Creating Great Grooming Dogs

This is the show where we talk about teaching pets to be Calm, Comfortable, and Cooperative for grooming and other types of care. Perfect for groomers, trainers, owners, vet techs, vets, and other pet professionals.

When It’s Your Own Dog Ep194 04/21/2024

The "Hard" Dogs Ep193 03/31/2024

Stephanie Zikmann Behavior Chat 03/04/2024

Meds For Behavior Issues Ep192 01/28/2024

Train Your Dog Month Ep191 01/21/2024

Warnings and Bites Ep190 01/14/2024

The 4 Stages of Learning Ep 189 01/02/2024

Is Punishment Necessary? Ep188 12/19/2023

Desensitization, This Moment Matters Ep 187 12/15/2023

Emotions And The "Why?" Ep 186 09/16/2023

Emotions And The "Why?" Ep 186 Emotions And The"Why?" Ep 186 Episode 186. Is it okay to talk about emotions and animals? Is it anthropomorphic to talk about emotions and animals? Where is the line, between what we see and the story that we build around what we see? And let's talk about emotions and what we observe this week. Find all show details, including transcripts, at CreatingGreatGroomingDogs.com You can find my online classes at Whole Pet Grooming Academy WholePetNH.com For more information about my Master Groomer Behavior Specialist diploma program, go to MasterGroomerBehaviorSpecialist.com You're listening to the Creating Great Grooming Dogs show. [00:00:21] I am Chrissy Neumeier Smith. I'm a Master Groomer Behavior Specialist. I'm a Certified Professional Groomer, a Certified Behavior Consultant for Canines, a Certified Professional Dog Trainer. And I'm also the owner of Happy Critters in Nashua, New Hampshire, and an instructor at Whole Pet Grooming Academy. [00:00:38] So this week we are talking about emotions. I had an entirely different topic started off this week, but it kept circling back to feelings and emotions. And I really wanted to delve into that a little bit deeper before we get into a topic that makes some assumptions that we would be on all on the same page. [00:01:00] We're not going to be all on the same page. So I decided that I really needed to revisit this particular piece all on its own. We've talked about anthropomorphic before, , which is when we attribute human feelings and desires onto dogs or other animals without really thinking a little bit more basically, what is this animal trying to do? [00:01:21] So we as humans talk about emotions and feelings, but let me ask you this. Let's consider this. Are we always correct when we try to figure out the why of another person? Oh. Do we always understand why another person is feeling the way they're feeling? , are we good with that? Do we always get it right? [00:01:45] When we are interacting with another person using shared language, expressing thoughts and feelings, do we always get it right? Hmm, that's interesting, isn't it? do we? Another question. Are we always good at explaining the reason for our own emotions? Are we good at explaining the why of what we're feeling and how that's affecting the way that we're behaving today or yesterday or last week, right? [00:02:16] Are we good at that? This answer is going to vary from person to person. Some people will be really good at that. , others are constantly trying to work on it. And some are blissfully unaware, but here's something to consider. Ask someone close to you. Ask, maybe it's a parent or a sibling or a spouse or a child. [00:02:38] Ask someone really close to you. Maybe it's your best friend. Are you good at understanding their point of view when they're trying to explain something to you? Are you good at expressing your own point of view when you're trying to explain how you feel? What you're going to find is that most of us are not great at this. [00:02:56] We're not very good at figuring out the why of emotions and expressing those emotions and figuring out why we behave the way we do. We observe behavior in the humans around us, but we don't always understand the why. So why are we talking about this? It probably seems a little off topic, doesn't it? But how does this relate to dogs? [00:03:21] Yeah, but you thought I was getting off track here. Um, the way it relates to dogs is we observe behavior. We see what the dog is doing with their body, but do we always understand why they are doing it? Do we understand the feelings, the emotions being expressed through that behavior? We see the behavior, what is observable to us, but how many of us can correctly guess why the dog is doing it? [00:03:51] It's not easy. It's not easy. And as we just discussed, even amongst other humans, when we are trying to figure out what another human feels, what another human thinks, and they're literally trying to tell us, We're not good at it, it takes a lot of understanding of humans and of dogs to be able to figure out why a behavior is happening. [00:04:16] So, maybe it's not so easy. Maybe this takes a ton of time and takes a ton of effort and we aren't used to thinking about it that way. , I will say there was a point in my career when I would have described looking at dogs and what they're doing as I have a feeling about why he's doing it. I have a feeling about why he's doing it. [00:04:38] All right. I think many of us do that. I have a feeling. But here's the thing I was watching what the dog was doing. And now that I've really been training my eye to watch what they're doing and think about what they're responding to. Now I realized that I didn't have a feeling. I was noticing things in the environment, noticing things about a dog and what they were doing and maybe making correct assumptions, right? [00:05:07] Or making assumptions and maybe they were incorrect assumptions. But that's the tricky part. We're observing body language. We're watching. We're listening. Sometimes we're smelling, right? Anal gland smell. Oh, that's a definite signal. That's not a happy moment most of the time if they spray their anal glands. [00:05:28] But you think about all of those things that we observe, but are we good at understanding why? And we're not really good at it, even with other human beings that we talk to that are literally trying to tell us. Well, the dog is literally trying to tell us also. Now I want you to think about we're viewing what the dog is doing, and we're trying to guess at why they're doing it. [00:05:55] And I want you to start thinking about gathering clues. Gathering clues about the behavior before we make assumptions about how a dog feels before we start jumping into, I think this is going on or this is going on. This dog is an individual just like we are. And we have to think about what is this dog responding to? [00:06:15] What is happening in that moment? , and what kind of emotions might this dog be having based on what is happening? Okay. Dogs have emotions. I think we can all observe a dog who is scared, a dog who is fearful, a dog who is happy. Come on. We know they have emotions. The problem comes in when we try to, make our stories around what we think that emotion is caused by. [00:06:47] That's where anthropomorphism comes in is when we're trying to say, well, he's happy , and that isn't always a bad thing. He's happy because we do need to kind of ask that question. The problem is, is if we're not on target, if we're trying to say, well, he did this because, or he did that because, then that's where the emotion part can become really kind of a blurred line. [00:07:14] , and while they have emotions. And , I think that we can all agree if you've worked with dogs, you've seen a variety of emotions we respond to different emotions differently. So there is some worry when we think a dog is, let's say, angry at us. How are we going to respond to that animal? We're probably going to be defensive, right? [00:07:40] How do we respond to other humans when we think they're angry at us? Right? Um, now if we respond to a dog thinking he seems stressed, then it becomes clearer that we are going to try to help them calm down. I'm going to give some examples here. I know I'm always giving examples and I feel like I'm spending my whole life saying I'm going to give some examples here. [00:08:04] , a human customer comes into your office and she is upset. Always understand why. Maybe we think that person is mean, that person is cranky, that person is, let's see, what other terms might we use? Some of the terms get really mean, right? But are we really good at noticing that this person is running late for something? [00:08:29] , is very, very stressed out, , is confused. Maybe they're really confused, but I do brush him. I don't understand what you're talking about. Now they're being defensive and you're being defensive and it all falls apart. Customer service stuff is also about thinking about the other side of the story, the why, why. [00:08:52] Is this customer having difficulty today? Like I said, it is not cut and dry. This is not easy for most of us to get a good read on why a behavior is happening and what emotions they are around it. So when we look at that customer, , maybe we're looking at her thinking she is really cranky. She is really mean. And is that really the motivation? Is she just a cranky person? That could be true. Okay. I think we know there are a lot of people out there who are just playing cranky, but why, why? I love people. I know a lot of groomers don't. [00:09:33] , I see those cranky people and they often become my really good customers. Cause I think about why I think about why the cranky, , what is this person responding to? And that's what we need to do with our dogs. If we see something that we interpret as an emotion, step back for a minute and instead think, what is this dog responding to? [00:09:54] And why, why is this happening? Because if we assume that a dog is angry, Or we start making big stories, that can really lead us down a path that doesn't make any sense. And next thing you know, you and the dog are in conflict of some sort when it didn't need to be. So in the next part, we are going to talk about where communication can really go wrong. [00:10:18] If you're enjoying the show, please remember to follow or subscribe or like wherever it is you are. The show is on YouTube, so you can watch it as videos. It's as a podcast, so you can just listen to the audio. And to find any of those things, go to CreatingGreatGroomingDogs. com, where you can also find full transcripts. [00:10:38] Well, since I started doing transcripts, you can find full transcripts. Um, there are a lot of other things there. There are a couple of blog posts, CreatingGreatGroomingDogs. com. When we talk about how we are figuring out what a dog wants or needs, when we're figuring out those emotions, we have some old myths in the dog world that affect us and that affects how we interpret what we see. [00:11:05] And I say we. Because it is part of our society and our culture at this point. Maybe you don't, but others around us do. And it's good for us to understand that. So what am I talking about? The long held belief that dogs are trying to take over. That dogs are trying to test their boundaries, test our limits. [00:11:27] They're trying to see if you're really in charge. That all of these behaviors could simply be changed if you were a more assertive leader. I'm not going to say that those things can't be true. All right? Perhaps some of those things are happening for some of our dogs, some of the time. But, dang it all to heck, it is so often the first thing that people jump to. [00:11:52] It's so often the first thing, yet if we think back, are most dogs trying to take over the world? No, it's a really long held myth, but it does affect the lens that we look through when we're looking at their behavior. Okay, so I'm going to give a couple of examples here. , She's trying to get me to stop, and I can't let her win. [00:12:19] Oh, we hear that a lot in grooming, don't we? Is this dog trying to win? What an interesting thought. As if this is a battle, and the dog is like, You are not allowed to do this to me. Maybe that's true. Okay, that could be true. But, what if we think first about maybe this dog is frightened? Maybe this dog is scared, maybe this dog is physically uncomfortable, and yet we're forcing because we think this dog is just being persnickety. [00:12:54] This dog is just trying to win, and I'm not putting up with it. Right? Ooh, think about that. We have to step back from some of our assumptions about why dogs do things. All right. And that's a real quote, the she's trying to, to get me to stop and I can't let her win real quote from lots and lots of different places. [00:13:16] The fact of the matter is, yes, the dog is trying to get you to stop doing something, but why? Why? Probably not because they're trying to take over the world. That's probably not it. So when we think about, , the different things that could be happening in that moment. So let's say, we have a dog that's screaming in the tub. [00:13:38] What is going on in that moment? Well, first let's ask a question. What is screaming? Hmm. All right. What is that? What does that look like? My interpretation of a dog screaming might be different than your interpretation of a dog screaming. Is this a dog that is barking? Is this a dog that does that weird little yodel thing? [00:13:59] , and then to think about why, why. What else is happening in that room? Is that a dog whose owner is at the windows, tapping at the windows, and the dog is trying to like, call out to their owner? You know, the owner who's trying to be helpful by chanting things like, chanting the dog's name and saying, sit. [00:14:20] , if you're an owner listening to this, your groomer very rarely wants your dog to sit. Telling your dog to sit is really not helpful. Yet, they all do it. So, you know, why is the dog doing it? We have to think about why, right? We can see that there's an emotion happening. But we can't interpret it well until we ask why. [00:14:43] So I want you to think about some of the things that we see. So screaming, maybe that's just a dog who's barking. Maybe that's this dog's particular bark. Maybe this dog is really excited. Um, maybe this dog is really frightened. We make up stories around that before we really take a critical eye and take a look. [00:15:03] So let's talk about some more stories because stories are fun. , And it'll help you think about, Oh, wait, what are we really seeing? What are we really seeing? That's the thing. Dogs have emotions, but are they vengeance and jealousy probably not. Let's look more about what they are responding to, especially in grooming, because dogs find grooming to be difficult because they find it unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary. [00:15:32] So at every turn, if it's something happening in grooming, I want you to think, is this dog finding it unpleasant? Uncomfortable and or scary because that's usually it. It's not usually, how dare you and even when it is. It's because they find it unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary. So our solutions are going to be to try to make the dog calm, comfortable, and cooperative. [00:15:55] I know you're sick of hearing it. That's okay. We're just going to keep saying it. So let's talk about another story. I had a customer who came to me because her dog was spending lots and lots of time in a crate while the kids were all out because she had, , a number of children in her house. Some of them were daycare kids and, he was just too, too silly around them. [00:16:17] But at night she was trying to get him enough exercise and working with them while the kids were in bed. But her biggest concern was that he was growling at the pictures of her children on the wall because he was jealous. And those are her babies. And he's jealous cause he's in a crate all day. And he stares at those pictures up on the wall and growls at them when they're sitting on the couch at night after the kids have gone to bed. [00:16:43] All right. Is that jealousy? Hmm. Yeah, probably not. And I was at her house and I'm like, he's hearing something in the wall, you know, she was so offended. I don't have anything in my wall. Like, Oh, he's hearing something in the wall. He's looking up at a point on the wall and growling. And it's a very old house. [00:17:04] And I lived in a very old house too at that time. Like, listen, there could be things in the wall. He's hearing something. There is no way on God's green earth. That your dog is looking at pictures of children and being jealous, yet that's the story she wrote about behavior that she was experiencing. The behavior that she was seeing is that he was very, very jealous. [00:17:30] , she didn't like my answer. She wanted to hold onto the idea. That he was growling at pictures of her children. Okay. We joke about things like that because it seems extreme, but that was someone's point of view. And what it really says is more about what we think is going on and what we're maybe feeling about this dog, right? [00:17:53] There's another one, , this was a story about a dog who, they left him at home for the first time all day and he was in a crate and he gone out at lunchtime back in the crate. And it was the first time they'd really left this puppy alone. And he was angry at them and got back at them by pulling that precious grandma's quilt into his cage and ripped it apart. [00:18:16] Does that sound like anger and jealousy and spite? And getting even, right? I think that the anthropomorphic part is when we start trying to make up a story about the behavior we see. That dog pulled something into the crate and chewed on it all day. Maybe this dog was stressed, maybe this dog was bored. [00:18:41] But it was probably not targeting something particularly precious. Well, he could have grabbed a different blanket, but he grabbed grandma's quilt. Probably not thinking about, well, this quilt is far more valuable to the humans around me. Right? We make up crazy stories, right? And, and we try to see from an animal's point of view. [00:19:06] Now, let me ask you this. When they got home. If they were thinking that this dog intentionally grabbed something far more precious than the other things in reach and ripped it apart because he was angry and wanted to get even, how do you suppose they interacted with that dog when they got home and they saw this all play out? [00:19:29] We can be really, really hostile when we start assuming we know why a dog did something. Let's instead think about why is this dog feeling a need to chew things while we're gone? Why? Why? What's going on? In this particular case, I think the dog was probably bored. They didn't have any toys in their form. [00:19:55] He just thought they would just take a nap all day, probably just pulled it in to chew on something. Perhaps this dog was stressed. We do know that they have emotions like fear, anxiety, stress, happiness, sadness, right? We can see all of those things, but we need to think about, really step back from our feelings about the whole story. [00:20:15] and see what they're trying to tell us. Here is another one. , I remember somebody trying to walk their dog into a grooming shop and the dog curled up in a ball, curled up in a ball, really, really tight on the floor, refusing to move. Is that a dog who is being stubborn? I refuse to go in there. [00:20:38] Right? Or is that a dog who, when they curl up in a ball, the body language of curling up in a ball is, I am afraid. I'm afraid! That's what curling up in a ball means. Curling up in a ball is I'm scared. So, how can you be scared and, and also stubborn and trying to take over the world? If a dog is frightened, we should be trying to help them be calm. [00:21:06] And then all of our problems can be looked at differently. How can I help this dog calm down? How can I help this dog feel more comfortable? But if you assume that the dog is being stubborn, what is an owner likely to do? In this case, the owner was getting more and more angry. And this dog was becoming more and more afraid. [00:21:25] It's really common. This is the cycle. So we know that animals have emotions, but we also have to think about, are we interpreting those emotions through very human eyes? And like I said, we are not good at interpreting emotions with other people, other people who are literally talking to us in a language we share, texting us. [00:21:50] Who, you know, how often do you misinterpret something is like, wow, he was really, really mean. Was she, was she, hmm, interesting. Can we see both sides? And I'll tell you what, it's a skillset and it's something that we should be thinking about. So when we talk about... /episode/index/show/creatinggreatgroomingdogs/id/28053081

6 Reasons Why Some Dogs Get Worse Every Time Ep185 09/04/2023

6 Reasons Why Some Dogs Get Worse Every Time Ep185 Why Some Dogs Get Worse Every Time Ep185 [00:00:00] Episode 185. Why do some dogs get worse about grooming time after time and they just keep getting worse? Shouldn't they eventually realize that it doesn't hurt them? Why don't they learn to just go with the flow? That's what we're gonna cover today in episode 185. The Six Reasons Why Some dogs get worse every time. [00:00:18] I am Chrissy Neumyer Smith. This is the Creating Great Grooming Dogs Show. I am a master groomer behavior specialist, a certified professional groomer, a certified behavior consultant for canines, a certified professional dog trainer, an instructor at Whole Pet Grooming Academy, and I'm the owner of Happy Critters in Nashua, New Hampshire. [00:00:35] And this my friends and colleagues, is the show where dog grooming and dog training meet. So I wanna talk about six reasons why some dogs get worse every time. There are plenty of other reasons, but I narrowed it down to about six. But the first and foremost, before we even get into those six reasons, I do wanna clarify. [00:00:55] Dogs are having difficulty with being groomed. They aren't giving us a difficult problem. They are having a problem. So at its very core, if a dog is continuing to have problems, then their issue isn't being addressed. And I want you to pause and think about that for a minute. 'cause we don't often think about it that way. [00:01:16] Does this dog have an issue that maybe has been overlooked? Maybe we haven't really found out what makes this dog tick and that's really common. So we'll go through six reasons. Why many of these dogs have an issue, but really at the end, there are lots and lots of reasons for a dog to continue to have difficulty being groomed, and that's what's happening. [00:01:39] If a dog is getting worse every time or staying the same, staying at the same level of, nervousness, aggressiveness, , it's because they have an underlying issue that maybe hasn't been addressed. So let's get into our six reasons. And I'm gonna say I did pull this off of a Facebook discussion. [00:01:58] This was directly out of a Facebook discussion. , I didn't join into the discussion. I know I probably should have, but I decided to make a podcast episode instead. , because there are so many reasons, and it's more than just a quick post, but what I found was a lot of groomers, , were concerned about just one aspect. [00:02:17] So a lot of these six reasons came up. We aren't always thinking about all of them. Everybody had like a quick one or two answers, maybe not six or 20,000. 'cause really it's more like 20,000. So let's talk about the first one. And if you are involved with any of my classes or anything like that, or involved with dog training, one of the first things I always want us to do if we see a behavior problem, whether you're a trainer or a groomer, Anything. [00:02:46] If you see a behavior problem or a behavior problem that's continuing to get worse, our first question is, is there a health issue? Is there a physical reason for this pet to be behaving this way? And I'm gonna say pet, because these are not just for dogs. A lot of these things are for, for cats too, for other types of animals. [00:03:05] If there is a behavior problem happening, I want us to first think, is there a physical reason? So health issues could be something like pain. And I know that a lot of people who are not groomers might not realize that. A lot of our dogs live with a lot of different types of pain. Just like people come on, they get older, they maybe have sore hips or sore toes, or ear problems or tooth problems. [00:03:33] , lots of things that could be causing pain. And a lot of our owners don't recognize that. They don't see it, they don't notice it. And sometimes they kind of beat themselves up when we tell them. , but I want you to think about. Is there a reason why this dog could be in pain? So I think we tend to think about older dogs, you know, our senior dogs, but I'm gonna throw out here, let's not forget our adult dogs. [00:04:00] Maybe they had an injury, maybe they were running up the stairs and just, you know, fell funny. There are lots of things that could happen. And with our puppies, our puppies are teething. Think about that as a source of pain, what do human babies do when they're teething? They cry, they're fussy [00:04:16] so think about there are lots of different types of pain and discomfort. Discomfort. Let's think about how many dogs just find this uncomfortable. The reason why dogs have behavior problems during grooming, Because they find it unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary. I say that a lot on this show, and if we can all just take that in because it helps us to refocus, like, oh, what is this dog having a problem with? [00:04:45] Does this dog find it unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary and uncomfortable is part of this health issue, so perhaps. It's about how, , this dog can balance while we're trying to move them around. A lot of our dogs have some balance issues. Perhaps it's range of motion. Now you might think, oh, this dog is young and he's just being fussy about this one foot. [00:05:07] If it's only one foot, that to me says What's going on with that foot, or what's going on with the foot that I'm asking him to stand on while I lift this foot? So let me clarify that a little bit. If you are lifting up the dog's right front paw and that's when he gets a little bit fussy, it could be that the right front paw is sore or that's what he's having difficulty with you working on the right front paw. [00:05:33] Or it could be because you're asking him to hold so much more weight on his left front paw if his left front paw is sore. And sometimes we don't think about that and we need to. So let's think about how can I help this dog be more comfortable. That is a really important way to help an animal feel better about grooming. [00:05:53] So that's reason number one, why some dogs are getting worse every time. There could be an underlying health or pain issue that we didn't know about and we aren't thinking about, and that if we can work on that or modify our sessions for, for that dog to be more comfortable, we might be able to make progress. [00:06:12] 'cause dogs aren't giving us a hard time, they're having a hard time. Reason number two, and this one is really, really common. Reason number two, why some dogs get worse every time is because they have always been afraid of grooming. Each groom has pushed that dog further and further, and sometimes their fear looks like they're frozen. [00:06:35] And we sometimes mistake that for calm, cannot tell you how often we mistake that for calm while he was being so good and then suddenly, Now, if you're not a groomer, you might not know. So I'm gonna describe when we are grooming a dog and a dog is holding still we are focused in on the hair. I might not notice what that dog's face is doing because I might literally be working on the coat on a back leg. [00:07:01] I might not be facing that dog's face. I might not see a whale eye. I might not see other body signals. I might not have a hand on their body to feel if they're loose. I'm scissoring. So if you think about a dog that is scared, sometimes they freeze when they're afraid. And for a lot of groomers, we miss that one. [00:07:21] So ask yourself if this dog is getting worse and worse every time, is this dog just kind of frozen in fear while we groom? Has that been this dog's experience? I'm frozen in fear, but they just keep coming at me and just keep coming at me and just keep coming at me and just keep coming at me. And then it turns it, it goes from frozen to maybe trying to flee. [00:07:40] Or maybe trying to fight, remember, freeze, flight and fight. , so we don't wanna trigger those kind of responses. So think has this dog always been afraid of grooming and now perhaps due to a health issue, or perhaps due to some other situation has become different in the way they express that fear? [00:08:00] Okay, so that's reason number two. Sometimes these dogs had been afraid of grooming for years. I see it a lot. I see it a lot when I end up with an elderly dog who the groomer said, you know what? He, he's just becoming so difficult and he's so fragile. You know, he's never really loved it, but now he's really having some problems. [00:08:19] We can still train. We have to think about the pet in front of us. How can we help this individual dog? Now, reason number three, remember we had six reasons why some dogs get worse every time, and reason number three is that I. I find this happens a lot. There's some body language that dogs give us that has been misinterpreted. [00:08:42] We as groomers don't often have a whole lot of background in body language. We know what we know. We see signs, but we don't necessarily understand what the dog is doing. I'm gonna give you a couple of examples. , if a dog is nervous and they're trying to tone down the situation, , they're nervous, and they're trying to say , Hey, listen, can you back off? [00:09:02] I'm a little bit scared. They might start sitting or turning away or curling up into a little ball, like pulling those little legs in tight. , Raising one paw. These are all things that dogs do to try to calm everybody else down. Like, listen, I'm really uncomfortable. Uh, I don't mean you any harm. Please leave me alone. [00:09:25] Yet, it makes haircutting harder. And if we're not aware that, that's a very clear signal from a dog that they're saying like, listen, I'm really nervous. I'm really scared. We can end up becoming frustrated. So the dog keeps sitting and we keep pulling up to stand and the dog keeps sitting and keep pulling up to stand. [00:09:43] And as we get frustrated, the dog does it more and more. And I've sometimes heard people saying that, their dog's being passive aggressive. That's not passive aggressive. The dog is saying, I'm really nervous, and you're like, knock it off. I know a little exaggerated, , but you're not listening to the, I'm really nervous and you keep doing things to make it worse by accident because you're just thinking, I just need you to stand, buddy. [00:10:05] I need you to stand, or I need you to look, I need to look straight at your face. And the dog is trying to tell you like, I'm really nervous. And if you think about looking straight into a dog's eyes and holding their face really, really straight, when they're nervous, they turn away. That is normal and polite amongst dog society, if you will. [00:10:25] And we as groomers see it is really frustrating. So for us to take a step back and think about the body language we are witnessing and what the dog might be trying to tell us, is this unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary? And if it is, how can I help this dog? In this moment to realize that this is, you can trust me. [00:10:47] We're gonna be okay. Everything's gonna be fine. Can I diffuse that? Because if they keep getting worse every time, there's a pretty good chance that they've been giving some body language that we might have missed. Okay, so think about that because it can create a vicious cycle. The dog's like, oh, I'm so nervous. [00:11:06] And we're like, I'm getting frustrated and the dog's like, that makes me more nervous. , and it does not mean that this dog is defective or that somebody did something terrible to him. One of my own dogs, if I'm frustrated, Even if it's not with him, I drop a spoon in the kitchen if I see him frustrated, he's like, oh, curls up in a little ball. [00:11:26] , like, oh, I just wish everything was fun like it was five minutes ago. It's just the way he responds to the humans around him being frustrated. I can only imagine what he would do if he ha he was on a grooming table and someone was telling him to knock it off when he was trying to say, I'm nervous. [00:11:42] So ponder that for a minute. If dogs are getting worse every time we see them, there are some reasons, and that reason always backs up to they're finding it unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary. Okay, so that was three. We have health issues as number one. We have number two, the pet has always been afraid of grooming. [00:12:04] We have number three, we have some body language that might have been misinterpreted. And like I said, sitting, turning away, curling into a ball might feel like that dog is fighting you. And so you fight back and you know it, it's just a vicious cycle. So that could be happening. So let's kick a little break and we're gonna move on to four, five, and six. [00:12:24] If you're enjoying the show, remember to subscribe, follow, like, share whatever it is you're doing on whatever platform you're using. The show is also available as a podcast. You can find it anywhere you listen to podcasts. It is also available on YouTube. And to find any of those, go to creating great grooming dogs.com. [00:12:46] So number four, we have reason number four of Why Dogs. Some dogs get worse every time. Now this one is something that I wish more groomers knew about. What about age-related issues? Now, what does that mean? Here is a classic example. We are working with a dog as a puppy, and this dog is doing really well as a puppy. [00:13:09] We do all of our homework. We're working with them every time, and then they get to about that adolescent phase, and suddenly, suddenly it happens, right? Because adolescents and teenagers respond to things differently. I want you to think about the dog that at that age, that starts getting worse. [00:13:28] Might be because we are working with an adolescent who has less patience than they had as a puppy. What I know, I was a really agreeable little kid. I turned into a teenager and I was not as agreeable, and then I grew out of it. All right. Think about that. , the adolescent phase, and it's not that they're trying to be mean or they're trying to take over the world, just that they have much shorter attention spans. [00:13:55] , their patience is about as small as it's ever gonna be in their entire life, okay? And we sometimes start treating them like adults because at this age, an adolescent dog looks so grown up. Sometimes what we're seeing when we have dogs that just keep getting worse every time, or what I worked with him as he was a puppy, and now look what's happening, what's happening? [00:14:19] And sometimes that's because they were a puppy and they were doing all right for a while, and then they reach this age where they have no patience at all. They go through a second fear imprint stage that many people don't even know about. , so second fear imprint stage is just this extra time where they're extra spooky. [00:14:38] Usually happens around eight or nine months old. , but maybe that's when the first grooming happens, we've all seen that, or, you know, they've been coming in all along and this is the well now he's not a baby anymore and we're gonna do a full groom and he knows better and we sometimes feel like he should know better. [00:14:56] But that's an adolescent dog having a tough time. They're having a hard time doing the things that we're asking them to do. Sometimes if we're having an adolescent dog, that continues to get worse every time because you know, from year old to two and a half, probably right there in that prime area, for a dog to be having these adolescent issues, right? [00:15:19] We need to think about how can I help this dog find this more pleasant? How can I help them be calm, comfortably cooperative so that we can help them get through it? If they're continuing to get worse at that age, it might be because you're just pushing them too hard. That's not wishy-washy. I know sometimes people are like, oh my God, but they need to be groomed. [00:15:41] But this is an investment in 15 years of grooming that 15 year lifespan. If this dog is a year old, he has 14 more years of grooming, why ruin it now? Because we feel like he absolutely has to be perfect today when we can help build that trust and help them become comfortably cooperative for all of our future groomings, it's an investment. [00:16:05] So right now it is September 4th, 2023. Dogs being born right now will be being groomed if we're basing it on 15 years will be being groomed in September of 2038. 2038. Okay, everyone think about 15 years. What are you gonna be doing in 2038? Are you still gonna be fighting this dog? That's crazy to me, it makes no sense. [00:16:31] So anybody who's like just forced them to make it happen is probably seeing dogs that get worse every time. And that new dog that's just got born this year that's just getting born right now, that's gonna be groomed until 2038, could learn to hate grooming forever. Or they could. Spend some extra time in the beginning and be aware of what this dog is experiencing at each level. [00:16:57] So teen related issues are part of the age related issues. Now, we also have from adult to senior, another really common age related issue. Sometimes we miss the beginning of that. We're thinking, oh, I've been grooming this dog for years. I know exactly what to expect. And then one particular day, this dog is being a little bit difficult. [00:17:17] I say being difficult when what we really mean is having difficulty. This dog is having difficulty today that maybe is making my job a little bit harder as a groomer, but need to think about for some dogs, they start having some health problems earlier than maybe we suspect maybe that's, a chronic shoulder issue. [00:17:37] Maybe it's, a back foot that they have trouble with. Maybe it's something to do with their tail, but they start having some age related issues. Often earlier than we would guess before they're old and frail. , as someone who's a middle-aged woman right now, I gotta say there are some age related issues. [00:17:54] So let's just think about that for a minute. Am I able to do the things I was able to do in my twenties? A lot of them, but not all of them. We need to think about these ages too. So if we have a dog who is getting worse every time, let's think about if they're transitioning from one age to another, if they're having some issues, some difficulties that maybe we can explore more. [00:18:18] Reason number five, what is going on at home? It's a good question. , actually, I will say the Facebook discussion that I saw was really focused in on, well, what are the owners doing at home? And it's a good question. We don't wanna throw owners under the bus, but we do need to know what's happening at home. [00:18:37] So things that could be happening at home, that could be making a dog get worse and worse every time. A lot of our owners could be struggling with behavior problems on a daily basis, things that maybe you don't even know about. , all right. Non groomers to the trainers out there, dog trainers, you have a blind spot. [00:18:57] And let me tell you what, it's the blind spot for dog trainers is that everyone who approaches you about dog training recognizes they have a problem and have made at least one step toward maybe fixing it. Dog groomers often see people who have no idea that that's not normal, who don't see it as a problem at all. [00:19:18] So if they're at home and they think nothing of the fact that their dog will growl at them if they sit on the couch next to him. What do you think that dog does during grooming? Yet there might be a groomer who thinks, I don't know what's going on with this dog. He's so weird about grooming, when really this dog has a much bigger problem. [00:19:37] So it's important for us to ask our owners what's going on at home? Are they brushing? Do they fight with the brush? Have they been brushing? And the dog eventually growls at them and then they stop, and now they can only pick up the brush and the dog starts growling. There are a lot of things that owners are doing at home that we can explore. [00:19:55] Perhaps there's something else going on at home.... /episode/index/show/creatinggreatgroomingdogs/id/27938088

But We Touch Their Feet! Ep184 08/26/2023

But We Touch Their Feet! Ep184 Episode 184, but we touch his feet. We touch his feet, just like the trainer and the groomer. And the veterinarian said, why is this dog still having a problem? That's our question for this week. This is the Creating Great Grooming Dogs show. I'm Chrissy Neumyer Smith. I'm a certified professional groomer, a certified behavior consultant for canines, a certified professional dog trainer. I'm a fear free certified groomer and. Fear free certified trainer. And I'm also a master groomer behavior specialists. I'm an instructor at the Whole Pet Grooming Academy, and I own Happy Critters in Nashua, New Hampshire. And this, my friends and colleagues is the show where grooming and training meet. So this week, we are going to talk about. Foot touching. It's really common advice. Most pet owners have heard this. We want to prevent problems. We want your dog to feel comfortable with having their feet done and their nails done by massaging their feet often. And a lot of our owners do that. A lot of our owners are really great about, Massaging that dog's feet pretty often. And getting that done. Now here's the problem. We still have problems with our dogs and their feet. And why is that? I mean, if, if you're thinking about it, but I massage his feet and a lot of our owners have been doing it and doing a great job, but why do we still see problems? Now there are a couple of reasons. And the one I want to start off with is. Foot touching is not like nail trimming. Oh, I know everyone just went. What. But wait, but we touch his feet. But for many dogs that's enough. Okay. It's not a bad idea to touch their feet. Just that for so many dogs, that's not enough. For a lot of our dogs. They're like, ah, cool. Okay. Someone touches my feet and I don't mind when it turns into, touching them with tools or trimming nails. So let's talk a little bit more about why that doesn't translate. So touching feet is an important part of doing a nail trim. But when an owner is massaging a dog's feet. Let's talk about just that foot massage thing that most of our owners do. And if you're an owner, you have probably done this. You've got your dog on the sofa and you're gently rubbing a foot and just kind of relaxing and your dog doesn't have to really do anything. They're probably laying on the couch and you're just like massage in their foot. And that is nothing like holding an individual toe. Holding an individual toenail. And then moving a tool and actually trimming. Or grinding. Think about some of the tools that we have. So let's talk about some of those. , We have touching the pot in a different way than many people do a foot massage. Foot massages tend to be kind of haphazard and like snugly wuggly. And that's a great place to start. Okay. Every dog should start there. If they can't handle that, they're not going to be able to handle other types of touching. Just that the problem is, is that it doesn't go far enough. It doesn't translate well to all the other things that we need them to be doing. So let's talk about touching in terms of also individual toes, maybe it's part of you as an owner or as the handler, or as the person who's working with this dog. Pretending to have to really see that nail. But like, our focus is different than when we're just casually touching feet. When we actually are like, oh, I need to see that. What is that? What is that? They're out there. That's really different. When we're holding individual toes, when we're trying to pull hair back away from a toe. When we're trying to brush a foot. We have things like brushes and Combs, maybe scissors. Um, we have a Clippers, the hair trimmers, right? Those vibrate. They make some sound. have a variety of different types of tools that we might touch feet with and that's more than just a massage. It doesn't really say the same thing as a massage, as a foot massage. Let's also talk about, the sprayer in the tub. It sounds weird and it feels funny. It's not like a foot massage. So the foot massages. Are a good start. All right. I, I fully believe that. Awesome. Go forth and massage your dog's feet. I just know that it doesn't necessarily prepare your dog. For the other types of foot touching that are essential to grooming. And veterinary care and other types of care. Even if you have a dog that does not really require any real trimming. Every single dog out there has some sort of nail care needs, and maybe your dog wears their nails down really well on their own. They probably will not wear their nails down very well on their own for their entire life. So. It's a good idea for us now. To just go ahead and teach that dog to be comfortable with nail trimming and going through the motions and feeling what that feels like. So, like I said, we have a number of tools and some of them make noise and some of them are vibration. Um, some of them, um, need to be positioned in a way that this dog may not be used to. Maybe this dog isn't used to anybody looking underneath their foot. They're only getting foot massages from the top. Um, maybe the dog is having trouble standing. While we touch feet. Like balancing on three legs while somebody is doing something to one foot is not laying on the couch, getting his foot massage where you think we can all agree on that. Like, oh yeah, that's going to be significantly different. Than laying on the sofa, getting a foot massage to have to stand up. While somebody lifts a foot and now you're balancing on three legs and then they did it to every single foot. What all four of them. Usually. I find a lot of dogs start getting impatient at about the third foot. They're like, are you serious? Are you going to do this to every single one? Because we haven't really necessarily prepared them for the kind of things that we're going to realistically need to do. Now let's also talk about. The fact that we're doing foot touching. And we're not at home. Now we have a new place. We have a new place. Maybe it's a new situation. Maybe it's a new person. Think about how many dogs aren't necessarily great with strangers aren't necessarily good at being away from the house. Um, now we have a dog who is, um, having their feet touched. Maybe on a table now they're standing on a table. Well, that's nothing like laying on the sofa, getting a foot massage. They're standing on a table. And someone such in their feet. They feel like they have to balance. They're being they're balancing on three legs and someone's doing something weird to their foot, laying on the sofa, getting a foot massage has not really prepared them for that experience. Perhaps it's being in the tub and now they're in a tub and someone wants to pick up their foot and they're leaning over them. Have you ever really thought about what our body language is? When a dog is in a tub? We're kinda looming over them. If somebody said, Hey, get that dog to bite you in the face. What might you try? Well you might try looming over them. It doesn't make sense that for a dog to understand why we are doing such weird things. It's definitely different than laying on the sofa and getting your foot massage. And that's why I think that we need to help our owners understand that some dogs may think that's enough and that's great. I will tell you in my own personal home right now. Brok one of my guys is like a, touch me a new word kind of guy. Never had a problem with any of it. Sure. You can touch me. You can touch me anywhere you want. I'm totally fine with all of it. Um, He would probably be just fine if all he got was foot massages and would translate that directly to yeah, sure. I'm comfortable with anything. But it's kind of, because he's an I'm comfortable with anything kind of guy. Now, my other guy, I got him when he was almost three and that's Po. And he didn't really understand, like why anybody would touch a dog beyond their shoulder blades. We pet dogs on the head. Why would anybody touch me there? It wasn't about his feet. It was about touching anywhere beyond his head and his ears and his neck. Those are places that people touch dogs. The other parts were like, why would you do that? You weirdo. So for that dog. I needed to teach him to be comfortable. With other types of touching. If I just went to grab his foot. Instead of teaching them about like, I get to touch your whole body. Okay. That I think is where some of this foot touching stuff has gone out of context. It doesn't really make sense in what we're trying to do. Because if they're not comfortable with you touching them all over. Don't you think they're going to be extra uncomfortable with touching their feet? [00:09:02] So, let me give you an example. All right. As a person, maybe you're not comfortable with strangers approaching you. And now you're at Walmart and the person behind you in Walmart wants to shove their finger in your ear. [00:09:15] All right. Can we all agree that that would seem a little weird? I think any of us would be a little bit alarmed, like what is going on? You know, Like these dogs don't understand the kind of things that we're trying to do to them. And if they don't understand, we need to help them understand that this is safe, how to be calm, comfortable, and cooperative, and that there are a couple of people in their life. That need to do this type of stuff. All right. Maybe it's not the guy in line behind you at Walmart, but to them it may seem that random until you teach them like, okay, this is your groomer. This is your veterinarian. When we're here at this place, or when this equipment is out, um, That this is normal. It's safe. You're fine. Versus I'm going to massage your feet on the sofa. Which isn't the same. It's not the same. Um, again, we're going back to the example of the person in Walmart, in line behind you in Walmart, who just like chose to put a finger in your ear. What if that was something medically necessary? You would need a little bit of time for someone to help you figure that out. Otherwise, I don't know much. You. I'm gonna straight up admit I'd probably be aggressive. [00:10:29] Right. It's like, dude, get your finger out of my ear. So we need to think about these dogs and why massaging their feet is very different than the kind of things we normally do. And we'll talk about more of that in the next part. [00:10:43] If you're enjoying the show, please share this show with somebody else who might enjoy this show. [00:10:48] So what other reasons might a dog have an issue with their feet? What if they've had their foot massages, you know, they're on the couch and they're getting their foot massage by their owners. Um, and yet they're still having problems. Well, here is something else for us to consider. Let's ask our owners when you are massaging feet, what does that look like? How does your dog respond to it? Um, and the reason why I'm specifically pointing this out is because there are a lot of owners who are like, well, we got to teach them to be good. And are kind of traumatizing their dogs and forcing this foot issue. Instead of helping them be comfortable with it. There's still this old mindset that happens where, um, we start thinking that we have to show the dog who's boss. And that this dog must learn to do it and he must learn it now. And. And we can be really weird about that. Um, I say we, because I've been there too, right? Show of hands who here has fell for that stuff and said, well, I gotta get it done. Um, a lot of our owners take our advice and are really strong arming their dog. Like holding them down and no, you be good. I'm going to touch your feet. You be good. I'm going to . I've got to touch your feet it's what the trainer said I needed to do this week and not necessarily understanding that. Our purpose. For touching feet. Our purpose is for the dog to feel like that is safe and normal. And calm, comfortable and cooperative. Now, keep in mind if. If you're new to the show, we talk about calm, comfortable, and cooperative a lot. Calm is when the dog is relaxed about it. Comfortable. Can can be that they're physically comfortable. Um, if they have a foot problem, then we need to be really gentle or maybe adapt to make them more comfortable or as comfortable as we can help them be. Um, and cooperative takes two. Cooperative is different than obedient cooperative takes two. It takes two of us to be cooperative. I'm willing to give a little and take a little to help us work together. So if an owner is trying to force it instead of, Hey, we need you to be comfortable with it. It's really common for owners to not understand that distinction. So we need to help them understand that this is really important. For your dog to be able to feel like this is safe with them at home. Before we start adding tools before we start adding strangers, before we start adding I'm doing it on a table or doing it in a tub or even doing it standing up. But those are some things that owners need to help with. All right. If you are at home and you can not touch your dog's shoulder. They are probably not going to be good for a groomer for nail trimming. Right. I mean, think about it. If you looked at a dog whose owner can't touch him. And you're a dog groomer. Are you thinking, oh, he's probably great for nails. No. You're not yet that dog's grimmer might not know that this dog is having those problems with that owner. They might not know. Sometimes we have to talk to our owners and really find out what is going on. How does this look at home? If you try to wipe his feet off, when he comes in muddy. How does your dog respond to that? Now I'm going to circle back here. To something that we've talked about in previous episodes. But I'm only going to cover it really quickly. Really quickly. Um, but there's a way to ask owners. To really help assess what we are, what we can expect from this dog. And it also helps owners understand what they need to know about what we can expect from this dog. Now I'll ask an owner. What does your dog do if he doesn't like something? What does he do? Owners know. Yeah. Does he try to run away? Does he growl? Does he air snap? Does he try to, you know, sink his teeth into a body part? Um, do you honestly have a dog who seems to like everything and some of our dogs are just so happy go lucky that could be the case, but let's ask them, what does your dog do if he doesn't like something? [00:15:12] That's question number one of my four questions. Question number two. What does your dog do? If he doesn't like something you're doing to him? Oh, that's a different one. Isn't it? Oh, something I'm doing to him. You might need to give them examples. Yeah. You need to wipe an eye boogy. What does your dog do? You know, you've got a pricker stuck in his fur behind his ear. What does your dog do if he doesn't like that? Um, what does your dog do? If you have to wipe something off his tail and he doesn't like it, what does your dog do? If he doesn't like something you are doing to him? That's question number two. So question number three. Is what does your dog do if you don't stop? Oh, that's such a good question. Isn't it? So our owners who are massaging feet at home and the dog is not doing well with it. And the owner is trying to force it. They're going to say, well, he doesn't like it. Okay. Tell me what that looks like. What does he do? What does he do when he doesn't like you massaging his feet? What does it look like? What does he do if you don't stop? Now I will tell you for many of our owners, they're like, oh, I always stop. [00:16:25] So, what do you, what do you think he's going to do if you didn't stop? And then the fourth question. So we have our three questions already. The first question is what does your dog do if he doesn't like something. Second question is what does your dog do? If they don't like something you're doing to them? The third question is, what does your dog do if you don't stop? Now, our fourth question is what do you think your dog will do when I, as a stranger? Don't stop. [00:16:57] And that's when owners understand. Oh, Oh, yeah. I don't think he's going to be good about that at all. Yeah. That's when they get it. And that's how we can help them understand that this is a safety issue. This is safety. We're not being lazy, everyone. So the non groomers out there. Can hear this. Alright. Non-groomers. Groomers don't turn dogs away because they're lazy. They don't shave dogs because they're lazy. They don't do stuff because they're lazy. They they're trying to keep everybody safe and they're trying to provide care for a pet. Groomers are not lazy. Groomers are really hardworking, just like every other animal professional out there. It's not easy working with animals. All right. So where do you said that now? If, like I said, if. If your dog. Won't let you handle at home. Continuing when they, you, when you're doing something they don't like. What do you think they will do? When I, as a stranger do not stop. Because that's what owners think they're paying for. Right. If you're an owner and you're listening to this, you're probably thinking, well, yeah, he hates having his nails done. That's why I bring them to a professional. You know, of course he's going to bite you. No, no. There's no, of course he's going to bite you. That's not what we do. My hairdresser does not have to worry about me trying to punch her in the face. Um, that's not what groomers do. We're pet stylists. And it's not a medical emergency. Your veterinarian doesn't need to deal with that either. That should only be an animal who is injured and panicking and medical emergency kind of situation. That is not okay. So. Circling back to massaging feet. If an owner is massaging feed with the knowledge that this is about helping your dog. Feel safe. Feel calm, comfortable, and cooperative. And that we're going to build on that. That it's not going to directly relate to being on a grooming table with a stranger and a tool, but that an owner can build on that. So massaging feet. Is a good thing to do. If we're making sure that the animal feels safe. We are going to making sure that they're calm, comfortable, and cooperative. And also, if we understand that for some animals, we're going to need to do more work than just massage feet. I know nobody wants to hear it, but some dogs are not going to be able to just take that and go, oh, I guess I can also be touched with grinders. Uh, trimmers and Clippers and brushes and Combs and, and do it all while I'm standing. Um, foot massaging. It isn't necessarily the advice that everybody needs. It's a good start. But we need to think about it more thoroughly because seriously, there's just a point where. I think we've all seen dogs who have problems, despite a large amount of foot massages on the sofa. Um, which is really teaching them to be good for foot massagers on the sofa. [00:20:10] If you want to know more, you can go to creating great grooming dogs. Dot com I do want to thank everybody. I know I took a break from the podcast for a little while. I got really overwhelmed with a number of things going on in my life. And thank you all for reaching out. Um, on back, I had took a vacation. All the things to reset my batteries. Thank you so much for hanging out. And I'm listening to my podcast every week and reaching out and saying you wanted more of it. Um, but the show was back, so yay. And if you want to know more about the programs that I offer, I offer things through whole pet grooming academy. That's whole pet nh.com. And actually my first level class for the master groomer behavior specialist program is actually available now as two self-paced classes. So you might want to check that out. That's whole pet nh.com have a great week. /episode/index/show/creatinggreatgroomingdogs/id/27856860

Ep183 The Customer Service Angle 04/26/2023

Ep183 The Customer Service Angle This week we're talking about how to make owners happy. How do we make a living working on dogs with difficulty with grooming? Now, this is very much for the groomers, but this is also for owners to understand where groomers are coming from and for the trainers and for anybody else because our customer service angle in the grooming industry needs to be tweaked and needs to be changed. My example of a Safety Policy. "To provide the highest level of care for your pet, we have a safety policy. If at any time your pet gets nervous, anxious, scared, aggressive, or even overly silly, we slow down and help your pet to be comfortable and calm. It’s very important to us that the pets in our care are kept safe and stress-free. We use sharp tools and need to prevent injuries. We will work with your pet to help them feel comfortable. This will build a great experience for successful groomings for your pet’s lifetime. Your pet may not be groomed to perfection today. We will charge for the time that we spend working with your pet." Ep183 === [00:00:00] Chrissy: Episode 180 3. This week we're talking about how to make owners happy. How do we make a living working on dogs with difficulty with grooming? Now, this is very much for the groomers, but this is also for owners to understand where groomers are coming from and for the trainers and for anybody else because our customer service angle. [00:00:19] In the grooming industry needs to be tweaked, needs to be changed. This is the Creating Great Grooming Dog Show. I'm Chrissy Neumyer Smith. I'm a master groomer behavior specialist. I'm a certified professional dog trainer, a certified behavior consultant for canines, a certified professional groomer. I am an instructor at Whole Pet Grooming Academy and I own Happy Critters in Nashua, New Hampshire. [00:00:40] And this my friends and colleagues is the show. We're grooming and training Meet. Start off with the common story that I hear from groomers. Okay. Because a lot of groomers reach out to me. My Facebook group and my Facebook page haven't been very active because I think that, um, most of the time people just reach out to me directly. [00:00:58] And that's awesome. That's great guys. If you feel like we're friends, we are. So just go ahead and reach out and I will contact you. But what happens is, this is when I hear a lot is, , he was so bad that by the end he was being really aggressive. What should I do next time? How do I work on a dog like that? [00:01:15] Now my question is, did you complete the groom? And they're like, well, yes. But by the end he was really getting so much worse. But that is because you keep trying to get the grooming finished. Okay. So I wanna talk about how we can help our owners be happy and understand what we're doing while also helping the dog, because there's a customer service angle that needs to be tweaked just a little bit. [00:01:44] We are allowing our customers to think, I want this haircut. I'm buying a haircut. Like it's an object on a shelf. You know, you sold that. Guy a haircut, and that's the haircut I want for my dog. So that customer got one and my dog can't, you know, like as if it's [00:02:00] available for purchase. It's just an object. [00:02:02] Okay? The things that we do are not objects on a shelf. We are selling services. Services are different than an item. Now when we think about it that way, we know as groomers, some dogs are a lot more work than other dogs. Every dog's gonna be a little bit different. Every BK is gonna be a little bit different. [00:02:23] Maybe those owners brush every day and are very, very good about keeping that dog maintained and others are not. We understand when it's coat issues, but we need to take that into behavior issues. We need to take that information and pull it back. To behavior issues too. The dog, that's a lot more effort to groom because the dog is having trouble being groomed, and unfortunately, if we get stuck in the mindset that we have to get this trim done, we need to get this haircut done, we need this dog to look a certain way. [00:02:58] That's what our owners are buying, and that's what we are selling. What happens is the behavior ends up getting ignored. Or just worked over. So in the case of he was so bad by the end, you know, like, what do I do next time? By the end, he was being really aggressive. I mean, he was bad from the beginning, but wow. [00:03:17] By the end, right? That's predictable. He, this dog is literally trying to tell you, I am not comfortable with this. This makes me very, very uncomfortable. And we're saying, uh, sorry dude, your daddy wants a haircut and, okay. I hear you. I've been there. You know, you're like, I, I've gotta get this trim finished. [00:03:37] I didn't suspect that you were gonna act like this, and your coat is in good shape. And that's what I told your owners when you were in our office, and that's what I thought we were gonna sell you. So we need to step back and go, wait a minute, wait a minute. This dog is not handling this process very well, and this is the customer service angle for us to talk to our owners. [00:03:59] . Your dog [00:04:00] is not handling this very well. Your dog is not well prepared for our services. Now, grimmer, I want you to make this distinction. We say that when a coat isn't well prepared for our services, right? The dog that's totally, totally matted, and they're like, we just want a bath and a little bit of trimming. [00:04:18] Can we come back in an hour? And we're like, oh, I'm very, very sorry. That cannot happen because the coat, what's going on with your dog's coat is not gonna allow us to do this in an hour. Even if maybe another dog could have a quick bath and brush out and dry in an hour, your dog cannot because your dog's coat condition. [00:04:37] We need to do that with behavior. Groomers we're used to saying no. We're used to telling people that they can't get what they wanted today and how to get them on the right track. So if we think about it that way, now we can say your dog's behavior, he is not ready for this. If your dog panics when the dryer is on, your dog cannot be fluff dried. [00:04:59] Yet. Yet there is training we can do, and that's why we need to talk about this. As an industry, we need to talk about this, but also we need to talk about this with our owners. I would like very much for your dog to go home in a beautiful trim, but your dog's not well prepared for our services today. Your dog doesn't understand what's happening. [00:05:21] Your dog finds this difficult. Your dog finds this scary. Your dog finds everything we're doing, very threatening, and I think that a lot of the time we think aggression. A dog who's being very forward, very direct with us and hard eye and air snaps and stuff. , we think of that as a dog who's very, very brave. [00:05:39] But that's a dog who, while they might be being brave, is being brave because they feel they're being threatened, they are uncomfortable with what is happening. So at its core, it is still fear. We need to teach these dogs to trust us and to feel comfortable so that we can continue to work with them throughout their whole life. [00:05:58] So if we talk to our owners saying, [00:06:00] your dog is finding this really difficult, have you done anything at home to prepare him? , have you worked on anything? Let's talk about what's happening at home, or how are things going at home? And I'm gonna say here, Non-G groomers don't understand what groomers do. [00:06:14] Everybody in the world thinks they know what groomers do, but if you're not a groomer, probably have some gaps in your knowledge, even if you have groomed your own dogs for years, all five dogs in your lifetime, you have gaps in your knowledge. But the same is true for dog trainers. Non dog trainers have no idea what dog trainers do. [00:06:33] So when we meet in the middle, we have to think about how we can help this dog. Be comfortable with the things that are going to have to happen. And I'll tell you, like I said, non trainers, like every Tom, Dick and Harry, who's taught a dog to sit, thinks they're a dog trainer. And I'm sorry you're not . [00:06:53] You're not. , but the thing is, is that trainers, if they don't know what a dog needs to know how to do, They might be preparing them for things that really don't apply to the grooming setting. And so groomers get frustrated with trainers. Now trainers, trainers are thinking, well, if the groomer's just gonna force this dog through the whole grooming, Then this dog is going to get worse because yes, that's often what happens. [00:07:20] It is. But they don't know that groomers are trying to get a trim done because groomers feel pressured to sell haircuts and pretty looking dog grooming. And I need groomers to think about that for a minute. Like, okay, wait a minute. This dog is literally telling me, please stop back off. I'm not comfortable with this. [00:07:41] This makes me really, really scared. , I'm gonna have to keep air snapping or twirling or screaming or whatever it is they're doing, and it's going to accelerate. We should not be surprised when by the end that dog is much, much worse. That's not a surprise. That is. Exactly what we should be expecting [00:08:00] and to think that this dog is going to be worse than next time. [00:08:04] Okay? Pushing dogs past what they can handle does not help them be better the next time. We have to think not just about today's grooming, but we have to think about next time. Now, the other part about that is what should I do next time and , when groomers ask me that, what do I do next time? [00:08:23] What I tell them is we have to go back. We have to circle back to the beginning. We have to help this dog feel calm, comfortable, and cooperative. We're gonna have to set up some sessions that do not focus in on how beautiful this trim is, and we need to talk to our owners about it. I would love for him to look perfect, but frankly, if he's trying to bite at me, I cannot get his face beautiful. [00:08:49] We need to teach him to trust us and to let us put our tools on him. Owners do not understand the safety part. Think about that for a minute. I think a lot of non groomers do not understand the safety part. I've had people say, how could a dog get nicked during grooming? I'm like, you work with dogs for a living? [00:09:09] Have you ever tried putting something sharp? Next to an ear or a toe while they're wiggling around, of course accidents happen. We're using sharp things, and they all say, why would you use something sharp? Wow, guys, if you're not a groomer, let me, let me tell you right now, if it's not sharp, it won't cut hair. [00:09:33] It doesn't trim nails, right? I mean, a grinder, grinds nails, but a nail trimmer needs to be sharp. Scissors need to be sharp. Clippers are sharp. Pretty much everything we put on your dog could injure your dog. If your dog bites down hard on a comb, that metal comb is gonna do some damage bites down hard on a brush. [00:09:50] Yep. They can rip their tongue open. There are a lot of ways that a dog who is not handling this well. Can hurt themselves. And as groomers, we need to [00:10:00] remember that there's a safety portion to this for us to tell owners, I want your dog to get a beautiful trim. Oh, I love beautiful trims, but your dog is not well prepared for that. [00:10:12] And we need to help them prepare for that. We need to help them trust us and use our tools, and use our tools in the way that will help them have a beautiful trim, if that's what that dog needs. But even the, the regular bath and brush out. A lot of our dogs, if you think about like the labs, okay, as an example, labs don't get a whole lot of trimming, but they get a lot of de shedding and so much of that is done with our high velocity dryer, which is noisy. [00:10:40] A lot of dogs have some issues with the high velocity dryer. There's a learning curve before they feel comfortable with letting us de shed them with a big dryer. So there are lots of things that dogs need better preparing. To be able to do so if we get away from this idea that we're selling a haircut. [00:10:58] If you think you're selling a haircut, please send one to me. I would like to have two border collies groomed. You can ship that to Nashua and New Hampshire. I will give you my information. If you can ship it , we'll talk that's the difference between a service and an item, and we need to help our owners understand that. [00:11:18] This isn't a catalog sale where they can like point and say, that's the haircut I want and I want this style head and this style tail on this dog. No matter what. This is exactly what I'm going to get. We as groomers know that it's more complicated than that, but people who are not groomers do not know. [00:11:37] We need to really spell it out. If you're enjoying this show, please remember to follow or subscribe, tell all your grooming friends and , reach out and let me know. I would love to get some reviews. Hey, if you don't ask, they won't do it. I would love some reviews. Make 'em five stars, if you will. Thank you. [00:11:54] So how do we talk to our owners , about this issue? So really I [00:12:00] want you to think about every owner is gonna be a little bit different, and when we talk to an owner, that's our opportunity to say, you know, Hey, before we book anything, I wanna talk to you about safety. About safety. When we explain that this is about safety, this is about keeping their dogs safe. [00:12:20] This is about treating their dog gently, keeping their dog safe, helping their dog learn to be good for their 15 years of grooming. And at any age, a dog can learn to be better for it. In fact, , I'm gonna be so bold here as to say, I know it's very, very bold, but in my opinion and in my experience, this is true over and over and over again, a healthy dog can be taught to be a safe dog. [00:12:44] Maybe they will never enjoy grooming and they will never like grooming. I'm, I mean, my dentist is wonderful, but I don't like to go, you know, my doctor's wonderful. I don't like doctor's appointments. If you think about dog grooming, is this like, oh man, I have to, but we can teach them to be safe. [00:13:02] We can teach them to trust us. We can teach them to be safe with all of our tools, and that will last a lifetime. Teaching a dog to trust us and that this is safe will last their lifetime. Later on, when they start having hip problems and shoulder problems, or , arthritis in their toes, they do not go back to trying to bite us. [00:13:24] If we do the homework now, if we see the problem we have today, today, and address it now, not at the end of a screaming, flailing two hour groom. . It's not okay. It's not okay. And I'm not saying that to be mean. I've been there, I have done that. I have forced dogs through a trim because I just didn't know. [00:13:48] I didn't know. But here's the thing, if we can teach them to be good, doesn't it make a lot of sense to spend the time teaching them to be good, to calm them down, [00:14:00] calm, comfortable, cooperative, Izzy, calm. Then how can I return him to calm before I move on? , does he seem uncomfortable? Okay. Is it uncomfortable [00:14:09] with the tool? Is it uncomfortable with the noise? , is he physically uncomfortable? Is he having trouble standing? , does he have, problems with his teeth? , are my tools causing discomfort because of an injury that this dog has or a health problem that this dog has? How can I help this dog be more comfortable? [00:14:27] When faced with a behavior problem or something that we don't want, I want you to think, can I make this dog calmer? Can I help this dog be comfortable? And is this dog being cooperative? And cooperative takes two. It's not calm, comfortable, and obedient. It's calm, comfortable, and cooperative. Will this dog work with me and can I work with this dog and helping them have a better experience? [00:14:54] And if that means. I do some modified trims that maybe don't look beautiful. That's okay. Everybody take a deep breath. What? But my trims need to be gorgeous. Somebody's gonna call, someone's gonna get upset, or their neighbors are gonna see the dog. Or a dog's gonna leave my shop and he is gonna be a little bit lopsided. [00:15:12] Or take a deep breath. Take a deep breath. That dog isn't well prepared for our services. That dog is very likely to get hurt, behavior problems are when dogs get hurt. People get hurt, and equipment gets broken. You lose money forcing trims on behavior problems. You will lose money. Maybe you haven't yet, but you will. [00:15:35] Okay? The day after an injury is the day you're gonna be like, why did I push that dog through that trim? It was never ever worth it. It was never worth it. if you have to bring a customer's dog to the vet, all right, that could be a couple hundred dollars. Now I have business insurance, but I believe my deductible is 500. [00:15:59] So out of [00:16:00] pocket I could be paying a lot more than that. Groom was out of pocket paying vet bills with an owner who is furious. Okay, let's also talk about that. If owners don't know that there's a safety portion to this, they will be incredibly upset that their dog got hurt, especially oh, especially if you've been giving them a handling fee. [00:16:25] And we're gonna talk about that for a minute cuz I came up in a recent discussion with one of my students. Handling fees are interesting. Handling fee implies that they can just pay more money and have it done. Yeah, think about that. Well, I paid the handling fee. I pay her $5 extra and she nipped my dog. [00:16:46] Ooh, , but I want you to think about from an owner's point of view, they think it's an upsell because he's more work. They do not understand that it's because he is dangerous, because someone could get hurt because their dog could get hurt or a groomer could get hurt. They do not know. [00:17:04] They will be furious. And they think that they can just buy the service, an upsell, right? Like it's a box on a shelf and we need to make it much more clear. There are additional fees for handling dogs with behavior issues because they take a lot more time. Okay. If you, if you label it a handling fee, there are plenty of people, and we all know them who already have the check written out. [00:17:32] I, I mean, who even uses checks anymore except for the people who wanna make sure that they don't have to pay any more. , in case you guys didn't know, that's a definite thing where it's like, oh wait, but if I bring my card, Then I can't say, oh, I already wrote out the check. I mean, it's, it's this much plus the $10 handling fee, right? [00:17:51] Sorry, I already wrote out my check. . They're just gonna think it's a purchase. They will not understand that the training problem is real, [00:18:00] that their dog is having trouble, their dog could get hurt, or that there's a solution set. So basically what happens is you end up with a dog that is bad like this and has trouble with this. [00:18:12] For their entire life. Owner's not working on it. Don't care. Mm-hmm. And then what happens? Now, let's play this out too. We've all heard it. Then what happens? You know, he's just getting so bad that I can't do it anymore. I think it's time to bring him to the vet for sedation grooming. . Or bring him to a vet groomer. [00:18:32] guys, I wanna tell you, there is no veterinarian on the planet who is going to sedate that dog as if for surgery every four to six weeks for their regular grooming. That behavior problem needs to be worked on. That's not the way it works. It's gonna go, oh, well, we have this magical way of doing it. [00:18:51] Okay? This problem needs to be worked on. So if we talk to our owners and say, this is a problem that needs to be worked on, and. Forcing your dog through is not gonna solve it. Putting beautiful haircuts... /episode/index/show/creatinggreatgroomingdogs/id/26656839

Ep182 Science Based Training 04/14/2023

Ep182 Science Based Training This week we're talking about science-based training. What does that mean? Why is there a controversy and what do you need to know? You'll get my take on that this week. Ep182 What Does Science Based Dog Training Mean === [00:00:00] Chrissy: . Episode 180 2 of the show this week we're talking about science-based training. What does that mean? Why is there a controversy and what do you need to know? [00:00:09] You'll get my take on that this week. This is the Creating Great Grooming Dog Show. I'm Chrissy Neumyer Smith. I'm a certified professional groomer, a certified behavior consultant for Canines, a certified professional dog trainer, the owner of Happy Critters in Nashua, New Hampshire, and an instructor at Whole Pet Grooming Academy. And this, my friends and colleagues, is the show we're grooming and training meet. [00:00:31] Science-based dog training. So there's a big debate out there because there are two warring factions in the dog training world. And each of them thinks that they're doing science-based dog training. And I'm gonna tell you, my humble opinion is that they are both correct. They both are. [00:00:50] But it has become this marketing tool. So I want you to thoroughly understand it. I want you to understand why it's a term that's being used and what it really means. I will say that I am definitely further on one side of that debate. If you are kind of new to the show, you might not know, but there are, , balanced trainers, trainers who feel that rewards and punishments as long as it, we get the job done and safely, rewards and punishments are all fair game. [00:01:20] And then there are the positive reinforcement trainers who think that punishments should be avoided. I'm far more leaning toward that side. But that doesn't mean that I'm not open-minded. , in fact, I am what's called a crossover trainer, which means that I started off with a lot of punishment based kind of training, and then over time started incorporating more positive reinforcement type training. [00:01:44] So I've done both, and I can tell you that. There are plenty of wonderful caring dog trainers out there working in both angles. All right, so first of all, this is a safe space. My show is always gonna be a safe space. I'm not here to judge anybody, [00:02:00] but I wanna present you with some information. Now, when I say that I am far more leaning toward positive reinforcement, , a lot of the positive reinforcement camp, talks a lot about science-based dog training. [00:02:13] And they do use a lot of science, but so does the balance trainer camp also. So the science part comes in because the purpose of us doing our training is to try to figure out, why the dog is having a problem. The why. Okay. This is where we break away from. , he does something and I just leash. Correct. [00:02:38] A good trainer is not doing that. They don't just go. I don't know. He did something. So I'm just gonna do a leash correction and a stern no. , the science-based part is about separating ourselves from the emotions of punishments and rewards, separating ourselves from the emotions of all of that, and instead thinking about what do we see with this dog? [00:03:00] Why is this dog behaving this way? Why is this happening? What can we do to help this dog be better? Now, that's a different point of view than what many of us were taught long ago when I first started. Back in the eighties, it was choke collars and prong collars. I was lucky enough to be around a bunch of adults cuz I was 14, um, to be around a bunch of adults who were super into continuing ed. [00:03:27] So even though we were using a lot of those things, there was always this open-mindedness about like, woo, how did they do that? Wow, that's neat. How will that work? Can we try that too? But it's not just about taking every idea that comes down the pike, okay? There are some crazy ideas out there. [00:03:44] There's some really outdated stuff. , but that doesn't mean that any one group of dog trainers has cornered the market on science-based dog training, okay? It's really important for us all to understand that if [00:04:00] someone does something that's a punish, And they do it once and the dog never does that again. [00:04:06] They have used science-based dog training. It might not be the way I would have done it, or maybe not the way that you would have done it, but it is scientifically sound. , so we need to break away from the idea that one is right and one is wrong. That's really important. As a crossover trainer, I think it's really important and I'd like to see more crossover groomers. [00:04:31] Let's make that a term. I'm a crossover groomer because many of us as groomers, and I think if you're not a groomer, you might not know this. Many of us as groomers, we're always taught. You just cannot let him take charge. Things like that, that really don't speak to what the issue is. We need to help these dogs feel more comfortable, calm, comfortable, and cooperative. [00:04:53] You've heard it many, many times here, so when we talk. Science-based dog training. There are a couple of different lenses we can use now. One of those, and one that I use a lot is, , least intrusive, minimally aversive, dog training circles. That's something that we often sign off on as part of our codes of conduct for the Association of Professional Dog Trainers, the certification council. [00:05:20] Professional dog trainers in the International Association of Animal Behavior Consultants. So those three big groups will often ask us like, do you use least intrusive minimally aversive? Are you following the humane hierarchy? Which is, I know it sounds super complicated, but what it is, is what it is, is. [00:05:42] The purpose of these is to have a roadmap when faced with a behavior that we would like to change or that we do not want. We first have to think about, , the dog's comfort. We have to think about why the dog is doing it, and this is a [00:06:00] roadmap for us to follow so that we're doing the most gentle version. [00:06:05] Now, why is gentle important? So let's say we have a dog on the grooming. And we're grooming along and we get up near his ear and he turns around and growls. And we assume, what if we assume that this dog just means to harm us, or he's being stubborn, that's a story that we tell ourselves, stubborn, that he's spoiled. [00:06:30] That's another air quote. Spoiled. , what if we start making assumptions that this dog is just trying to. Take charge doesn't respect us when actually this dog has an injury. Well, I think I would know if a dog was sore. Not really. So there are times where we are responding to a dog's behavior, assuming making some assumptions about their motivation. [00:06:57] And to break away from that is where we start talking about science-based dog training to break away from our assumptions to back. Boo boo boo. Back up the bus and think about, okay, why might that dog be responding that way? Now, let's say you're brushing an ear and you're like, I don't know. His ear looked fine, but maybe he has a neck problem. [00:07:20] Maybe you could do some real damage by continuing. Maybe we need to stop, pause. Think it through and listen, when this dog is saying, I'm uncomfortable with that, especially if it's a dog who normally is comfortable with that, and we see that a lot. So humane hierarchy starts off with when we're faced with a behavior problem that we are concerned about, that we don't want to have happen again. [00:07:48] Our first thought should be, is there a medical reason, a physical reason, like what is going on in this dog's? So that's a really big one that I think most of us [00:08:00] don't do. I say US cuz I've been there. I mean I do it now, but, but many of us don't do that first and we have to think about the medical reason. [00:08:10] No, that does not mean, and I know there's someone out there going, but I'm like, that does not mean that a dog who's sore is allowed to bite people. Okay. That's not the purpose here. That's not what I'm saying. What I'm saying is, is that we need to figure out the reason so that we can fix the cause so that we can get in there and really find out what is going on. [00:08:34] Frankly, if a dog is sore, I want to be gentle with. I want to help them feel more comfortable. And a dog who's sore, while they shouldn't turn around and try to bite us, I can understand why they might have that knee jerk reaction if something suddenly hurts or something twists. You know, like there are times where a dog's just like ow it looks like a bite. It looks like an air snap, and we need to be aware of that. We also need to help dogs feel comfortable with us, even if something does hurt. Okay? It's not okay for your dog to just go after you because things hurt. It's important for them to trust us to know that if I signal that something's uncomfortable, this human listens and will try to find out what's wrong. [00:09:21] That's really, I. And, it's one of the first parts of the humane hierarchy, just looking at what is the problem and is the right physical reason. A lot of the dogs that we groom have discomfort. They are uncomfortable. They have hip problems, they have tooth problems, they have ear problems, they have skin conditions. [00:09:42] They have, , toenails that are super huge and long and it's been, putting pressure on their feet and on their legs. They're all sorts of reasons why a dog could be sore. I'm not saying that that's the only cause for behavior problems that would, that would not be true, but we need [00:10:00] to rule those out and we need to really think. [00:10:02] And along with physical issues like medical issues, we also need to think about what kind of dog is this? Are we expecting a terrier to just kick back and relax or maybe hide if he's scared? Terriers aren't likely to get scared. We've been breeding them to just jump into fight mode, the way to keep a terrier calm is to not let them get into fight mode. [00:10:25] So this is part of us taking a little bit more of a. Pausing and thinking about why is this dog behaving this way? Why? , the things about this dog's body is this dog an adolescent, and we're expecting it to act like an adult, which is common, all right? That happens a lot. We go through the puppy phase and they're doing really, really well as a puppy, and then they hit seven or eight months old and we're like, Hey, why are you acting like this? [00:10:52] But it's seven or eight months old. They have less patience than they did when they were a puppy. They're still little. They still need lots and lots of patience, lots of little break. And we expect them to act like adults. So we're in conflict with them, and it's something that we could prevented if we're like, Hmm, okay, that's a physical reason. [00:11:13] Right? He's just darn young. He's not an adult yet, not gonna be able to act like an adult. , 14 year old Chrissy was not the same as this Chrissy, just think about your own self, like, oh yeah. Teenagers are impulsive, usually frustra. and our adolescent dogs are too. So sometimes we need to look at the dog's age, the dogs breed. [00:11:33] There are so many things to consider. That's part of scientific dog training. The science of dog training. It's not about letting go of all of our emotions. It's about backing up and really taking a closer look. Why is this dog behaving this way and what can we do about it? I want you to think about that one first. [00:11:57] That's the first one. And on the humane hierarchy, [00:12:00] it is least intrusive minimally aversive, it's a very dog friendly way to approach a behavior problem. Why is he being like this? And to step back from, from some of our stories, you know, well, he's just bossy. , that's a weird story that I think we've all told ourselves at some. [00:12:17] Very rarely do I find a dog who's bossy. So I want you to think about the, the physical health of the dog, the physical needs of the dog, other things that could be happening. And this dog's breed and this dog's age, , is this a dog who's always been good for grooming, but now he's nine and today's the day he doesn't wanna stand up. [00:12:36] Maybe this is the first time that he's starting to have some trouble with his hip. These are things that we need to think about, and that's part of science-based dog training. To look at the big picture. Let's get away from just responding with punishments or reinforcements. We can't just throw a cookie at everything either anymore than we can just leash correct and say no. [00:12:58] It's more about a step back, take a beat and think about why the dog might be doing this, because then we can solve the problem or work on the problem. Not every problem can be solved. If a dog is really sore. Sometimes that's just gonna be the way it is. But for us to step back and think about why is this dog behaving this way and let go of some of our emotions about it, let go of some of our ideas. [00:13:25] If you are enjoying this show, please remember to tell everybody, you know, subscribe or follow, and I wanna remind you that it is available as a podcast and it is also available on YouTube. [00:13:37] You can watch them as videos and you can watch or listen at creating great grooming dogs.com. [00:13:44] So as we talk about science-based dog training and separating yourself from some of the knee jerk reactions that we have, , one of the things I wanna point out also is that there's a process and not everyone agrees with that process. Okay? [00:14:00] But I'm gonna present the process that I use. All right, so full disclosure, I'm a positive reinforcement trainer and I'm gonna follow least intrusive minimally aversive, and I'm gonna follow the humane hierarchy because that's what I am firmly believing in. [00:14:16] But, those are still hotly debated, even amongst trainers who use those because these steps can be kind of gray areas. But I wanna dress here. When we are talking about dog grooming, I do dog training. I do lots of dog training, but the grooming process is a different angle of dog training. [00:14:36] If I were working on dogs, , barking at the front window, I might use a wider variety of tools than I do on the grooming table. Dogs, , during grooming have difficulty with grooming because they find it unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary. And I'm gonna drill that into your head. Dogs have trouble with dog grooming because they find it unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary. [00:15:03] So what does that mean for us? It means that if we want a dog to be better for groom. We are not likely to get good results if we incorporate more unpleasant, uncomfortable, and scary to try to fix a dog who is finding it unpleasant, uncomfortable, and scary. , that, that, that kind of makes us all feel icky the first time we hear it, doesn't it like, oh, oh, wait a minute. [00:15:31] Am I adding more unpleasantness? No. Unpleasant. As an example of unpleasant. Even the dog who's super, super. Is finding it unpleasant that they can't just go off and play. That's why they're wiggly. That's why they're a jumbled up, wiggly, goofball mess, and they're, we're having trouble holding them still and trying, having trouble getting the grooming done safely because they're super, super silly. [00:15:53] That dog is finding it unpleasant because they can't just go off and play. That's a dog with a problem being [00:16:00] impulsive and silly and active and maybe overwhelmed with the distraction level. But it's still unpleasant and a lot of dogs find grooming uncomfortable, and then a lot of dogs find it scary, and it could be a combination of all of three of those things. [00:16:17] Now let's talk for a moment about punishment and reinforcement. So punishments are things that decrease or end behavior, decrease or end. A punishment isn't necessarily a bad thing. We get, we get a feeling of icky, right? We're like, Ooh, but a punishment works because the dog thinks it's unpleasant, uncomfortable, or scary, and does not want to have that thing happen again. [00:16:47] They choose to like, Ooh, don't want that to happen again. I don't want that outcome again, so maybe I won't do that thing. Okay. They're unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary. That does not mean they're mean. All right. And I really wanna make that clear in the grooming setting. I'm calling this this line here because, We can't teach dogs to calm, comfortable, and cooperative on the grooming table and start thinking the grooming table is safe. [00:17:16] If we keep incorporating more and more unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary on top of a situation that's unpleasant, uncomfortable, and or scary, do you see how it starts to build up? And it just doesn't make sense in this particular realm? Okay, not a judgment call about those of you who are using punishment, you know, like your dog. [00:17:38] Does something at home. You know what? We can talk about that another time. But this is all about grooming. This is about the grooming process. Cooperative care. Can I touch your foot? Even if you're injured, cooperative care, I need this dog to trust that they're safe with me. Okay, so reinforcement is when we have a behavior that [00:18:00] we want to maintain or increase. [00:18:03] Maintain, or increase is reinforcement. These terms get used all the time in weird ways. Okay, so this is, this is science-based dog training. Reinforcement is when the behavior maintains or increases, not necessarily that you did something really nice. Okay? Some of the things that we do as groomers, some of the things that we do when we're trying to get a dog to knock it off, and we're holding that foot more and we're telling him no, and that dog is wiggling more and wiggling more. [00:18:33] Actually, what did it do? Maintained or increased the very behavior we wanted to stop right step back from our emotions and let's look at the result. And when we're doing reinforcement or punishment, we need to think about what is my theory about what's going on and what's my best guest about how this dog is going to respond to what I do next? [00:19:01] Okay, now you might have heard a positive reinforcement, negative reinforcement. Positive punishment. Negative punishment. So let's dig into that. Positive and negative. Okay. Again, this is a spot where we step back from our emotions. It does not mean lovey dovey or mean. Positive means something added. [00:19:23] Negative means something subtracted. So if I'm using positive reinforcement, it means I saw a behavior. That I want to maintain or increase and I'm going to add something. So when we add something to maintain or increase the behavior, it's probably something pleasant, maybe tasty, something the dog will like. [00:19:44] That would be positive reinforcement based training, if and only if actually maintains or increases the behavior. That's the part that I think a lot of us have trouble. Lot of trainers have trouble with that too when we're [00:20:00] first wrapping our heads around this whole idea. So let me give you an example. [00:20:05] If I see you do something, like, let's say right now you're listening to this podcast and maybe I saw you just write down a couple of notes and I'm thinking, wow, that's great. I want them to do that some more. If I hand you a piece of licorice, did I just, I did positive cause I handed you something. Was that positive reinforcement because you like licorice and will work for licorice? [00:20:30] Or did I just hand you something that you thought was yucky? Like, Ew, why would she hand me licorice? Are you likely to do the thing again or not? Could I have accidentally used positive punishment? Here's some licorice. I'm not gonna do that again. She's handed me this gunk. Ooh. Um. Licorice is often my example because I think it's a love-hate thing. [00:20:54] People either love licorice or hate licorice, and there's not... /episode/index/show/creatinggreatgroomingdogs/id/26542134

Ep181 Who Does The Teaching? 03/30/2023

Ep181 Who Does The Teaching? Who does the teaching? That's an interesting question, isn't it? So if we have a dog that has trouble with grooming, that has some difficulty, is showing some behavior that we do not want, is it the groomer who does the training? Is it a trainer, a behavior consultant? Is it an owner? Let's talk about all of our options this week. The full transcript! [00:00:00] Chrissy: Episode 180 1. Who does the teaching? That's an interesting question, isn't it? So if we have a dog that has trouble with grooming, that has some difficulty, is showing some behavior that we do not want, is it the groomer who does the training? Is it a trainer, a behavior consultant? Is it an owner? Let's talk about all of our options this week. [00:00:20] You're listening to the Creating Great Grooming Dog Show. I'm Chrissy Newmeyer Smith. I'm a master groomer behavior specialist. I'm a certified professional groomer, a certified behavior consultant for canines, a certified professional dog trainer and instructor at Whole Pet Grooming Academy, and the owner of Happy Critters in Nashua, New Hampshire. [00:00:37] And this my friends and colleagues, is the show where grooming and training. . So let's get into this a little bit today because I think that, , we all start wondering, well, where will this dog learn a new skill if it comes down to training? And I know some of you are kind of new to that idea that we can teach the dogs to be good for it. [00:00:56] And I hear you. , it was not always what I thought either, but we can, we can teach them to be good for it. So who does? , so my quick answer is that I think it needs to be collaborative. I think that it's more than just one person who does that . I think that that's something that we need to do as a group. [00:01:13] And what I mean by that is there is some stuff that the Grimmer is gonna need to do differently. , there's stuff that the owners should be sent home with also, and we often will have to work with a trainer or with somebody else in that dog's life also. Now, the reason. Let's get into just a little bit about why, , I hear groomers say things like, oh, but owners will just make it worse if they go home, they go home with the owner and the owner's gonna make it worse. [00:01:42] And let me explain what's going on there because I hear you, I hear what you're saying, and I know that owners can definitely make it worse. But what a lot of non trainers don't realize is that dog training is all about talking to owners. Dog training's all about teaching people [00:02:00] and it's really a unique skillset. [00:02:02] , it takes a long time to learn how to effectively teach people. And so what do you need to be able to teach people, ? You need to have them understand how to do something that's important. And it may seem really obvious, but think about how many of our owners have trouble brush. Even if they have the right tool, have trouble brushing, even if they have the right tool, and they have been shown a few times, they're still having trouble just brushing, which you would think, but you brush your own hair. [00:02:32] How could that be hard? But it is. Okay. So our owners need to understand how to do a thing, and that's where dog trainers are very good at helping owners understand. Here's another part for owners owners need to understand why. Why does he need to know how to do this? [00:02:52] Why is this gonna make a difference for this dog? Why is it gonna make a difference for them? Why, why are we even spending the time on it? Because if they don't understand why, then they might be stressing their dog out at home trying to just touch 'em with stuff. The classic example is the person who's been massaging his feet. [00:03:13] Oh, I just know the, the trainer said we should touch his feet a lot. , and actually non groomers don't really understand the purpose of foot touching, which is why we get a lot of dogs who have a lot of behavior problems, even though people have been touching their feet. Because it is not enough. , it's not extensive enough. [00:03:33] It does not translate to nail trimming directly. So it's not a bad. , but it's just sort of like the, the very bare minimum . So they need to understand why. They need to know why. Why are we doing a thing? What are we working toward, so we have the how, how are we gonna do it? The why are we doing it? [00:03:52] What are we working toward? Like what does the finished product look like? And that's part of goal setting,[00:04:00] ? What does the finished product look like? What do I want your dog to be able to. during the next grooming appointment. Is it, maybe it's standing still on a table, maybe it's being brushed. , maybe it's, touching a tail. [00:04:16] What is it that we actually want this to look like when we see this dog next that gives an owner the, the idea of like, what would they need to teach now? The other part that we can talk to our owners. Is the three Cs. You guys have heard this over and over and over again, but we need our owners or anybody else who's gonna work with that dog to know that the goal is for the dog to do all of this stuff, whatever stuff and things we choose to teach and be calm, comfortable, and cooperative. [00:04:50] We are not gonna fight with them to get it done. We're not gonna hold them down and then rub 'em all over with a , electric toothbrush and think that that's gonna help 'em be good for clipper work. . And I say that and it sounds kind of cheeky yet. Groomers. That's why so many groomers are like, don't send owners home with homework. [00:05:07] Cuz then they come back and the dog's like, oh, bring it. I, I hear that vibration going and I'm, I'm ready for the fight cuz that's what my owners have been doing since we saw you last. So we need to know that the dog is supposed to be calm, comfortable, and cooperative the whole time. The purpose is to help the dog feel good about it and to feel. [00:05:30] that's really key. So we're trying to help build good experiences. So when, when we as groomers are trying to send somebody home with homework, there's a lot to teaching people, and this is a good reason why groomers should not let owners. , just go home and try things on their own. Okay. If you are not good at instructing owners, that's okay. [00:05:51] We can collaborate for things like that. We can come up with some handouts. You can lead them to this podcast. You might find an episode in particular that makes a lot of [00:06:00] sense for owners. There were a couple of episodes specifically for owners, but the, everything on this podcast is meant for owners too. [00:06:07] It might be a little over their head, but that's okay. , but we really need to help them underst. The how, the why, the what, , what it looks like in the end. , understand that the purpose is for calm, comfortable, and cooperative handling. Not to take 'em home and show 'em whose boss or whatever crazy thing they might try. [00:06:29] But also, here's another key point if we're gonna be talking to owners directly. If you're a groomer and you're not used to instructing owners, here's another key point. We need to make sure that the owners understand why this is necessary and why it affects them. Do not let owners walk away thinking that they are giving you a precious gift. [00:06:53] Like, oh, I guess I could do some training. You know, cuz he gives the groomer a hard time. So I'll do that for my nice, nice groomer. It's not for us, it's not a precious gift for your groomer. It's so that your dog is better prepared for our services. So that we can continue to offer you our services and so that your dog can have better care. [00:07:14] So it's about them. It's about the owners. It's about the owners having a dog who's gonna be better for dog grooming, who's gonna be better at the vet's office, who's going to be better when they need to brush him at home or trim his nails or look in an ear. So we need them to understand why it's important for them, and that's really, really helpful. [00:07:35] So when we're talking to people, our people teaching skills are really kind of unique and dog trainers spend a lot of time learning how to talk to people. Now, another reason why a lot of groomers are not very successful with sending owners home with homework is something that we as trainers run into a lot too. [00:07:56] You only meet one of the owners. Maybe not [00:08:00] everyone in the house is on board, so someone else might be hearing the instructions entirely differently. We tell the husband and he goes home and he interprets that through his own eyes and then he tells , the wife like, okay, well this is how we're gonna do it. [00:08:15] And, and then the wife tells, the teenager and okay, so now we've got, we're playing telephone. What's better is if we cut out middleman at every stage we. No more middlemen. If we can talk to them directly or send them a video, send them a podcast, talk to them through, a trainer. [00:08:35] Send them to a trainer if you know a trainer that you refer to, which is part of what we'll talk about in the next segment, is talking about collaborating, but to talk to them and find out everybody in the house has to be on board or not. Interfer. That's tricky. Okay. It's really, really tricky. Dog trainers, we handle this a lot. [00:08:58] Okay? There's always someone in the house who thinks that they need to be super, super sweet, and someone else who thinks they need to be super, super stern and they aren't communicating very well at home either. So when we get the dog back who knows what they've been working. Maybe someone is untraining just as fast as the other one can train. [00:09:18] Okay. This is really common stuff, so it's not that we can't send owners home with homework. , it's that if you're not good at instructing people, you might not get really good results. Okay. , so that's kind of from the groomer point of view. If we're thinking, well, what can I send them home with? All right, first we just need to be able to organize our own thoughts. [00:09:41] what do we want from this dog? What do we think the owners can work on? . And then the next part we're gonna talk a little bit about collaborating with others and the common questions that I. , if you're enjoying the show, please remember to follow or subscribe, share it with your friends and tell everybody, you know, [00:09:58] So in the second part, I wanna [00:10:00] talk about if you haven't had success with helping owners understand, or maybe you haven't had success with owners going to a trainer. Here are a couple things. , I think that often groomers think that everyone knows what groomers. and actually everybody else thinks they know what groomers do also. [00:10:18] But if you are not a groomer, you might not really have an idea of what it is we do that we are, picking up their feet. We're in between every toe over and over and over again in a distracting environment. We hold their attention for about two hours. Like the average dog, then a, the big doodle with a haircut. [00:10:39] Yeah, that dog is gonna spend a significant amount of time, , on the grooming table, in the tub with people's hands all over them. And so we need to be able to communicate together. Now trainers sometimes give advice that does not make sense for dog grooming. Dog groomers sometimes give advice that doesn't make sense to the dog trainer. [00:11:01] you know, like, Hey, can we just work on doing this? And the trainer's like, why would we do that? And I think that it just makes a whole bunch of people feel like, , we can't trust anybody else with it. Okay. Now, I will say from a trainer point of view, there are plenty of times where groomers are like, oh my God, we can't send 'em to a trainer or a trainer. [00:11:22] I remember it was a Facebook post where a trainer said, I'm just looking for a groomer to send these people to who will not do the dog's nails, cuz we're actively working on that. And groomers flamed that trainer. They were upset with that trainer. [00:11:36] And I was really embarrassed for our entire industry. If a trainer is working with a. and trying to actively work on teaching the dog to be comfortable for something and asks us as groomers to please skip that if we can. If the dog seems nervous at all, please skip it. They are actively working on it, guys. [00:11:57] That's awesome. We need to be [00:12:00] joining in going. Oh, fabulous. Okay. What kind of signs of stress do you want us to look for? What are you working on? How are you working on it? I wanna help. Okay. We should be collaborating. We shouldn't be saying that dog's, nails need to be, again, the dog's nails do not need to be done right now. [00:12:17] Even if they're super long. If we're working toward the dog being calm, comfortable, and cooperative for their. For their entire life. So sometimes groomers and trainers don't mix well, which is sad. Guys, I want us all to get along. I do. I really, really do. But the other thing that happens there is that sometimes owners are the middle man. [00:12:41] Remember, we're back to the middle man again. Right? And owner's gonna describe what a groomer wants to a trainer, and they're not gonna interpret it. , that's playing telephone. Okay. So we need to think about how are we going to convince our owners if you are working with a trainer, please, I need to talk to your trainer. [00:13:02] Yeah. Let them know I wanna talk to your trainer. Is that okay? I'm gonna call your trainer and we're gonna just find out, touch base and find out. , let the trainer know what's been going on in grooming and ask the trainer, Hey, , can we find a solution for this particular set of issues? Maybe it's loud noises, maybe it's, , way too wiggly and silly when other dogs are in the room. [00:13:25] , maybe it's not even an aggression issue, it's just a dog who's just. Just plain wiggly or barks or whatever it is, but to talk to the trainer directly as a groomer. Talk to the trainer, trainers. Talk to the groomer. Don't send an owner with a story because the owner's story is going to change a little bit. [00:13:44] Okay, middleman, we're playing telephone and it's not very effective, so we need to talk more about why. Something needs to be done. . Get all on the same page so that we can help the dogs. All of us. [00:14:00] So let's talk a little bit about, , who else can work on a dog? Who else can do it? I know there, there's some debate about, the person with the grooming tools needs to teach about the grooming tools. [00:14:12] They don't have our tools and that's true. Okay. The groomer has tools that maybe the owners don't. But that's where we start talking about, just start touching 'em all over with stuff and things. Just random things. Let your dog think that any object. Could be rubbed all over their body at any time, and they are expected to kind of just hang out, stand still, , let us do this stuff and be calm, comfortable, and cooperative. [00:14:43] And then maybe that's when you bring out, , the cheap electric toothbrush that makes some noise or, or maybe the beard trimmer. And you've got the blade guard so that you're not actually using the beard trimmer, but you're just making the noise, rubbing them all over with it, right? That's where some other tools and other types of object. [00:15:00] Can still be really helpful. And dogs can be very, very specific about you get a new clipper and they're like, Ooh, that clipper sounds different. A different dryer or a different nozzle for a dryer. Okay. That doesn't mean that we can't be working on it. It means that once they get into the grooming setting, there will be additional work that still needs to be done. [00:15:21] Okay. And then also think about. The grooming environment is different. There's a lot going on in a grooming environment, but owners can still work on things like that. A trainer can still work on things like that. A lot of trainers have a grooming table available to them, and if not, they can use one platforms or agility equipment or something to just stand that dog on a surface and You might be surprised how many different types of distractions a trainer can think up. [00:15:50] When we practice things like sit, stay, sometimes there are balls being tossed around, toys being tossed around, , half the class tugging with their dog while the [00:16:00] other half is in a sit stay. There's a huge amount of variety that a dog trainer can come up with if they know what the goal is. What does it ultimately look like? [00:16:13] What is the behavior that we're working on and what do we ultimately want? So if they were, if the distraction is the issue, yeah, a trainer can easily do that, even though it's not the same as the grooming environment. If they know what is happening in the grooming environment, they can come up with some strategies to work toward that grooming environment. [00:16:35] Um, and then there are other people who might help out too. A lot of our dogs go to doggy daycare. and there are some really interesting things that they can do with doggy daycare. They're very experienced dog people. [00:16:48] They can also work on some stuff. They can also work on, come on over here. Let me look in your ears. But everyone needs to be on the same page. Okay. Your pet sitter could be doing some of it. , certainly with some of our older customers, some of our elderly adults who. Can't do a lot of this stuff with their own dogs. [00:17:08] , I have a lot of elderly customers and when I get on the floor playing around with their dog, their dog is not used to that at all. , the 80 year olds rarely get on the floor and play with their dog. So often there are other people involved with caring for a dog, so we can get them on board. [00:17:24] Okay. But this is about sharing information and collaborating. and someone has to be pretty good at teaching people. And that's where trainers and behavior consultants come in is that we are good at teaching people. Well, we should be good at teaching people. It's a significant part of a dog trainer and a behavior consultant's job. [00:17:45] And I'm also gonna add here. The difference between a trainer and a behavior consultant, really kind of comes down to the type of work that we do. There are lots of different types of dog training, and I think many of us who are not dog [00:18:00] trainers, the non dog trainers think that dog training is obedience classes. [00:18:04] But that's just one piece. So a dog trainer might be somebody who runs obedience classes or runs agility classes. , they do group classes and they're teaching new skills, but they aren't necessarily the let's. Break it down, figure out what the cause of a problem and work on problem solving. [00:18:21] That tends to be the behavior consultant. It's sort of like the difference between an elementary school teacher and the guidance counselor. So if you think about that, like, oh, so a behavior consultant is a dog trainer. Who likes to dig in and gather all the clues and figure out what makes a dog tick and try to come up with solutions. [00:18:43] Okay. A lot of dog trainers like to do that too, but that's really kind of what the difference is. Okay. And then there are other, other variety of professionals out there for us too. So of course the veterinarian. Let's see if there's a health problem and if they need a behaviorist that is a veterinary special. [00:19:02] your veterinarian is going to send them to a vet behaviorist or it is a PhD. Okay. That is not your local dog trainer. That's a significant amount of college education. Okay? Not trade level. That's academic. . And I need you to know that because there are a lot of times right here groomer saying, oh, he needs to go to a behaviorist. [00:19:24] really? You think the average dog trainer or average behavior consultant can't figure out why this dog is spooky about a loud noise? You really think they need to go... /episode/index/show/creatinggreatgroomingdogs/id/26395068

Ep180 Humane Treatment 02/26/2023

Ep 179 Where To Start 02/18/2023

Ep178 What Keeps Us From Modernizing? 02/07/2023

Ep 177 The Sticking Point 11/30/2022

Ep176 The Stern "No" 10/25/2022

175 Is Patience Enough? 10/18/2022

175 Is Patience Enough? Episode 175 Is Patience Enough? Are you really patient with the dogs? Gentle, loving, and patient and still aren't seeing results? There are a couple of mistakes that you could be making. Find out more this week! An Example Of A Safety Policy "To provide the highest level of care for your pet we have a safety policy. If at any time your pet gets nervous, anxious, scared, aggressive, or even overly silly, we slow down and help your pet to be comfortable and calm. It’s very important to us that the pets in our care are kept safe and stress free. We use sharp tools and need to prevent injuries. We will work with your pet to help them feel comfortable. This will build a great experience for successful groomings for your pet’s lifetime. Your pet may not be groomed to perfection today. We will charge for the time that we spend working with your pet." This is not a legal document but it tells owners how we do business, what to expect, and starts conversations about behavior problems being safety problems. Find the podcast on your favorite host or check it out on the web site CreatingGreatGroomingDogs.com to listen or watch there!🎙 It also now available as video on YouTube 🖥 https://youtube.com/channel/UC9UN5lbdF3qq3xI1Y2BHRzQ If you'd like to support the show I'd appreciate it. https://www.buymeacoffee.com/creatinggrV Want to learn more about behavior? My Master Groomer Behavior Specialist program consists of 4 eight week courses. They are entirely online and include weekly zoom classroom time. The program is through The Whole Pet Grooming Academy. For more information about this fully online course go to WholePetNH.com #dogtrainer #dogtrainers #dogtraining #dogpodcast #dogpodcasters #doggroomer #doggroomers #doggrooming #MasterGroomerBehaviorSpecialist #petstylist #petstyling #ccpdt #iaabc #apdt #cbcc #cpdt #fearfree #fearfreecertifiedprofessional #fearfreepets #positivereinforcementtraining #positivetraining #dogsofinstagram #doggroomersofinstagram #dogtrainersofinstagram #akcsafetycertifiedgroomer #dogbusiness #schoolforgroomers #holisticgrooming #wholisticgrooming #wholepetgroomingacademy @happycrittersdogtraining @thewholepetgroomingacademy /episode/index/show/creatinggreatgroomingdogs/id/24718455