didn't want to deal with it. Waiting until Hannah was in bed Sunday night, and then sitting right there at the end of that dining room table, with my books, holding back the curtains and trying to figure out what's the best way to reach and meet the GVC. As a reminder, the GVC, or Guaranteed and Viable Curriculum, is the effort to standardize education, and acts like a middle-man to the Common Core Standards. So, for Jaye, his quality of life on Sundays is better because he isn’t having to use Sundays to prepare for the week. He doesn’t get those Sunday Scaries anymore. Jaye Wacker: I can do whatever, and then just go to work the next day. I go to work, and the sun's up. I can't even begin to tell you how many times I've sat in the room and watch the sunrise. And like Camile, losing out on summers wasn’t a big deal, contrary to the cultural stereotype that teachers only work for the summer. Jaye Wacker: I'm a firm believer that June, July and August are not the three best reasons to be a teacher. In fact, they're probably the three worst because people who think they're the three best, they're miserable nine months out of the year. And so I really kind of stressed about how am I going to deal with summer. And last year, I didn't even notice. I didn't even notice. And this year, the only thing I know is that, oh, my daughter's not in school anymore. And I just go to work and it's chill, and I work with good people. And I used to say teachers worked 12 months and nine. It's more. Wacker misses some of the people, he misses the kids, he misses the conversations, he misses the books, but he doesn’t miss how he felt. He still has some leftover traces of being a teacher ingrained in him. Jaye Wacker: If somebody's in my office, and we're just having a conversation. I feel a little bit of panic. I literally do. Because I have that feeling like I need to be doing something else. I don't miss the pressure. It is and it's gotten geometrically more pressurized in the last few years. I don't miss that a bit. I and that's part of what I couldn't take any more. I couldn't take the pressure anymore The pressure and stress Wacker was feeling was keeping him from the people that matter most to him. Now he gets to spend more quality time with them. Another aspect of why teachers left teaching was being trusted. For Stephanie Reese, the opportunity to make more money and to feel respected was huge in why she changed careers. We’ve heard from Stephanie several times over the course of this podcast. She was a PE teacher and she left teaching after eight years. She is now the general manager at Black Tooth Brewing Company in Cheyenne, Wyoming. Stephanie Reese: I have a fantastic boss, but I'm basically my own boss, because I'm here in Cheyenne. And they're up in Sheridan. So I'm trusted to make decisions. And I don't have anybody breathing down my back. And, you know, I think the trust is the biggest thing. With that trust, comes a feeling of being valued, which equates to getting paid better. Stephanie Reese: When my boss offered me stock in the company, like having a part of something, being a part of something because you earned it, and being promoted like that was definitely like, Oh, this is not education. And yeah, I mean, I'm definitely surprised each day. I'm like, wow, this is so much better than each day because you're just not enduring the shit that goes along with everything, like you can actually do your job. Right? So many more distractions when you teach or, like expectations, or having to juggle this, this and this, or do all of this without any support. And you're expected to do this. And so with this job, like, I can just do my job. It's a really good feeling. And if this isn’t clear, Stephanie’s quality of life is much better. Not only does she feel satisfied in her work, she is making more money than she did as a teacher. This has been a theme, many of the people that talk about a pay increase also express a feeling of being valued more in their new jobs. Stephanie explains that her job is not without stress, but it feels different. Stephanie Reese: I can tell, okay, all this work I'm putting in the stress is worth it, because we're making money. And so I love that aspect of it. Teaching in a lot of ways is you give... /episode/index/show/59610576-d341-4b91-863b-94a6293ce4d3/id/26005719

6: Those Who Stay 02/08/2023

6: Those Who Stay The first step to solving the problem of teacher attrition is to admit that there is a problem. Some groups have already taken this step, and they are listening to teachers in order to create solutions that will retain teachers. These programs make a big difference, but their approach isn’t the norm. In this episode, we hear about successful efforts to keep teachers in education, and we’ll ask the question: Who should have the responsibility of keeping teachers in education? Music: Theme Song By “Sunlight” by is licensed under a license. “I’m Fat” by is licensed under a license. “Keep The Prices Down” by is licensed under a license. “Kaptan Hayvanlar Alemi” by is licensed under a license. “Grab a Bargain” by is licensed under a license. “Place on my Bonfire” by is licensed under a license. “Your Paradigm Dial” by is licensed under a license. Transcipt My third grade teacher had a phone booth in his classroom. It was a full size, glass booth that was mostly sound-proof. The phone booth was the choice place to spend any indoor recess, but during class, it was used as the equivalent of a time-out. Our teacher was a mustachioed man who called his facial hair his “cookie duster” and wore tinted-glasses and thick collared polyester shirts, If a student was misbehaving, he would point that student to the phone booth, and that’s where the student would remain for the rest of the lesson. Discipline reigned in his class. I’m not sure if this is a quality of 3rd grade teachers in general, but both of the 3rd grade teachers at my school at the time were strict, and my parents loved it. I appreciate some of it now, but at the time I thought it was downright oppressive - especially disciplining groups of kids together, which I’m still not a fan of. There was a week-stretch in particular where our class lost out on several recesses because a core group of kids were acting out. I don’t remember what they were doing, but I remember the sinking feeling of losing out on the chance to play tetherball or football or to climb on those tractor tires that were half buried in the ground and always had a faint smell of urine. We were stuck indoors. I complained to my dad about the injustice when he picked me up from school. I ranted about inequity and being punished for something I didn’t do. And I remember his response clearly. He asked me if I was part of the problem or part of the solution. He had to explain what “solution”meant, and then he told me that I needed to think about whether I was helping or hurting the situation. I realized that even if I wasn’t doing anything wrong, I still might not be part of the solution. Like a whole gaggle of my parents’ other truisms that I didn’t want to hear at the time, this has stuck with me. We’ve spent the last 5 episodes looking at what factors, what problems, might be contributing to teachers leaving education. Over half of all teachers are considering leaving the profession, but there are teachers who are staying, some of them stay thanks to efforts made by organizations to convince teachers to remain in education. So, today, we’re going to think about solutions that keep brilliant teachers in education, but we’ll also ask the question, whose responsibility is it to keep teachers in education? This is Those Who Can’t Teach Anymore, a 7-part podcast series exploring why teachers are leaving education and what can be done to stop the exodus. I’m Charles Fournier. Here is part 6: “Those Who Stay” Elizabeth Smith: I brought mimosas. I hope you don't mind. I met Elizabeth on the back patio of the Middle Fork restaurant in Lander, Wyoming. If her voice sounds familiar, it’s because we heard from her earlier in the series. She wore a blue dress with flower print and she carried a binder and a tote bag. The binder had a copy of her research thesis about retention of teachers on reservations and from the bag she pulled two flute champagne glasses, a jug of orange juice, and a bottle of champagne. Elizabeth is a veteran teacher, she loves teaching, and part of why she loves it might have to do some with her background. As we drank mimosas under the shade of a tree, she told me about her unique upbringing. Elizabeth Smith: I have a very, very crazy back story. I was raised in a cult. And I dropped out of school in seventh grade. And I never went to high school. And we were raised in a situation in which we didn't have television or outside influence. So I was very isolated and programmed to believe a certain way. And so I got my GED when I was 19, the same year, I got my driver's license, I ran away from home twice, and was successfully out of the house and the religion, the high control, the second time that I left, and so my understanding of educators is completely different. A quality of early American education that we learned about in the second episode was the idea that teachers would be taught in the education system themselves and so the education hierarchy would be ingrained into them – it was almost a pre-teacher training. Elizabeth didn’t go to public school, so some of these stereotypical expectations aren’t perpetuated in her teaching practice, which might contribute to why she loves it. Elizabeth Smith: I love what I do. I love teaching, I have high respect for myself, in the work that I do. I know the mistakes that I make, in reflection, for the most part, I'm sure there's some that I'm unaware of, but I enjoy helping people understand themselves, you know, because it's been a huge chore of mine to be able to get to the point where I have undone all the programming that I have experienced in life. And because of her youth, she was drawn to a sense of spirituality she found in teaching. Elizabeth Smith: Coming from a really hardcore, high control, religious background. I feel like I suffered spiritual abuse. And so disconnected me from myself, in a lot of ways. And so my whole life, like I told you has been spent trying to figure out who I am. And one of the things in teaching that you'll, especially if you read my research, you'll see that the spiritual connection with making relationships with other people and knowing that what you're doing is valued is a big part of spirituality. The research Elizabeth points to was tied to her Masters Thesis. She focused on why teachers stay, especially non-native teachers, in reservation schools. What Elizabeth found is that those who stay feel a sense of acceptance, a sense of appreciation that what they bring to a community is valuable. And this is why Elizabeth stays too. She feels like what she does matters. She feels a connection to her students and, for the most part, she feels valued as a teacher. Elizabeth Smith: I've only taught on reservation schools. So I've only taught in Indian country and there is a cultural perception from Native communities that really value teachers. So that's one of the reasons why non-native teachers decided to stay and have such longevity in reservation country because there is an old school respect for teachers. I want to be transparent here. Elizabeth isn’t totally satisfied with her job - we’re drinking mimosas because she just finished up the school day and wanted to wind down. During our conversation, Elizabeth pointed out her frustrations, which echo many of the frustrations that we’ve heard in this podcast. She explained situations where she felt devalued or not listened to or stretched thin. She admitted that after teaching for 20 years, the thought of leaving education has crossed her mind, but she said that as long as this year feels like things are getting better, she plans on staying in education. And this is worth pointing out - even teachers that are staying in education by choice have frustrations. I say by choice because there are the teachers that feel stuck because they are close to retirement, need the insurance, or need the immediate income. Part of what’s keeping Elizabeth, even when she has frustrations, is the fact that she feels like what she does matters and that she feels valued in her community. Those things might seem small, but we’re at a point where many teachers are frustrated and feel neither value nor purpose. I have felt that. The past few years especially - it didn’t feel like anything I did in my classroom mattered, and too often when I met someone new and told them I was a teacher, they’d tell me a story about how bad their kid’s teachers were or how they had chewed out some teacher for something that, when they explained it to me, was just a terrible reason. They acted righteous and I felt devalued by association. What picked me up was this project - the one that you’re listening to right now. A podcast that explores why teachers were leaving education was a thought I have talked with my wife about since she left teaching, but I never pursued it. Not until I saw and applied for a Fund for Teachers Fellowship, which is a grant for teachers who want to create their own form of professional development. This seems small, but it’s kind of mind-blowing and has made a world of difference for me. Stephanie Ascherl: Teachers don't usually get a lot of choice. Professional development is determined for them, it's very top down. This is Stephanie Ascherl, she is the Chief of Staff at Fund for Teachers, and she’s worked for the organization going on 18 years. Stephanie Ascherl: What's unique about Fund For Teachers is that we empower the teacher to tell us, no one at Fund for Teachers will ever tell you what you should do to be a better teacher because we really trust that you know yourself and your students better than anybody. Stephanie was not a teacher herself though she wanted to be a teacher when she was younger. Stephanie Ascherl: I wanted to be a teacher until I was in high school. As you can tell I’m soft spoken. And I had a teacher who just was like, You're gonna have to learn how to talk a little bit louder, or find another way to give back. When she started with Fund for Teachers, she really loved it, and I can see why. What stands out about Fund for Teachers as an organization is that they listen to teachers. Even though Stephanie wasn’t a teacher herself, she does exactly what we asked of legislators last episode, she, and the rest of her organization trust educators. Stephanie Ascherl: I think, you know, here in Houston, we see think tanks, you know, may have a conversation with a group of teachers that then they take what they think they heard to the state legislator who then makes policy change, but why can't the teacher just talk directly to the legislature, like there's, we don't need all these middlemen, we need to invite teachers to the conversation and to participate actively in and with the people who are making decisions, and maybe how we're choosing the people who make decisions also needs to be looked at. Fund for Teachers is not a government organization. They are a non-profit, and Stephanie acknowledges they can’t be the saviors of the American Educational system all on their own, but she knows that they are at least making a difference. Stephanie Ascherl: I'm not naive, I know, there's bigger problems that we don't have control over. But I do hope that the, you know, we award about 350 to 400 teachers a year that those 300 to 400, people feel like they can do it another year, that they can keep moving forward, not just for their students, because that's what we hear so often is I don't want to leave the kids but that we really make them feel like they can do this for themselves. And that there are people that care, there are people that are invested. I felt this tremendously. This fellowship did so much to make me feel valued, that there was someone out there who was rooting for teachers, and it makes a difference in teachers wanting to continue teaching - even if it’s just for one more year. Stephanie Ascherl: In a very small study we did regionally that teachers who received Fund for Teachers, fellowships are more likely to stay in the classroom than their counterparts who did not receive a fellowship. And this study is incomplete. But it also showed that teachers who just applied so people who could feel like there is opportunity, there is hope. And even just thinking about their practice, maybe in a different way. That even they stayed a little bit longer. Even with their positive impact, Stephanie pointed out that people in academics or other educational bodies have been somewhat dismissive of what Fund for Teachers is doing for educators. Stephanie Ascherl: Somebody referred to us, like as a warm hug once and I was like, You know what, I don't even care because we are a hug, and people need a hug. And people need that encouragement. And that's not going to make everyone happy. But I care about those three or 400 people I interact with a year, and that's really my priority. For a teacher feeling burned out and devalued, a hug is pretty dang nice. I needed that acknowledgement that I am a professional and enough of an expert to recognize what I need to be happy and successful in the classroom for another year. Policymakers, School Boards, Districts! Take note! When trying to solve the problem of teacher attrition, think WWFFTD. What would Fund for Teachers Do? Start by listening to teachers, let them decide what they need, and be encouraging and supportive - teachers need both a metaphorical and literal hug right now. Acknowledgement is validating, and it gets at the heart of what Fund for Teachers wants to do despite how teachers are being treated across the country. As we’ve heard before, teachers haven’t been treated like professionals. Stephanie thinks it is in part because non-educators don’t want to think about it. Stephanie Ascherl: I just think that, generally, as a society, we choose not to understand what happens in schools. Stephanie Ascherl: People put their blinders on. And they don't want to acknowledge that there is an issue that needs to be solved. And they don't want to know any different because then you'd have to take action. When there's this kind of like, monolithic, almost problem. It's almost like you just don't know where to begin to help. And so you don't know what to do. And then you're almost frozen to inaction. For Stephanie, for Fund for Teachers, this shift towards action and treating teachers as professionals to be valued begins with valuing education, which means inviting teachers to the table when decisions about education are being made. They are doing this by awarding grants for projects that are created by teachers. To get teachers feeling invested, they need to be involved, they need to be invested in. Stephanie Ascherl: Fund For Teachers, invests in teachers, and we invest in their self designed professional development. Why should we treat teachers any different than any other professional. If I want to go learn more about marketing, or how to engage my board or things like that, I can do that. And why would we deprive teachers of that opportunity? And districts aren't meeting that need? And that's where fund for teachers kind of comes in? Along with giving teachers the resources and freedom to design professional development that is individualized, Fund For Teachers also puts a lot of faith in what teachers get out of the fellowship. Remember a few episodes back when we talked about authentic experiences feeling superficial once they are measured? A part of why Fund for Teachers helps keep teachers in education and excited about learning is because they remove the barriers that teachers typically run into: like a lack of autonomy, feeling devalued, and being held to inauthentic standards Stephanie Ascherl: We're not really into data. So we're not some we're not, we're very different from a lot of organizations that, you know, while we're trying to get there, it's never really been about improving test scores. It's really about what your problem is today, and how we can help you solve it. And so when we talk about impact, it can come in many forms is a teacher feeling renewed, and recognized for their efforts, and they want to stay in the classroom for another year. That then it kind of morphs into students seeing what could happen if I had my own agency, if I took control of my learning, what kind of change could I make in my community or my, just my school or my life. So it has this this wide like spectrum of benefits. And they're really dependent on the teacher themselves in the project that they did. In simpler terms, Stephanie said their organization wants teachers to feel good about themselves, which is an absolute need for teachers at the moment. Stephanie Ascherl: But I think holistically as an organization, we want teachers to walk away feeling trusted, respected, and encouraged because we know they're not getting that. I’m proof - this approach works. But again, they're a small non-profit organization. What Fund for Teachers is doing, is not a national solution to teacher attrition on their own, but it could serve as a model. And Stephanie hopes that’s what happens. Stephanie Ascherl: I really look forward to the day that Fund for Teachers doesn't have to exist, because that would mean that teachers are getting the resources they need. And professional development that is meaningful and authentic is just happening. It's not this really unique thing, because Fund for Teachers is the only organization in the country that allows teachers to design their own professional development. But until schools have the funding and willingness to give teachers the freedom for authentic teacher-driven professional development, Fund For Teachers will be here, and they can be a spark or a lifeline for teachers that want to stay. And even if they’re that warm hug for teachers, they’re a warm hug that offers resources too. Here’s what Stephanie has to say to teachers that might need that something extra to keep their morale up and to keep their interest in teaching. Stephanie Ascherl: We're offering you up to $5,000 an individual to do something during the summer that you know is going to make you a better teacher. And that's going to have a great the greatest impact on your students and school community. And we'd really encourage you to take advantage of that. Not only for yourself, but for your students. As Stephanie pointed out, the fellowship gives teachers a ton of freedom - more than I’ve ever experienced as a high school teacher. I got to choose what I wanted to do. So, I focused on research, writing, and activism through podcasting, so that I could create authentic units tied to each of those things back to my classroom. And it has been an amazing experience. It feels so good to be trusted as an expert and a professional. So much so, that I got emotional when I told Stephanie this. The start of this year was the best I have felt coming back to school in several years. I had a sense of confidence and purpose that are a direct result of this fellowship. Other teachers who have received their own fellowships reported similar reactions. They were thrilled to be treated like professionals. And these kinds of experiences can translate to effectiveness in the classroom when teachers are trusted to apply what they’ve learned into the classroom. When teachers feel confident and trusted and excited about what they do, that has a direct result on the experiences of students. Lindsey Freeman, a former High School Agriculture Teacher, has a great example of the impact teachers can have on students when they feel good about what... /episode/index/show/59610576-d341-4b91-863b-94a6293ce4d3/id/25866084

5: Education has a Tourist Problem 01/25/2023

5: Education has a Tourist Problem Imagine that you are hiring a new English teacher. None of the people who apply have any of the qualifications to teach English. No teaching degree. No English degree. No experience in the classroom. Would you hire any of them? Probably not. Now here is the irony. Many of the people making curricular and legislative decisions about education don’t have the qualifications to be hired within education. This is a problem. In this episode, we hear how standardization, high-stakes testing, and policy decisions made by non-educators may be contributing to teachers’ decisions to leave education. Music: Theme Song By “So Stark (You’re a Skyscraper” by is licensed under a license. “Cat and Mouse” by is licensed under a license. “Space (Outro)” by is licensed under a license. “Home Fire” by is licensed under a license. “Press Conference” by is licensed under a license. “Things Change” by is in the . “Living Life” by is licensed under a license. “Boulevard St Germain” by is licensed under a license. “Hungaria” by is licensed under a license. “Business Getaway ” by is licensed under a license. Transcript: I used to listen to the Dixie Chicks’s song “Wide Open Spaces” before wrestling matches because I would get too wound up. It helped me slow down my breathing and relax. In junior high and high school, I was fixated on winning and losing. I’d get a pit in my stomach, psyche myself up and out, all to my detriment. I was terrified of failing, of being a disappointment or an embarrassment. Then I went to college. I walked-on to the University of Wyoming’s wrestling team. During my meeting with Steve Suder, the head coach, he told me, “You know, you’ll be walking into a room with a bunch of state champs. Are you worried about that?” I told him, “No, I’m not” because those were the guys that I wanted to be wrestling against. I was a two-time state placer and I had nothing to lose. Suder said, “Good,” and then told me that he never won state either, but he ended up being an All-American for the University of Wyoming, so there was hope for me. During our conversation, in between adjusting this chewed up yellow cushion he used as a back support, he told me that I was like the pretty girl’s funny friend at a party. I’m not someone he noticed right off the bat, but once he got to know me, he was happy to have me around. He meant this in the best way possible, and I didn’t mind. I made the team, worked my butt off, won some matches, and lost more than I won. And I hate losing, but it felt different. I was excited to be wrestling, not nervous. Suder made it clear that his expectations were low, but he was happy to have me. I focused on gaining experience and the process and growing as a wrestler and a person. And I got to wrestle a guy named Brent Metcalf, who is the only person I wrestled that had a documentary made about him. When someone asked Metcalf why he didn’t celebrate wins, he said, “I don't want to give my opponent the satisfaction of watching me celebrate, which would make it look like a big deal that I beat him.” This dude is a monster. It was an extraordinarily humbling match. I had no control of my own body - his fingers were in my mouth at one point, but I learned what it was like to wrestle the best. It was eye-opening. My tenure as a collegiate wrestler only lasted that year,but I remained in contact with Coach Suder off and on until his passing in 2019. And I had changed. My priorities shifted from valuing product to process. When I became an assistant high school wrestling coach, the head coach had also wrestled for Coach Suder, and so we continued his tradition of emphasizing process. And what I noticed is that the wrestlers felt less pressure. They only tried being better today than they were yesterday. And when they have that mindset, success, though not guaranteed, is more likely. They are wrestling to compete and to score points. And even if they don’t have success, they do the best they can do at that moment, and that’s always worth being proud of. In education, we focus on the product, on assessment. There is an obsession with passing or failing and we seem to have forgotten the value of process, which is where many teachers live. So today, we are going to look at how a structure of education that values standardized assessments could be contributing to teachers deciding to leave the profession, and because some of the frustrations with standardized assessment is a federal issue, which is too much to address here, we’ll explore a possible solution to the high stakes assessment issue in Wyoming, which would hopefully keep teachers in education. This is Those Who Can’t Teach Anymore, a 7-part podcast series exploring why teachers are leaving education and what can be done to stop the exodus. I’m Charles Fournier. Here is part 5: “Education has a Tourist Problem” Mark Perkins: I do think that for a lot of teachers who are leaving, and this is speculative, but I think it's reasonable to assume that if you alleviated some of the assessment requirements within their schools, their satisfaction would increase. I don't think that that's a jump. This is Mark Perkins, he is an Assistant Professor of Education Research Methods at the University of Wyoming and he is talking about the survey results he gathered about teacher attrition in Wyoming. So many teachers, both teachers leaving and teachers staying, reported that they were not happy with assessments. As we’ve heard from teachers that left teaching, there wasn’t one thing that pushed them out of teaching. It was the layering of factors. And if we want to keep more teachers from leaving, it would be worth trying to address some of the most consistent factors. Aside from overall well-being and feeling supported, assessment is one the most consistent teacher frustrations. Now before we get into what specifically teachers don’t like about assessment, I think it’s important to think about why education currently has assessments, and this goes back to what we talked about last episode: the purpose of education and needing to be able to measure success for whatever that purpose is. Simply put, we need to reflect on what we want kids to know and how we can measure what they know. Mark explains. Mark Perkins: And so what does school success really look like? That sounds like an interesting, easy question. It's like, Well, kids know how to do math. Well, okay. What does that look like? Well, they can add, subtract, divide. All right. So what? When you start drilling into the actual requirements to exist and inhabit the world, the factors become much more latent than what we measure. But we fixated ourselves purely on content. During our conversation, Mark explained that there are a ton of other things that we want for students: self-awareness, identity development, civic consciousness, the ability to have some gumption and as Mark phrased it, drag a horse through the mud. But none of those qualities are easy to measure, which means it’s more difficult to measure a teacher’s overall effectiveness. This brings us back to the focus on content. Mark Perkins: But all of the focus has been on reading math, science and somewhat government. How does a teacher who navigates let's call it the multivariate universe of being an educator. How do you evaluate teaching for the holistic aspects of the job? While we don't? It would be difficult to assess students and teachers in the Multivariate Universe of education, as Mark puts it, so we assess a few content areas, and only a few things in those content areas. Many mission statements want to acknowledge the whole student, but we only assess a fraction of the student. For example, I have a grant application unit for my sophomores. They do research and write a grant to receive hypothetical funding that they can use to address a real problem within our community. I don’t limit students on what kinds of problems they want to address, so students have looked at drug use or homelessness or access to sports or social justice issues. When students submit their grant applications, we go through a selection process. Students read each other's grants anonymously and identify ones that meet all of the grant requirements and would, in their minds, best serve our community. By the end of the process, all of my classes vote on the one grant that should receive the hypothetical funding. Every year I’ve done this, the grants that make the final vote, the ones that all of my students have pushed forward, are philanthropic and genuinely kind. And I tell my students this, usually as I tear up, that this project gives me hope for the future because through their research, writing, discussions, and voting, they prove that they are empathetic humans. I learn much more about what my students can do through this project than any standardized assessment that I’ve been required to administer. And this is a frustration echoed by teacher after teacher. If the thing that is used to reflect a district’s success is a bubble-sheet test, that can feel pretty disheartening. Because from the teachers’ perspective, the results of those tests, the results that are reported in the paper and raise community questions like, “What are they even teaching kids in school?” those tests lack validity. They’re not the best way to measure whether the kids are alright, and Mark has questions about how well these tests show what kids know and how well they predict the future success of students, which is often how standardized tests are used. Several teachers pointed to the frustration that rather than getting students ready for life beyond high school or to be a life-long learner, they are forced to think that the be-all-end-all was the ACT or SAT. So engaging and authentic instruction gets replaced with teaching to a test. From Mark’s research and work in assessment, he sees that those assessments might not be worth the time we are putting towards them. Mark Perkins: And I have a suspicion that the predictive validity of these tests is not that good. And my suspicion comes from a very large body of literature that has looked at ACT/SAT versus high school grade point average and college level English math and general college grade point average. And yet, we invest an amount of time, pressure and money on these measures. What this means is that a grade point average, though imperfect in its own right, is a better predictor of future student success, whether they are college or career bound, than a standardized assessment. So what a teacher measures in their classroom is a better indicator of future success than what a standardized assessment shows. And if this isn’t enough, the amount students are tested is tremendous. This saps their energy and the energy of teachers who have to say, “I know this is the 573rd test, but you’ve got this.” Mark Perkins: We need to simplify and make assessment parsimonious. We do need to assess, but we certainly only need to take our temperature one time and evening, maybe two, when we have a cold because we know that it's going to say the same number every time. Measuring is not teaching. I want to reiterate what Mark just said - measuring is not teaching. I also want to clarify something about assessment. Teachers use informal assessments all of the time. And these are different than the high-stakes standardized assessments. Good teaching makes use of valid and authentic assessments often. When I was writing this episode, I got talking with my wife, Jennie, about assessment, because this is what you do when you marry another teacher. When she taught Advanced Biology, she created these elaborate group tests that students would get excited about. She used assessment as a learning tool. Her thought is that you don’t know what you know until you need to apply your knowledge. This is why I like the writing process because it's an act of creating and synthesizing. It’s a great form of learning. So the right assessment can be an informative learning tool, but the high stakes, fill-in-the-bubble, standardized assessments that teachers are frustrated with are not that. Mark explains that in order for those standardized assessments to be more valid, there should be some adjustments. Mark Perkins: I think that we could more wisely use measurement, and education. I think one of the first problems with high stakes testing, is the fact that the majority of these tests have no impact on students. Now. You don't have to be draconian about it .But we make intelligent decisions based off of test scores. And we provide students with logical and rational incentives. From the teacher’s perspective, it’s hard to convince students that the tests matter because students don’t see how they are relevant to their lives. I try to give students some perspective before tests, like “No it doesn’t impact your grade, but if you go through and randomly click answers to finish early, the people who care about these tests will think you’re not learning anything, and then they will change curriculum and make you guys only learn from a textbook. Do you want that?” They usually shake their heads no, but that doesn’t mean they care any more about the test. Many teachers struggle to care about the tests as well. They don’t like the kind of standardization the tests force that does not allow for freedom in the classroom. Shane Atkinson, who we heard from in the first episode, left teaching after 13 years, and part of his decision to leave had to do with a lack of autonomy, some of which is tied to standardization. He pointed out that there are some districts that are so standardized, their days are mapped out in a binder. Shane Atkinson: This is what you do, then you do this, here's the question you should ask, have them fill out this worksheet. Day two… I think that's been done under the guise of equity. You don't want a kid in this classroom at this school to get a much different or better education than a teacher in the classroom next door. And I get that. So the idea is, well, to keep it equitable, they should be doing the same thing in both of those classrooms during that period of their US History class. Again, you're making decisions based on a minority and applying them to everybody, even if you're doing good work. That does everybody a disservice. The hope is that every kid will receive the same quality of education, so teachers are expected to stick to a curriculum, and in some instances, stick to a script. Much of the push towards national standardization came from the George W Bush Administration’s, 2001, No Child Left Behind Act. Jaye Wacker, whose voice we heard in the first episode and who quit teaching after 31 years, felt like the No Child Left Behind Act did a lot to undermine public trust in education. And it did it through standards. Jaye Wacker: No Child Left Behind set impossible targets. And basically year after year after year, it undermined public confidence in education. So then we needed the standards we needed to prove that we're doing something and yeah, I get it and I agree with it. You know, let's prove what we're doing. But this homogenization that we've talked about _____ High School in their curriculum, the most diverse curriculum in the state, and their kids are outperforming all these homogenized curriculums. Part of the impossible targets from the No Child Left Behind Act included a 100% proficiency rate for all students by 2014 - this meant that all students would be able to perform at grade level by 2014. This sounds nice, it is great rhetoric because of course no one wants to leave any kids behind, but this goal disregards so many variables. Many students are below grade level because of severe physical and or learning disabilities, and some will never make it to grade level. This doesn’t mean an effort to get all students to proficient is a bad goal, it’s a great goal, but not reaching this goal made it look like schools were failing. But the Act made it so schools were destined to fail. Though this Act has since been replaced, along with the unrealistic proficiency rates, its negative impact on the view of education is still present. Wacker also pointed to the reality that homogenized education doesn’t necessarily produce the best results. This is a pretty common view of standards. A teacher who wanted to remain anonymous said. "On a societal level, I think standards are the worst thing about education, and that’s a wide-open race... In my opinion, standards have lead to a homogenization that is stunting our growth, and solve problems that don’t exist. I don’t want education to be the same everywhere; I want to be a local restaurant, not a McDonald’s." For a more scientific point of view, my wife, Jennie, who left teaching after 7 years compares standardization to evolution. Jennica Fournier: So I think that standards homogenize things. So I don't know if your high school teacher was too afraid to teach you about evolution. But in general, we evolve best as a species if we have a really diverse gene pool. Basically if our education system was a gene pool, we’d be fucked. So from an evolutionary perspective, species that are standardized or homogenous, don’t survive adversity very well. Diversity is necessary for survival, and this includes diversity of curriculum. Jennie explained that we might struggle as a country to solve problems when everyone has been exposed to the same standardized curriculums. Jennie points out that there would be benefits to having students prioritize local issues. Jennica Fournier: So essentially we need kids to have a set of skills that match their environment at a local level in order to solve problems at their local level versus everyone in the US only knowing how to solve a generic set of problems. So many teachers see standards as an impossible bar to be reached that stifles their ability to be creative in their classrooms. Another part to the frustration with standardization and standardized assessments comes from the preparation required to take them and the pressure associated with the results. This is preparation and pressure that Mark, who discussed assessment earlier in this episode, says might be unnecessary. Molly Waterworth, who we heard from in a previous episode and who left teaching after 8 years, explains how frustrating that process of preparation was. Molly Waterworth: ACT/SAT prep, hated that. Totally hated it. And I never really figured out a way to do it super meaningfully. It just felt really meaningless because I just couldn't connect it to anything relevant. I just have to say to the kids, “I'm doing this so that you know the format of the test, and that's why we're doing this.” It's not fun. There's no way to have a discussion about whether or not somebody answered the correct question on ACT/SAT practice. My biggest motivator and the thing that brought me the most joy in teaching English was discussion and parsing through complexity and finding our collective way through something big and doing ACT/SAT prep just didn't ring that bell. Having to teach towards a test that doesn’t seem valuable, or to work towards standards for the sake of standards can leave teachers feeling powerless. I don’t know that anyone likes to feel powerless, to feel like their hands are tied behind their backs. Several teachers decided to leave education for jobs that gave them more autonomy, where they didn’t feel like they were jumping through hoops. I personally have never been... /episode/index/show/59610576-d341-4b91-863b-94a6293ce4d3/id/25720143

4: Why Are We Here? 01/11/2023

4: Why Are We Here? What’s the purpose of education? If you were to ask 10 different people this question, you may get 10 different answers. Education shouldn’t be this complex, but getting people to come to a consensus on anything right now is a challenge. This can be a problem. If teachers are expected to meet ambiguous goals, it can lead to burnout and frustration. In this episode, we hear how conflicting values in education may be contributing to teachers’ decisions to leave. Music: Theme Song By “Your Paradigm Dial” by is licensed under a license. “Room With a View” by is licensed under a license. “Business Getaway ” by is licensed under a license. “I Was Different” by is licensed under a license. “Sunny Afternoon” by is in the . Transcript: In the spring of 2016, Julian Saporiti, the guy that made the theme song for this podcast, asked me if I wanted to help him teach a summer road trip class for the University of Wyoming. It was easy to say yes, and this class ended up being one of the most influential educational experiences that I’ve ever had. Many of our students felt the same way. One of them, Sam Mallory, even talked about it in his graduation speech. Sam Mallory: Two years ago about this time of year, I was officially enrolled in the most influential course in my college experience And what made this class so significant likely had to do with the fact that we valued experience over product, which is a pretty non-traditional approach to a college course.. Our Syllabus included the following: Introductions: Julian Saporiti - Instructor /Guitarist. Charles Fournier Advisor/ Contemplation Mentor Books: Jack Kerouak’s On The Road and John Steinbeck’s Travels with Charlie Music: Songs and lyrics for sing-alongs Assignments: This list included items like helping a stranger, keeping a journal, and dancing in the moonlight Safety Measures: Information about bear country, how to react if lost, and how to create a cross-draft in your vehicle to fart rather than holding it in and risking feeling sick Traveling Recommendations for Women: A list focused on hygiene and affirmations created by wife, Jennie, who is a brilliant traveler but opted to stay home to plan for classes and manage our new ornery dog Lastly: “Be Amazed. Be Present.” We set out for two weeks across Wyoming, Idaho, and Montana. We danced to music by firelight in the Tetons under the Milky Way. I taught a pair of girls how to build a fire and when they asked what I thought about feminism, we read parts of The Vagina Monologues while lighting things on fire- one of those girls just wrote an award-winning screenplay. We observed the wildlife of national parks and saw some animals as well. I love this model for education. A kind of structure of non-structure that gives students a chance to grow autonomy and learn on the go. It was an experience, and the students were, if not changed, greatly impacted by that course. Julian and I were too. I tried to apply some of the elements of this course to my high school classes the next school year. I wanted kids to sit around a fire and have conversations, to worry less about grades or tests, and to focus on collaborative experiences that result in knowledge acquisition. Then the school year started. My fire pit idea was struck down, and the weight of standardized assessments, and everything else settled into place. My idealism was smothered by bureaucratic reality. There’s nothing quite like having your grand plan for the new school year get deflated by October. And this brings me to a question that I have continuously returned to as a teacher when this happens - What’s the point of education? Why are we here? The answer is ambiguous, and that uncertainty has led to conflict and confusion in education. So on the show today, we will ask “What’s the purpose of education?” Because if we can’t come to a consensus, teachers will continue to be expected to meet all of the competing thoughts about for what education is for. This is frustrating and adds to the stress and burnout that is leading teachers to find careers that might have more clearly defined parameters. This is Those Who Can’t Teach Anymore, a 7-part podcast series exploring why teachers are leaving education and what can be done to stop the exodus. I’m Charles Fournier. Here is part 4: “Why Are We Here?” Why we educate kids seems like it should be an easily answered question. But in my conversations with all levels of people involved in and around education, there wasn’t a clear consistent answer: Gary Martin:We have to work on their cognitive skills, you know, the critical thinking. Christy Chadwick: I think we have this idea that the purpose of education is to raise the next generation. But now, it sort of feels like a control factor. It feels like we're just controlling society through education. Caskey Russell: Fostering creativity in the students, critical thinking, removing kind of cultural blind spots, providing kind of an equal access all across the board, regardless of class race, getting an idea of community, American community as the kind of multicultural tapestry. Lindsey Freeman: I mean, that's a big part of it is workforce development. But just citizens, I mean, our government or politicians, like everything that our world needs to continue starts in the classroom. Jaye Wacker: Oh, my gosh, to protect a democratic republic. You know, pure and simple. We have to be educated, we have to be able to see through the bullshit, you know. Jennica Fournier: I thought my role was to teach students about chemistry and biology. But I think sometimes there's the expectation that you're babysitting them. or that you're keeping them safe. Shane Atkinson: I really tried to make it about the human connection. Elizabeth Smith: The purpose of education is to train our people to be worker bees, and to have the skills necessary to devote their entire lives towards the betterment of a few elite versus the greater good of all. It’s a lot, and that can be a problem. And there is a split between the ideal for what education is for and the reality that often stifles idealism. What we do know is that an educational system is inherently political because it reflects a country’s values. But what is valued in the US is continuously evolving and hard to pin down. Education started in the Americas as a way to teach kids how to be a part of their community. Then it started to shift with colonization. Education went from being morality focused - teaching literacy so that people could read the Bible. To Democracy and assimilation focused - forcing people to fit a standard ideal while emphasizing being an active citizen. To worker focused - creating industrialized systems to set people up to enter the workforce. To academic and standards focused - standardizing curriculum with the intent to compete on the global scale. But now, as demonstrated by the crazy political climate, what we value as a country is unclear, so what education should look like is also unclear. This lack of clarity is landing at the feet of teachers. And having a job with no clear and agreed upon objective is frustrating. Should teachers be focused on standardized tests, on learning, on mental health, on social health, on morality, on graduation rates? It’s not clear. But what is clear, is that having more of a shared value system would be valuable. A shared vision of what education is for. This would give teachers a clear objective that does not leave room for the petty arguments that are at the heart of so many educational dilemmas that are driving teachers out. I think we can get there. I spoke with people from all over the political spectrum for this podcast, and I am certain that we can get to a shared set of values. Juan Laden: Fundamentally, we need to make available within our teaching environment the understanding of other people and the possibilities for children to do so many things. Juan Laden sat down with me at the Lander Bake Shop. I had set up a microphone and taped up a sign with two questions: Why are teachers leaving Education? And What is the Purpose of Education? Because I don’t want to hassle folks, I sat quietly with my dirty chai and waited for people to come to me. Juan sidled over in a dutch cap, still chewing on a pastry, and starting answering questions before he even sat down. Juan Laden: I think they're good teachers, and that's why they're leaving. And so that's, are you recording this? Good, good? Juan is a lot of things. He has never been a public school teacher, but he was an experiential climbing instructor for the National Outdoor Leadership School or NOLS, he has traveled around and lived in Europe, he is knowledgeable in many things including plumbing and photography, and he knows a lot about pedagogy, this is a word educators use to talk about the method or practice of teaching: Juan Laden: And basically, I think the concept in America of education is filling a receptacle, and that is not what it's about. What Juan is referring to is also called the banking method - the idea is that a student’s educational experience is to get packed full of information, and that’s it. The banking method is not a popular pedagogy because it lacks a need for critical thinking and creativity and disregards the fact that students come to school already possessing knowledge. Many folks I spoke with push against this focus of education - to pack kids full of information. Juan agrees, and he explained that he thinks education should feel more like caving. Juan Laden: I'm a caver and talk about exploration. Most people don't like the idea of caving. I tell them they just had a difficult birth and never got over it. But you know, it's like, what a trip. You're exploring to the max. When you find a new cave…the dream of all cavers is to find the big, going cave, like, “Wow, there's a hole and you go in there, and it goes, and it goes, and there's more.” The idea that you're actually going where no one's been before, and that's what exploration is. It is a very deep drive in all humans to start out with - that curiosity, that emotional need to explore is driven by curiosity. Exploration was a tenet of that Road Trip class, and something I wish my high school classroom had more of now. We gave the students the freedom to choose where they wanted to go and how they wanted to get there. This is how we ended up at a hot spring called Chicken Soup in Idaho. Idaho wasn’t even in our original plan. The desire to explore was also an ideal across many of my conversations with teachers about what education is for - to help students jump into a metaphorical or literal cave. But the reality of teaching in a public school setting is that this ability to delve into curiosity is often devalued by what is required in the curriculum, community pressures, or a lack of resources. And the breadth of information that needs to be covered in a curriculum sometimes does not allow for depth or the chance for student exploration. I know of several projects that students would learn from and enjoy that were dead on arrival because they did not meet a curricular requirement or wouldn’t work for a specific standardized assessment. Such limits can take away from the joy of teaching and we’ve already seen that it can lead to teachers quitting. Exploration is something worth valuing, but based on how our system is currently structured, it isn’t valued enough. To get another idea about this question, we’re going to take a step back and start with what an educational jack-of-all-trades says about the purpose of education. I met up with Colby Gull at his office. Colby is the Managing Director for the trustees education initiative in the College of Education at the University of Wyoming. I asked him what the purpose of education is: Colby Gull: That is too complex of a question for your podcast, probably. This shouldn’t be the case. To me, this is part of the problem. I wish education could be simpler. For instance, for their final project during the road trip class, a pair of students designed and printed a t-shirt for the class. And they created a slogan for each person in the course. Mine read “Just trying to teach people not to be assholes.” And you know, that sums up my pedagogy pretty well. But Colby’s right. Our country’s current view of education is very complex. We can’t easily say that education should be for exploration like Juan says, or that education is trying to teach people not to be assholes like my t-shirt motto says. And our system might be too complex. We might be trying to layer in too much. And Colby, who was a teacher, principal, and superintendent, is aware of that. Here he is again with another answer that tries to better address the complexities for what he sees as the purpose of education: Colby Gull: I think we have to help our students to gain some basic knowledge, some basic skills around academic areas. We want them to understand how to read and to ask good questions. And we want them to understand some mathematical things and solve problems. But we also want to give them opportunities to explore new ideas and new ways of thinking about things and to analyze their own thinking, and , ”Why is my opinion that? Maybe it should be something else?” But I think the purpose of all of that is to help students to be prepared to go out and reach their potential, and to do great things and challenge thinking and make things better for themselves and for the people around them. Colby’s answers show his expertise. He is a guy that spends his life thinking about education and helping to train and retain teachers, and through all of his roles, he has had to deal with the bureaucracy and politics of education more intimately than most teachers ever do. What a teacher might value does not include the political nature of education And this is where the conflict comes in. Something like the Road Trip Class, is my ideal education structure because it also reflects my values. But that does not work in public education. Teacher values and idealism often collapse against the layers of the education system’s bureaucracy. And it’s disheartening. So we end up with statements like Colby’s second answer. It covers a lot but it is also pretty generalized. It sounds like an institutional response to the question, or a mission statement - their purpose of education proclamation. To compare, here is the mission statement from the United States Department of education: “The United States Department of Education’s mission is to promote student achievement and preparation for global competitiveness by fostering educational excellence and ensuring equal access.” And here are a few more mission statements to compare to from districts across the country. Try to guess where they’re from: “We ensure equitable access to a transformative educational experience grounded in the assets of our students, staff, and community.” Here’s Another: “To ensure high levels of learning for all students. To continuously develop our capacity to function as a collaborative culture.” One more: “Our commitment is to prepare each student to become a career and college ready citizen. We will partner with families and the community to provide an engaging and challenging education in a safe and positive environment.” Each of these mission statements, from the US Department of Education to districts from three different time zones across the US have similar and vague declarations. They feel like a fortune - “You are about to rediscover a lost connection to your past.” I get why the mission statements are vague. They are meant for a diverse population, and each family within that population should be able to see some value in these mission statements because public education is for everyone. But this is also where we can run into problems. The way I read “preparing each student to become a career and college ready citizen” is unique from what the administration, or students, or parents, or even other teachers may think. Do I think a person needs to avoid spaghetti straps to be a productive citizen? Not really, but I do think knowing how to work towards and meet a deadline would help. So why does a vague purpose of education lead to teachers leaving the profession? Because many educators are finding that their interpretation of these missions and goals are in conflict with those of the administration, school board, or community. Values are not aligning. Which creates stress and sometimes forces a choice, do what they believe in and create conflict, or compromise their values and feel miserable. Every now and then there are times when idealism aligns within the classroom, which can create amazing moments. For Allison Lash, who was an art teacher in New York City that we heard from last episode, building community and learning in her mind require providing students with new experiences and opportunities. Allison Lash: That's the kind of thing that I love bringing to kids like these little snippets and experiences that they might not get in the classroom. When her second graders were learning about rocks and gemstones from books, Allison organized a field trip to the Museum of Natural History because she knew they had an amazing collection. Allison Lash: And I took all the kids out of the Bronx and into Manhattan. And as we're and I rev them up, like for the field trip, and I told them we're leaving the Bronx, we're leaving the Bronx because so many of them have never left the Bronx are there. So many of them never left like many of them lived in the projects, the building. And so they only traveled from the building to school a block away in the supermarket like this. These like four streets, basically. And the kids when we were driving over the water and on the bridge to get to Manhattan, they were all screaming when they said we're leaving the Bronx. So I love, I love being able to do that. The ability to leave the space of the school often creates authentic learning experiences for students. These are experiences that connect students to their communities, which is a common value presented in school district mission statements. But there are limiting factors to leaving the space of the school. This is where idealism can be deflated because much of the modern purpose of education is now tied to keeping kids safe. This is why we practice having lockdowns. Lauren Schumacher spoke to me about how fear and wanting to keep kids safe impacts how we view the purpose of education. Lauren Schumacher: And I think, sadly, with all the violence, you know, the school shootings situations, continue to make our country want to fence our buildings in and put doorbells on and all that which I understand. But in the same breath, we need to be removing them from the fences and getting them out into communities. I think that is more of the direction we need to move education. I was really excited to talk to Lauren. I set up an interview station outside next to the Valley Bookstore in Jackson Hole, Wyoming. I didn’t meet Lauren first, I met her whole family. Her daughter saw my signs about teachers leaving and said, “My mom is going to want to talk to you” before she ran back from the direction she came to get her mom. Lauren was on vacation with her family. She is an administrator in Florida, and she had previously taught in both Missouri and Florida, but everything she talked about... /episode/index/show/59610576-d341-4b91-863b-94a6293ce4d3/id/25572285

3: What Would Robin Williams Do? 12/23/2022

3: What Would Robin Williams Do? The most easily recognized teachers in our culture are on the big screen. So when we think about good teaching, it’s almost impossible not to think of Robin William’s character in Dead Poets Society standing on a desk and inspiring his students. This might be part of the problem. When teaching is associated with unrealistic Hollywood characters, it can create impractical or ridiculous assumptions about what teachers do. In this episode, we hear how the stereotypes of teachers may be contributing to teachers’ decisions to leave education. Music: Theme Song By “NPC Theme” by is in the . “Sunny Afternoon” by is in the . “Infrastructure” by is licensed under a license. “Just a Blip” by is licensed under a license. “Room With a View” by is licensed under a license. Movie Clips: Freedom Writers (Paramount Pictures) Dead Poets Society (Touchstone Pictures, Walt Disney Studios Motion Pictures) School of Rock (Paramount Pictures) Ferris Bueller (Paramount Pictures, United International Pictures) Transcript: Episode 3: “What Would Robin Williams Do?” There is a picture-day-esqu photo on my parents’ fridge of me sitting on my dad’s lap. I am wearing a tie-dye shirt and my orange hair is in its natural state of an Eddie Munster widows peak. My dad is in a blue button down and has on a tie. My cheeks crowd my eyes, my smile is so big. My dad, who doesn’t always smile for pictures, has a cheeky grin. This picture was taken around the same time that my dad squatted down to eye-level with me and said: “When people ask you where you got your red hair, you tell them the milkman. Okay?” He didn’t make a big deal about telling me this. It was just a directive, and I said okay. I figured, yeah, that makes sense. So as adults would come by, ruffle my hair and say things like, “Oh my, what pretty red hair. Where did you get hair like that?” I’d look up at them, smile, and tell them, “The Milkman.” They would guffaw, cough down a drink, blush, and I’d try to explain, “You know, because he delivers things.” And they’d laugh out an “I’m sure he does!” and find my dad who would have a grin settled between his bouncing shoulders as he muffled a laugh, and my mom would say something like “G-uh, Darcy Joe” Not to be heavy handed, but the stereotypes of what a milkman may or may not do when visiting people’s homes is what makes the joke land. This joke was lost on me until high school. I didn’t understand the baggage associated with being a milkman. Language matters. Words like milkman have connotations - they carry weight or have stereotypes attached to them. That’s why I can’t flip someone off and say, “Why are you upset,this means joy to me.” There are too many representations of middle-fingers that situate the digit as a symbol of the obscene. Repetition and representation give meaning. The middle finger or terms like milkman or teacher, carry a history of expectations and stereotypes. Last episode we heard about the historical inheritance of teachers, which is significant in how we view modern teachers. But history isn’t the only thing that impacts how we view teachers. Today, we’re going to look at the teacher stereotypes in pop-culture and how these stereotypes can be contributing to teacher attrition. This is Those Who Can’t Teach Anymore, a 7-part podcast series exploring why teachers are leaving education and what can be done to stop the exodus. I’m Charles Fournier. Here is part 3: “What Would Robin Williams Do?” Molly Waterworth: I've gotten to the point where I see any TV show or movie where some sort of plot device hinges on the inspirational teacher. And I just roll my eyes. This is Molly Waterworth. We heard from her last episode, and she just left education after teaching English for 8 years. She points out a stereotype of inspiring teachers in media: Molly Waterworth:I just can't. I can't stomach it because it's so saccharin. It completely obscures the fact that these inspiring teachers that are either drawn from real life or the product of someone or someone's imagination, it completely obscures the fact that their inspirational teaching is very likely the outgrowth of massive mental health deficiencies. And like a complete imbalance of where they spend their time and where they're getting like their soul fed. Inspiring teacher stories make me feel awful. That shouldn’t be the case, right? Inspirational teacher movies should INSPIRE. And they can and they do - they inspired me - but what Molly points to is a nagging reality in many inspirational teacher stories. Dead Poets Society Clip As you can hear in this scene from Dead Poets Society, Mr Keeting, played by Robin Williams, pushes his student, Todd Anderson.. And in this unconventional way Mr. Keeting helps Todd start to gain some confidence and see his potential. Similar scenes occur in other famous teacher movies, like Mr Holland’s Opus, or Freedom Writers. These movies project a fantasy of heroism onto education, and people love it. Inspirational teacher movies are usually underdog stories: A teacher rails against convention and inspires and does amazing things for others no matter the personal cost. We are attracted to this as a culture. We want heroes that are selfless. We want to see ourselves as capable of being like Robin Williams’ character in Dead Poets Society. And the way these movie teachers influence kids…man, that’s the dream. But, several if not most of the teachers in those stories that inspire don’t have the healthiest work-life balance. They give everything to their students - time, energy, love, inspiration. And these movie teachers inspire in the public comments like, “We need more teachers like this” or “I wish teachers would be more like (whatever movie teacher).” But we need to ask, what is expecting teachers to fit a stereotype asking of real teachers? Think of Freedom Writers, a movie based on the real-life Erin Gruwell, who is played by Hillary Swank. She is the epitome of the inspirational teacher stereotype. Halfway through the movie, her husband leaves her because she is spending so much time focused on her students, Freedom Writers Clip The film creates a feeling that the husband might be unrealistic. As an audience, we’re rooting for Erin Gruwell because she does amazing things - her husband points this out. And don’t get me wrong, Ms.Gruwell is phenomenal and her story is amazing, but there might be danger in presenting this story as a precedent for what good teaching looks like. Yes, she is a good teacher, but at what cost? In most other films about different careers, it’s likely the main character would realize that work is taking too much and family is more important, but not in inspirational teacher movies. Expecting teachers to do what Gruwell does is expecting teachers to forfeit their own lives for students. It’s expecting martyrdom. This is a stereotype. And the reality is different. Molly Waterworth: We're not martyrs, and we're not perfect. And there are things that can be said about the profession as a whole and certainly about individual teachers that needs improvement, absolutely. But I think a lot of it maybe stems from just this sense that teachers aren't entirely human - that we are saints. And so therefore, we shouldn't worry about all of these factors that are making our jobs harder, because we have this big calling on our lives that turn us somehow into people that don't have needs. This language that surrounds teaching is significant. It feeds the stereotype of selflessness, which in turn has an impact on how teachers are treated. Right now teachers are feeling burned out because this stereotype is unrealistic - it’s creating an expectation that makes teachers want to leave education. I met up with Rachael Esh at Welcome Market Hall in Sheridan, Wyoming on the eve of her very last day as a teacher. Rachael Esh: It's a bit of a stereotype with teachers. It’s like, Oh, this has been your calling since you were this age, or since this teacher impacted you. This idea of a calling is that you don’t teach for the money, you do it for the kids because it is what you were meant to do. It is your destiny or purpose. A quote unquote “calling” can create a sense of guilt in teachers when they realize, crap, I’m not getting paid enough for this, which is in contrast to the narrative surrounding teaching like Molly points out: Molly Waterworth: People don't get into this for the money, why would they? But they're in it for the kids, and they're in it for that sense of purpose and mission. That's like, “Yeah, but I also would like to be paid.” So to have a calling is to feel like teaching is more than a job, more than a paycheck, it is a clear directive from some higher power for the direction your life should take in service of others. Rachael didn’t feel like that stereotype matched her experience. Rachael Esh: And I don't feel like that's usually the case. It's more of a roundabout zigzag pattern. This surprised me. I grew up wanting to be a teacher because, as Rachael said, I had some amazing teachers leave an impact on me, but I never thought teaching was my calling. It was something that sounded cool, and it was made cooler by movies like Dead Poets Society. I wrote the movie’s motto, “Carpe Diem” on all of my notebooks. And I liked reading and writing and teaching people, and teaching would give me a chance to coach. Not once did I get the sky part and shine a light on my career path. It wasn’t a calling, and of the 30 teachers that I interviewed, hardly any of them felt like teaching was their calling either. For Rachael and Molly, they had different plans with where their lives were going to go. Rachael Esh: So my undergrad I actually got at Ohio University in environmental biology, and so I thought I was gonna maybe do field work or something like that. Molly Waterworth: I declared my major as geography, but I did it with the intent of being able to go into the forest service. But I found out pretty quickly that I really didn't care about any of my classes. And I found out that I was going to have to take calculus and I wasn't interested in doing that. So I kind of bounced around into various humanities areas. And both Rachael and Molly landed in education because they each had a summer experience in college that put them in front of kids. Rachael took an internship teaching environmental education and Molly went to China with a group from college and got to help kids with their conversational English. They both found their way to being educators because of positive experiences teaching kids. Rachael Esh: So I knew I either wanted to go on to park service or education after working with kids then. And so it kind of just worked out that getting my degree in education was just more accessible, and I kind of wanted to separate my fun time, which was like outdoors, from my work. So I decided to kind of go into education. And I mean, the kids are never boring. So you're like, well, heck this. This beats an office job any day of the week. And when Molly returned from China, she declared first as an elementary teacher. Molly Waterworth: I think that when I envision myself being a teacher, I thought of myself reading with kids, and talking about literature and talking about books and big ideas and stuff like that. And so at that point, I had the very obvious revelation that I should be a secondary English teacher because that would afford me that opportunity most often. So that was kind of my meandering path into into There was no bright light for either of these teachers, no calling. Nothing so profound. Like most people, they stumbled onto their desire to do a job because they took advantage of an opportunity and realized, “Hey, this isn’t bad.” And Teaching wasn’t a last option for either of them. They weren’t failing at other things in life, which is tied to another stereotype of teaching. If teachers aren’t depicted as martyrs, they’re often seen as selfish or deviant or lazy or dumb or boring, like in Ferris Bueler’s Day Off. Ferris Bueller Clip And this image of teachers perpetuates the idea that teaching is a last ditch option for people that can’t do anything else. This stereotype often leads to a willingness to discredit teachers as experts in their field. Not being seen as experts in their field is a major reason teachers gave for leaving teaching. For Molly or Rachael, they became teachers by choice. They didn’t need to fall back to something easier. It wasn’t a School of Rock scenario, where Jack Black’s character, Dewey Finn, hits rock bottom before becoming a long term sub proving that someone with no qualifications can be a better teacher than trained and dedicated teachers - a trope that we see over and over again. In the film, Jack Black’s character even draws attention to a common saying that is tied to education. School of Rock Clip Dylan Bear is a PE teacher in Pinedale, WY. We sat at a picnic table in front of his house with a view of the Wind River Mountain Range, while we drank coffee, snacked on a loaf of banana bread he was gifted from a student, and talked about these sayings and images surrounding education. Dylan Bear: I think another thing, we've gotten a lot of quotes, like funny quotes in the society, like, oh, teachers, they take these jobs for June, July and August. I think that's something that needs to stop. What Dylan has noticed is the negative lens with which culture and Hollywood has viewed teachers. Like I mentioned earlier, we stereotype teachers as good or bad, the marty/savior type that saw teaching as a calling or the boring/lazy person who saw teaching as a backup plan. But, Dylan, like Molly and Rachael, didn’t see teaching as a calling. He didn’t see teaching as a fall back career either. Dylan Bear: So I started off as an engineer, and those were just not my people. And I was looking more for a little more social environment, a little more high energy versus analytical, consistently, day in and day out. And so I went from engineering to math in secondary math education because I liked working with kids. And then after a few years of that three years deep, looking at all the papers all the time, I just couldn't do it, so I switched from math. I was actually sitting in Prexy's Pasture and Laramie. And the special ed teacher came and sat down next to me and she said, What are you thinking about? Instead, there was my longboard. I said, I don't know if I can do math the rest of my life. Would you rather be teaching math or out playing a field, you know, and I thought like instantly. Dylan would rather be out in a field. Teaching was a good path for Dylan - not a calling and not a last ditch option. He takes his job seriously, and he is someone that plans on teaching for some time. And when Dylan started feeling a little burned out, he moved towns and got a change of scenery, so that he could keep teaching. He isn’t naive to the reality of burning out or how difficult the job is, nor is he jaded in thinking that anyone could do this job. The key word here is reality. The reality of a teacher is that teachers are human, not a stereotype. We make mistakes and we have successes and we make some profound impacts on kids and we make some mediocre impacts on kids. Dylan Bear: Some teachers are really good, and some are really lazy. And some kids are really good, and some are really lazy. So it's like, we don't want to paint a broad brush over everybody. And I think sometimes we do an education because there's so many people in education. It's like one of the leading job forces out there. So you hear these stories that are negative about one or two teachers, and then you say all I'm doing the same with kids. I hate when people say, kids are always on their phone. It's like, no, no, some kids are on their phones. Some of them are waiting for you to talk and give them a good lesson. I think education gets those broad brushes which devalue people. And that's a dangerous world. Dylan recognizes the need for grace and the danger of broad generalizations of any groups. He recognizes the fact that people are human, but sometimes we only get a snapshot of education, which creates these generalizations that feed into the stereotype of teachers as either good or bad. Dylan experienced this first hand when he had a student continuously refuse to take off his hat. Dylan Bear: I was like, This is absurd. So I'm a climber, and so he was playing badminton, and I popped his hat off and ran up and jumped up the basketball hoop and climbed in the rafters and hung it from like, the highest point in the gym, like, 50 foot up. And yeah, not very smart, but it was like, I didn't think about it, but kids Snapchatted it. And all the kids came like, “Oh, we saw you but it was out that was so funny. That it's like you have to be aware of that.” The snapchat of Dylan only includes his climb. It doesn’t include the warnings he gave the student from that day and previous days. It doesn’t include Dylan’s positive relationship with the student and the students’ family, or all of the normal/positive interactions Dylan has with his other students, or the mundane aspects of his job that he does everyday. The Snapchat lacks context, and this is how stereotypes begin and are fed. A single image becomes the representation of the whole - even if it is a fragment of the reality. This is the kind of thing that becomes an overgeneralization - a stereotype of teachers. These stereotypes are on social media and in movies and they contribute to cultural narratives about education that are unrealistic. Some of these glimpses and snapshots might be part of what teachers expected education to be, which is misleading and could be contributing to the disillusionment leading to teachers quitting. Here’s Molly again. Molly Waterworth: I think that the image probably came from a couple of places, a selective memory of my high school and middle school classrooms. So thinking back to those good experiences that I had as a student, I was like, “Okay, I want to create that for other people.” But I also had it in my head, the the image of the cool, thoughtful, worldly literary teacher that you see in like Dead Poets Society or any number of other movies like that - opening up doors and exploring identity and figuring out who we are all along the way. Dead Poets Society Clip I love Dead Poets Society, and Freedom Writers, but I remember telling my wife, after our first week in real teaching jobs: “This sure as hell isn’t Dead Poets Society.” I had been fooled with what teaching would actually be, and this is also an image of what the public seems to see of educators. They want the engaging classroom, the teacher that inspires, and don’t we all. Or they expect the lazy, boring, slacker who got into teaching because their real goals didn’t pan out. But education is more complex than a movie. Molly Waterworth: The crushing reality of grading was something that I hadn't quite prepared myself for. I think that I knew going into teaching, because obviously, you know, that you're going to have to grade and that's part of the job. So the grading part was overwhelming. You never see in movies, like staff meetings, or having to figure out the copier or the deeply existentially difficult process of figuring out the culture of the building in your first year. Just the kind of mundane but deeply tangible on a daily... /episode/index/show/59610576-d341-4b91-863b-94a6293ce4d3/id/25421826

2: Inheritance 12/14/2022

2: Inheritance Many of the problems modern teachers are facing aren’t new, so we’re going back in time to find out how our education system became a system that teachers are currently fleeing. Come to find out, modern teachers inherited low pay, limited respect, and a system that strips communities of their cultural traditions. In this episode, hear how Indian Boarding Schools and the American Industrial Revolution have left traces on modern education, and how these traces are contributing to teachers’ decisions to leave education. Music: Theme Song By “Sonata No.13 in E Flat Major, Op. 24 No. 1-II. Allegro, Molto, e Vivace” by is in the . “Railroad’s Whisky Co” by is Licensed under a license. “Ugly Truth” by is in the . “Upsurge” by is a license. “Green Lights” by is licensed under a license. “Pizz” by is licensed under a Transcript: I had a band teacher once hold me after class and force me eat a beef and bean burrito. He sat in front of me on the piano bench to make sure that I ate it. I was a freshman, in the middle of the high school wrestling season, and I was cutting weight for my first varsity tournament – where I’d end up getting my lips knocked off. My teacher, Mr. Duran, was short, wiry, wore jeans with a braided leather belt and a button-down shirt. He had round-framed glasses, combed his hair to the side, and more than once told me to listen to the greats like Chick Webb and not just the white guys that made it on the radio. He was in his 30th year of teaching, and he was not shy about giving advice. While I ate the burrito, Duran talked about playing baseball in college and how abruptly a life of sports could come to an end but how long a life of music could last. This was mature guidance, albeit, guidance that I see more value in now than I did then. Duran would garnish each class with stories that worked to guide us towards being kind human beings. There were days in Jazz band where he would sit in the center of the tiered room, legs crossed, saxophone neck strap still on, and tell us about his past. When Mr. Duran was in college at the University of Northern Colorado in the 1960s, the Count Basie Orchestra went through town and stopped at the university. UNC was known for its jazz programs and one of Basie’s saxophone players dropped out and they needed a replacement. Count Basie was one of the most influential musicians from the Swing Era – he was like a swing minimalist. Duran jumped at the opportunity. He got to travel and play with the band and experience life as a musician – more specifically as a musician of color. One time he and a buddy from the orchestra went into a diner and were refused anything more than water. Duran was Mexican and his friend was Black, and it was the middle of the 1960s. In protest, they sat in the big window of the diner for 3 hours, sipping their water, putting themselves on display for anyone who walked by. I love that story – this man, my teacher, saw inequity and faced it with defiance. Duran’s lessons were eye-opening. I didn’t realize that those stories served as parables on ethics and kindness until I became a teacher and started telling stories of my own to serve the same ends. Duran used his history to help us become better humans. And isn’t that why we turn to history? Well, today, we’re going to take a lesson from Duran and examine the history of education in the U.S. And because the history of education is tremendous, we have to narrow it down. So we’ll focus on two aspects of history that set precedents for modern education, for the current system from which modern teachers are exiting.. We are going to start with Indian Boarding Schools, and then we’ll take a look at the American Industrial Revolution. This is Those Who Can’t Teach Anymore, a 7-part podcast series exploring why teachers are leaving education and what can be done to stop the exodus. I’m Charles Fournier. Here is part 2: “Inheritance” Caskey Russell: I'm going crabbing this weekend. I own a boat with my brothers. And yeah, we go out and catch crab. And there'll be salmon season soon. So I kind of got back into the ocean style lifestyle. This is Caskey Russel. I got to catch up with him over a zoom call this summer. He is the Dean of Fairhaven College at Western Washington University. He grew up in Washington and is from the Tlingit tribe. I know Caskey because he taught for 17 years at the University of Wyoming, he was a dean of American Indian Studies, and he was my thesis chair and educational guide when I was at the university. Some of Caskey’s research for his PhD program dug into the history of Indian Education, specifically Indian boarding schools. Caskey Russell: My grandmother and her brothers, aunts and uncles, all went to Chemawa Indian School, in Salem. And it was a mixed bag. If you are asking yourself, wait, who’s this Caskey guy and what do Indian Boarding Schools have to do with teachers quitting? Here’s how. We know that historical atrocities leave a trace on modern institutions, so we need to recognize that Indian boarding schools have left their mark on modern education. They are a part of the system of inequity modern teachers have inherited. Indian Boarding Schools are an example of the deculturalization that has occurred in education. One of many. Attempts to strip communities of their cultures happened with just about everyone in this country at some point that didn’t fit into the male, able-bodied, straight, white, Anglo Saxon Protestant category. Traces of these inequities remain in education, deculturalization still happens, and teachers working towards inclusion in a system that was based on exclusion often run into roadblocks – think book bans or accusations that teachers are trying to indoctrinate kids - and these roadblocks are pushing teachers out of education. So to better understand the inequities in modern education, this thing that is frustrating teachers to the point of quitting, we need to look at where some of those attempts at deculturalization originated. We need to look at Indian Boarding Schools. And we need to listen to someone like Caskey. Caskey Russell: They liked the sports. They like some of the music, but my uncle Stanley Pradovic, I remember he said, “I used to dream of feasts, seafood feasts that they had in Alaska.” And my grandmother was able to keep the Tlingit language because she didn't go to boarding school, but her brothers did not. You step back and look at the whole system and how destructive and just kind of the cultural genocide aspect. My grandmother would say she didn't know her brothers because when she was born, her brothers were gone away from her earliest memories. And so she didn't get to know her brothers right away. It did break families up. And I was just chatting with my mom last night. My mom said the other family had no control over what it was determined for them. And again, not having control over that seems to be the key to it, nor having input in the education nor valuing…and then having a different model, different cultural notion of success. And then the military and the Christianization, all that together, just adds problem on top of problem, instead of being empowering and enlightening, that really becomes conforming, sort of thing. What happened to Caskey’s family was a result of centuries of efforts to deculturalize tribes. Early European colonizers of the US set a precedent of trying to assimilate tribes into a single monolithic culture. Colonizers disregarded tribal traditions and languages and failed to see that tribes already valued education for their youth. So the assumption that public education started with Horace Mann in 1837 is an assumption that values eurocentric education over the public education that was already in the Americas. Part of this is because the purposes of education differed. Many Native communities saw educating children as a means to pass on generational knowledge and teach children how to be a successful part of the community. 17th-century Plymouth settlers specifically saw education and literacy as a method to keep Satan away. Children needed to be able to read so they could read the Bible. A pilgrim minister explained: “[There] is in all children, though no alike, a stubbornness, and stoutness of mind arising from natural pride, which must, in the first place, be broken and beaten down; that so the foundation of their education being laid in humility and tractableness, other virtues may, in their time, be built thereon” (42). But tribes did not beat down their children, did not read the Bible, and were able to survive and thrive in what Pilgrims saw as wilderness. So Pilgrims worked to impose their educational priorities onto tribes as a way to cast out Satan, and ultimately gain control of Indigenous people. This effort to assimilate and control only compounded over the next few centuries By the 19th century, congress was also making efforts to deculturalize and assimilate tribes. Thomas Jefferson who had a big role in the removal of Native Americans from their lands also had a One Nation idea when it came to Native Americans – an assumption that required assimilation through education. In 1816, Jefferson explained the value of education: “Enlighten the people generally and tyranny and oppressions of body and mind will vanish like evil spirits at the dawn of day. Although I do not, with some enthusiasts, believe that the human condition will ever advance to such a state of perfection as that there shall no longer be pain or vice in the world, yet I believe it susceptible of much improvement, and most of all in matters of government and religion; and that the diffusion of knowledge among the people is to be the instrument by which it is to be effected” (101)). Jefferson believed a democratic, not a moral education which was what kids were getting at the time, was essential to democracy and he’s right, but his One Nation idea required a monolithic ideal that did not value other cultures. He wanted tribes to conform to his image of being American. This focus on conformity was baked into the American educational philosophy. The Civilization Act of 1819 saw Thomas McKenney, the first head of the Office of Indian Affairs begin a process of Native American deculturization – they created a tribal school system run by white missionary teachers hoping to gain control of tribes through the power of education and assimilation. When Andrew Jackson became president in 1829, he saw some of the educational progress made by tribes as dangerous to America’s goals of gaining control of lands. So, in 1830, America passed the Indian Removal Act, which brutally uprooted tribes and relocated them. Thirty years later, the Indian Peace Commission began reservation schools or day schools. But again, the cultural genocide that all of these acts and efforts had hoped for weren’t as effective as the government Wanted. This is when the government stepped in again. Paired with the Dawes Act of 1877 that worked to split reservation lands into private property began the start of the boarding school movement in 1879. Each step was a process working towards killing cultures in an attempt to control land, people, and ideas – all largely through some form of education. The start of the boarding school experiment can be attributed to Captain Richard Henry Pratt. Caskey Russell: Pratt actually had a number of prisoners of war under his charge at St. Augustine, Florida. Besides being given military uniforms, they would teach them. And so the way he sold the first boarding schools was that instead of being at war with natives, you can educate them. The US could educate them, and kind of eradicate native culture through educating towards whiteness. Caskey explained that the thought was that education would help the government avoid the expenses of war. Caskey Russell: So there are a group of Plains Natives that were transported to St. Augustine, that was his kind of first experiment. And then he was able to go to Congress and get some money. And he took them to The Hampton Institute and eventually to the Carlisle Indian Industrial School So Pratt’s experiment led to the establishment of the Carlisle Indian Industrial School in Pennsylvania in 1879. This was around the same time that Pratt made a famous statement to congress: Caskey Russell: He says to Congress, “You have heard Sherman say the only good Indian’s a Dead Indian. I would agree with this one kind of difference that you can kill the Indian save the man.” That's what education can do. That's the motto. And so, there was based on military kind of military boarding school style, and they opened up across the country. And they were often religiously affiliated, and religious institutions given them control of them. Which, you know, was another part of the boarding schools was the religious education, the eradication of tribal cultures, tribal religions, and the inculcation of Christianity, the various sects of Christianity across the country. Each step taken by congress, in the name of education, was an effort to prioritize one culture over others, one idea of success over others - often through religious means, because again, early education was morality based. And they did this through legislation and through educational policy. Even though many of these efforts are pretty old, we still feel the educational effects of prioritizing a single culture or single idea of success.. Elizabeth Smith, a veteran teacher of 20 years who teaches on a reservation still sees this today. Elizabeth Smith: Even though I can count on my hand, the number of students that I've taught that have graduated and have a white culture, sort of experience with what would be known as success, quote, unquote Caskey sees this idea in what is tested or valued as a bottom line in public education. These are things that dismiss differentiated cultural values. Caskey Russell: Did the schools reward students let's say for instance, this the schools Wind River reward students for knowing the traditional clan system, speaking Arapaho or Shoshone for knowing traditional ways, whether it's kind hunting, traditional use of land, traditional plants respond medicine, knowing being prepare, or being an apprentice for ceremony, none of that none of that culturally important stuff that was really important to Native people, especially young people they could dream of, you know, I'm going to fulfill these goals, these roles, these social roles one day, none of that's important, it seems like an American school system, right? When you're going to take the SAT or the ACT, are they going to value the hours you spent with your grandparents trying to learn the language or learning stories or learning traditional ways? Of course not. This is a part of the inheritance of modern education, something teachers have to grapple with consistently. How can we educate students to be a part of a community that through legislation or policy doesn’t seem to value all traditions and cultures within that community? Or how to reach a measure of success that isn’t culturally misaligned or based on morality? Caskey Russell:A handful of them might be successful in kind of the white American ideal. But that's not the only measure of success, nor is it maybe a healthy measure of success, right, for Native people. It would be wonderful to let other ideas of success, community success, success as a human being within a community flourish in the school setting. This question of how to honor a diverse spectrum of students lands on teachers in the classroom. Though legislators and school boards may make efforts to dictate what can and can’t be taught in the classroom, the reality is it’s teachers and administrators who are working with kids – and kids from a wide spectrum of communities who have often been forced into a specific, standardized idea of success, which might not be culturally conscious. This is exactly how Indian boarding schools started, they forced kids from diverse tribes into a standardized idea of success initially using arguments for morality to do so. We recognize this as bad now, so why are forms of it still happening? A big concern of some of the teachers who have decided to leave teaching was the start of limits and restrictions about what can and can’t be taught in the classroom. Many of these limits originate from argument about morality that are backed by religious groups that want to dictate what is happening in the classroom. Think of Mr. Wacker from last episode who is still frustrated with the banning of Toni Morrison’s The Bluest Eye for moral arguments or Mr. Atkinson who felt his curriculum being squeezed by people who didn’t appreciate class conversations about varying cultural perspectives on current events. And, as we saw with the history of Native American education, this is not new – even though many founding fathers, who were deists themselves, advocated for the separation of church and state and were adamant that education focus on democratic values rather than religious values. John Adams wrote to his wife Abigail: “I must study Politicks and War that my sons may have liberty to study Mathematicks and Philosophy. My sons ought to study Mathematicks and Philosophy, Geography, natural History, Naval Architecture, navigation, Commerce and Agriculture, in order to give their Children a right to study Painting, Poetry, Musick, Architecture, Statuary, Tapestry and Porcelaine.” John Adams does not reference education and say study the Bible. And fellow former president James Madison did not mince words in a letter that pushed against church use of government land, which would later include schools: “The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe with blood for centuries.” And these beliefs worked their way into legislation with the inclusion of the Establishment Clause in the First Amendment, which Thomas Jefferson said was “A wall of separation between the church and state.” And though we know Jefferson’s view of education wasn’t very inclusive, if we combine this idea of the separation of church and state with a modern inclusive reading of Jefferson’s thoughts that education is to “Educate and inform the whole mass of the people. They are the only sure reliance for the preservation of our liberty,” We get a pretty good idea that education is a means to inform a free-thinking, diverse population that has different belief systems. The founders knew the danger of letting religion seep its way into government - they just broke free of a country that allowed that to happen. So to have a system of education that would inform the whole mass of people without perpetuating the deculturalization we saw with the Indian Boarding schools, which have their origins in religious schooling, that system would need to accommodate the diversity of that mass of people. This means that teachers would need the trust of the public and freedom to use their expertise to do their jobs, which would likely include selecting a wide range of materials to accommodate a diverse student population. This freedom and trust is not something being granted to modern teachers. There is currently a trend of parents, legislators, and school board members criticizing teacher efforts to support diverse student needs, often through moral critiques. Which stems from a lack of trust and the same morality based fear that sparked early deculturalization efforts in the United States. So, this isn’t new. This... /episode/index/show/59610576-d341-4b91-863b-94a6293ce4d3/id/25321416

1: Fight, Flight, or Apathy 11/29/2022

1: Fight, Flight, or Apathy We are witnessing a mass exodus of teachers from education. My wife, Jennie, is one of those teachers that left. She, like many educators, was tired of not being treated like a professional. Even for me, a high school English teacher, the job is getting harder. So I go in search of answers. In this episode, we hear from Jennie and two other former teachers about why they left teaching. From struggles with mental health, to low pay, to a lack of autonomy in the classroom - they give insight into why we are losing good teachers across the country. Music: Theme Song By “Worky Work” by is licensed under a license. “Roost” by is licensed under a license. “Take it Back” by is licensed under a license “Machinery” by is licensed under a license “So Far So Close” by is licensed under a license. “Patriotic Songs of America” by the t is licensed under a license “Another Rainy Day” by is licensed under a license. “Everest” by is licensed under a license Transcript: I was a Junior in high school when my English teacher, Ms. Dianne Panazzo assigned us to write a paper that explored our backgrounds. I wrote about a neighborhood game of capture the flag. In the middle of our game, we came across a soft-top, convertible. It was parked in the lumber yard of the hardware store at the end of our block. Our pursuit of the flag came to a standstill to look at this car. We lived in a small town in western New York – a place of rusted trucks and economy vehicles. One of the boys that lived across the street from us always wore camo and did reconnaissance missions into his neighbor’s house. He was pretty sure the car belonged to a guy who was trying to shut down his dad’s business. With the logic of 10-year-olds, we felt a sense of duty to retaliate against any encroachment on locally owned, businesses so we stacked lumber and bags of concrete on the car. Then, my camo-wearing neighbor climbed onto the hood of the car and threw a cinderblock into the windshield. There was this cinematic pause, as we gathered our senses, and then we destroyed that car. Lumber and tree branches went through the windows, the soft top was punctured – more cinderblocks made pieces of the car – it was a mess. When we were done, we finished our game of capture the flag and went home at curfew. Later, 2 police officers visited our door, looking for the vandals. Lawlessness that my oldest brother assured them that we had nothing to do with. My essay explored how this story was a metaphor for rock and roll. I know, but it was high school – I was trying to be edgy and profound. My teacher, Ms. Panazzo, applauded my writing and had me walk across the hall to Mr. Wacker’s room. This was not because Wacker was more or less of an expert on writing or deviance. Panazzo sent students to Wacker as a way to celebrate and share writing. These were teachers who collaborated often, believed in the writing process, and took efforts to teach students how valuable their writing was. Sending a student to Wacker was a novel way to give kids a feeling of getting published. Wacker was on plan, crouched over a stack of papers, pen in hand, at his desk in the back of an empty, dimly-lit classroom. I had never interacted with him before. He had a reputation of being dynamic, kind, and willing to be outrageous – he’s the guy that put on a foam ten-gallon hat and had a stick horse race in front of the school at a pep-rally. To Wacker, shame was for suckers. I told him that Panazzo had sent me. He had me sit in a chair to the side of his desk so he could listen to me read my essay. I read and Wacker nodded, gasped, said, “uh-huh,” now and again – all of the things that I wanted to hear as a young writer. He handed me praise balanced with some advice and sent me back to class. I was impressed by how willing he was to listen to me, to inspire and encourage me. A kid that wasn’t his student, interrupting his planning time, to read an essay about young stupidity. That moment was pivotal in my desire to be a writer. And I’m not the only student that Panazzo sent to read to Wacker. My wife, Jennica – she goes by Jennie – had a similar experience. This is what made Wacker a great teacher and what inspires me in my teaching practice still. His willingness to take time for others, whether he knew them or not. But Wacker isn’t a teacher anymore. 15 years and over a thousand students after our first meeting, Wacker quit. He told me it was a matter of life or death. This is Those Who Can’t Teach Anymore, a 7-part podcast series exploring why teachers are leaving education and what can be done to stop the exodus. My name is Charles Fournier. I am a high school English teacher. In the 10 years that I’ve been teaching, brilliant teachers have been leaving the profession, my wife included. And those numbers have only increased with Covid. So in order to root out why teachers are leaving and reflect on my own ambivalence towards teaching, I spent this summer traveling, researching, and interviewing teachers, parents, students, legislators, professors, and administrators to try to find out why good people are leaving education. This is a national problem. In February of 2022, the National Education Association (NEA) reported that 55% of teachers are thinking about leaving the profession earlier than they had planned. And last spring, in my state of Wyoming, a University of Wyoming survey showed that 65% of surveyed Wyoming teachers would quit teaching if they could. Think of that…about two thirds of the teachers in your kids’ school right now want to leave. That’s an astonishing number. So I figured Wyoming would be a good place to start. If it’s bad here, a state that is seen as a haven for having some of the highest teacher salaries in the past decade, we know it’s bad. Maybe salaries aren’t the only thing causing teachers to leave. This podcast will explore the reasons teachers leave. We will look at how low pay, ignored mental health, lack of respect and autonomy, and mandated education policy influence teachers’ decisions to go. And how these things are not new…take a look at our education system’s history. We’ve talked about reforms for generations. Or think about how teachers are depicted in movies or in political debates. The images of martyrs or slobs also make an impact. Things have been accumulating for a while. And we could see this crisis a long way off. I have wanted to write this podcast since my wife left teaching. And then two more of my favorite colleagues left education just one after the other. So today, I will be starting close to home to find out why teachers are leaving. But before we begin, a quick warning, this episode discusses miscarriage, abuse, and suicide. If you or someone you know is struggling with thoughts of suicide, please call the national suicide hotline at 988. Here is part 1: “Fight, Flight, or Apathy” Jennica: My first year was with you was a ton of fun. Jennie and I started teaching at the same school in a small agricultural town on the eastern border of Wyoming. I taught English and she taught Chemistry and Biology. Jennica: Then you wanted to kind of get out of education for a little bit. So you went and got your Masters. I returned to school to get a Masters degree in Literature, and Jennie started teaching in a new district. She collaborated with the University in town, took kids on field trips into the community and had a wonderful time teaching. But after I earned my Masters, we moved again, and we got to teach together again in a new district. This was what we’d talked about since our Freshman year in college – to teach in the same building together for the rest of our careers. And working together was amazing, but we didn’t realize the toll teaching was taking. Jennica: We had gotten pregnant. And we felt like, oh, gosh, like, we're gonna double down on this career. And we're going to be teachers till we retire. And that felt awful. I felt defeated. Thinking of teaching for another 25-30 years made us very aware that we were more dissatisfied with teaching than we thought. We liked the idea of having kids but now it felt like we were stuck in this career. Then in October, we had a miscarriage. Jennie told me that she felt something wrong in class while she was teaching. She eyed the door and waited for someone to pass her room, so she didn’t leave her students unattended. When a principal walked past, she asked him to cover her class, and she ran to the bathroom. Jennie said it was all so fast for her – it was almost a blur. And then she went back to teaching during the same class period in a fog. In another profession, it would have been easy to take the afternoon off, but here she would have had to plan for a sub, which included potentially explaining why she needed coverage on such short notice. She wasn’t prepared at that time to do this for such a personal and confusing experience. She said it was surreal for her to brush herself off, put on a smile, and keep on with her lesson. She wasn’t even completely sure if she had miscarried until it was confirmed that afternoon at the doctor’s office. There are no standard ways to grieve. We went to the mountains and talked and thought and cried and we tried to answer why such things happen. Jennie’s mom always tells us, “You know, everything happens for a reason.” So we were trying to find one. Jennica: It was sad to have our miscarriage but at the same time, it was like, well, the door’s open again, and leaving this career, is something that I've been thinking about for a little bit. And so it just solidified that I should take advantage of this moment to do something that I wanted to do. When Jennie was still pregnant, our lives seemed laid out in front of us, and we had accepted that. But our miscarriage gave us a moment to reflect, and we realized that the life we almost had – a life that included teaching for the rest of our careers – was not the life we wanted. We felt like if it wasn’t our time to become parents, maybe we were supposed to be doing something else or taking another path. I had just gotten my Masters, so it was Jennie’s turn to decide what she wanted her life to look like. Many of the reasons Jennie wanted to leave education had a lot to do with not feeling valued and trusted as a professional – all things that contributed to her own self-worth: Jennica: I didn't feel like I had a lot of autonomy. It was all guaranteed and viable curriculum. And I didn't have a lot of wiggle room. For those of you who don’t know, a Guaranteed and Viable Curriculum or GVC is an effort to ensure the same quality of curriculum is presented to all students. They are the culmination of efforts to standardize education, and they act like a middle-man to the Common Core Standards. Most states adopted the Common Core Standards, which if followed should already guarantee an equitable education, but the GVCs are used to map how those standards are reached. Jennica: I felt like I was getting critiqued by people that should have been showing me what to do or helping me to grow. And I just didn't get a lot of affirmation that I needed. I got it in my reviews. I always got really great reviews from administrators, but I just didn't get it from my department. I didn't feel like I was an intelligent person. And I didn't feel like I was doing enough at any given time. Part of this feeling came from having to play the role of a disciplinarian, to uphold rules that she didn’t see value in. Jennica: I would have appreciated the administrators focusing more on what the students were learning in my class versus how students were behaving. And it's strange that I was expected to be a disciplinarian with absolutely no teeth. I don't even think I had the option of having kids have detention after school with me. I think I would have gotten in trouble for making them clean desks after they drew little wieners on the desks. I just felt like I had no control. If I were to send students to the office because of their behavior. It's like a mark against you. You know, you have teachers bragging that they've never sent students to the office. You can hear administrators talking about, “Well that teacher always sends me that student, they need to handle it on their own.” But there's really no way to handle it in your classroom.You know, you call home and the parents just as much of a jerk to you as the child is. And there's just, there's no respect for the teacher from any end. As I did interviews, I kept coming back to these questions: What is the role of teachers in education? How many hats do teachers really need to wear? Teachers are expected to do a lot and sometimes it feels like that includes being a parent. Most teachers have probably had this similar conversation with a parent. The parent says something like, “I don’t know what to do with (insert student name). What should I do?” This is a tough question. When I’ve tried to answer it, it’s from the lens of a teacher, not a parent. Because if my answer was from what I would do as a parent, it might seem like I’m criticizing their parenting. Jennica: I don't want to have to be the parent, I want to be the teacher. And I think that parents should let teachers be teachers, and that they should play the parent role. I'm an expert in my field. I have a degree in both chemistry and education, and I understand how people learn and I understand what needs to be taught. And parents aren't experts in that field. And I don't think that they need to think that they are experts or control that. Do I think that teachers should just go in without like it's the Wild West and just do whatever they want? No, but I think the oversight should not be parent driven. I think it needs to be expert driven. This would mean trusting teachers as experts in both their content and in the delivery of that content. That trust might start with getting rid of phrases like, Those who can, do. Those who can’t, teach.” Trusting teachers to do their jobs recognizes that teachers “Can Do” that’s why they “Can Teach.” If we continue to distrust teachers’ capabilities to do their jobs, we might have to rely on a new phrase as teachers continue to leave, a phrase that Jennie came up with - Those who can’t, teach…anymore. Outside of education, most advisory boards of any field are typically made up of experts in those fields. Education boards and even education legislation aren’t often like that. School boards are made up of non or former educators, and education legislation, at least in Wyoming, is rarely developed by educators. Questioning teacher expertise is a national issue. And the national issues are contributing to why teachers are leaving. Jennica: So the the micro environment that I was in played a part, but then when you went home and read the news, or you, you thought about the bigger picture when it comes to how teachers are viewed, that didn't help it didn't soothe me when I got home. Hearing about school shootings is devastating and terrifying. Every story makes me think about what if it happened here? When Jennie taught with me, my first thought when going through my imaginary scenario was always, “Will she be safe? Could I prevent a shooter from making their way towards her end of the building?” Jennica: Thinking about teachers having guns in the classroom, thinking about how I should protect students that weren't mine, they weren't my children, and how it was my job to sort of be selfless, you know, throw my body in front of them. I didn't really feel like that was my role. I'm really good at teaching people how to balance an equation. And I'm really good at inspiring kids and coaching them on what they're good at and encouraging them to keep going through hard problems. But I don't really think that my role as a teacher was to be a martyr for other people's children. So we had had a lockdown. That was a real lockdown. There was a shooting in the neighborhood near the school, and the shooter was still on the loose, so this is what caused the lockdown. A lockdown requires classes to be buttoned down – doors shut, blinds down, students out of sight of any windows and silent. We practice these often. Once, during a teacher development day, we practiced with fake active shooters to hear what guns would sound like going off in the hallways. I remember sitting in a classroom with my brother – we also teach together – and thinking about the absurdity of having to have officers fire blanks from automatic rifles to prepare us for what could happen. So Jennie was caught in a real lockdown, meaning she had to get students behind a locked door. Jennica: And I was just panicking about the students and they weren't really like on my side. They weren't coming into the classroom, they weren't staying quiet. And it was just a terrible experience. And I just didn't want to be trapped in that. That's not what I signed up for. I signed up to teach people things, not to save their lives. So after 7 years of teaching, she left. Jennica: When I got accepted into pharmacy school, I was expecting to wait like two weeks after my interview to find out but they pulled me into the dean's office. And they told me that I was accepted, and I just started crying right away because I knew I could quit teaching. I knew that I was going to escape an environment that I was very sad to be in every day. They cried because they thought I cried because I was getting into pharmacy school, but really I was crying because I was getting out of education. This transition out of teaching had a massive impact on her well-being. Jennica: My self-esteem is incredibly higher than it was before. You know, I used to be very depressed, and I was overweight when I was a teacher. And I just didn't really feel good about myself. And I wasn't getting a lot of positive affirmation from my peers and other teachers. I really thought, like, maybe I'm just not very smart or capable. I'm sure that you remember the first time that I came home from that anatomy class and I came home with a list of anatomy, and I just bawled. She worried that she wasn’t smart enough. But, she studied, sometimes over the phone with me as she commuted to her classes, and she finished at the top of that class. And she’s continued to be at the top of her pharmacy classes since. Jennica: I have a 4.0, in pharmacy school, and I have a lot of achievements. And it's something that I wasn't made to believe that I could do before. Of course, Jennie’s decision to leave education makes me think more about my own longevity in this career. I know why Jennie quit, and I get it. I can’t say that I haven’t thought about leaving either – I have and I do. And I think about it more and more when the people that I admire and love leave or when the woes of America’s problems are traced back to the education system – a system that is ironically hobbled then blamed for not meeting all of the expectations placed on it. Shane Atkinson taught in the same building Jennie and I taught in, and when he left teaching, he told me that he found a career that allowed him to merge his morals and values with his work.. He actually started his career teaching with one of the most noble reasons I’ve ever heard. Shane met me for a drink in Fort Collins. I set up mics at a picnic bench, shaded by a low hanging tree – Shane rode up on his bike, ordered a beer, and told me about when he decided to become a teacher. Atkinson: It’s gonna sound almost untrue how crazy it was. Shane went to college for journalism – he thought of it as the 4th branch... /episode/index/show/59610576-d341-4b91-863b-94a6293ce4d3/id/25161327

Season Trailer: Those Who Can't Teach Anymore 09/23/2022

Those Who Can't Teach Anymore

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