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Get Stronger, Run Better: A Conversation with Jason Fitzgerald Strength Running Podcast
07/27/2026
Get Stronger, Run Better: A Conversation with Jason Fitzgerald Strength Running Podcast
Guest - Strength Running Podcast for strength content Ready to find out why your pain keeps coming back dispite trying everything? Book a free Discovery Call here. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (00:02) All right, welcome back listeners. This is Dr. Mandy Wayne Fan, now Dr. Mandy Real, for those who have heard my name before. thank you for joining the Movement Movement. Today we have a very special guest. This is Jason Fitzgerald, coach, strength training extraordinaire in the running field. So Jason, for those who don't know you, give us a little bit about yourself. Jason Fitzgerald (00:22) Well, thanks, Mandy. yeah, Jason Fitzgerald. I've been running for good lord, twenty seven years now, which which kind of ages me a little bit. I think I'm pushing twenty-eight years in in as a runner myself. I've been coaching since two thousand and ten and I also host the Strength Running podcast. yeah, I really just try to help runners achieve their potential and get their performances where they want them to be. Jason Fitzgerald (00:50) which is often not where they are, but hopefully through conversations like this we can help get runners over that hump and get them to where they want to be. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (01:00) Totally. Yeah. For for those of you out there who found our podcast through kind of trying to run through an injury, fix an injury, this information today will be a really good bridge from, okay, I'm kind of sorting through the injury now what? How do I stay out of that? Of course, but what can strength training build for me apart from just, you know, fixing my foot pain, for example. so before we get started here, Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (01:28) We're gonna have a pretty general focus. So there's gonna be a lot of information in here. So I would recommend not skipping around too much because we may be referencing things that we talked about earlier in the podcast. So stick around through it all. We'll have a great little takeaways at the end of the show. but we're gonna go over a ton of fun stuff today. Jason Fitzgerald (01:49) Well, Mandy, I I also want to say not only am I excited, I'm a little bit jealous that you probably have a bigger Monstera behind you than I do. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (01:59) It's it's taken some punishment over the years, but it's it's doing okay. It's about the size of covering up my maps, so I'm not gonna know what to do at that point. Jason Fitzgerald (02:10) Yeah, my mine is pushing seven or eight years old and it's also taking a little bit of abuse. It's not in the the best position right now, but you know, that that that's what you're gonna have to deal with when you're dealing with a jungle vine in your office. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (02:23) Right, Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (02:24) right, yeah. It's my only couple plants in here that haven't died yet with my little window. So well Jason Fitzgerald (02:30) Yeah. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (02:30) cool. So so Jason, you're in the strength training world. you are deep, deep in the strength training world for runners. as you mentioned earlier too, if you have not checked out the strength running program podcast, go ahead and check that out after the episode. It's fantastic. but Jason, how did you come to realizing that strength is important? Jason Fitzgerald (02:53) Well, I came to it through a lot of trial and error. it was because I was hurt all the time. You know, it really stemmed from Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (02:59) Mm-hmm. Jason Fitzgerald (03:00) my personal journey as a runner. You know, before I was a coach, you know, I I ran cross-country, indoor and outdoor track throughout high school and again at the collegiate level. And I I was a very injury prone runner, you know, with Achilles tendinopathy and plantar fasciitis and you know, all kinds of different strains and SI joint problems and Jason Fitzgerald (03:22) IT band syndrome. I mean, you name it, I've probably had the injury. And it wasn't until my first marathon, I ran the New York City marathon. And I realized afterward when I had started to, you know, try to return to running again after about a week off. And I I felt terrible. And pretty soon I developed a case of ITBS that laid me out for about six months. And I had to go to four physical therapists. And I was just seeing all these different people and and Jason Fitzgerald (03:53) Trying to leave no stone unturned on how to get past this injury. But then more importantly, not only just get healthy, but what do I do with my training after I get healthy so that I don't have to waste another six months sitting on my couch watching reruns of house because I Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (04:09) Yeah. Jason Fitzgerald (04:10) I'm just bored. I really just like to run and I want to get back out there and keep training. So it was a little bit of a process, you know, like I think at the very beginning of of that whole journey for me, Jason Fitzgerald (04:22) I started, you know, incorporating certain body weight, strength exercises, much more mobility work, doing some, you know, band work, medicine ball work, things like that, very running specific, so that I could, you know, get strong in a way that runners care about and that would actually help me stay healthy. and now that's evolved a little bit. You know, I still do a lot of that kind of work and I still prescribe it for my athletes as well that I coach and that I work with, but I'm also fully. Jason Fitzgerald (04:52) in recognition of how valuable weightlifting is in a gym. And yes, it's great for kind of building more durability, more resilience to injury, but in regards to your running economy and your performance and your body composition and all the other lovely things that we love about weightlifting, you know, there's a lot to love about it. And, you know, if you're any kind of performance oriented runner, Jason Fitzgerald (05:17) Which doesn't mean that you're a professional or anything. It just means that, you know, you have some goals. You want to run a certain distance. You want to break a certain time in, you know, a given distance. We have to start thinking much more strategically about your training. And I think strength training is so important. I don't even really call it cross-training. You know, it's just Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (05:35) Mm-hmm. Jason Fitzgerald (05:36) part of the training process that Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (05:38) Yes. Jason Fitzgerald (05:38) runners need to really achieve their best. So it it was a it was a very big journey for me, you know, at the beginning. I didn't even Jason Fitzgerald (05:46) lift at all. I didn't do any strength work. I didn't think it was necessary. You know, I I really was just 18 years old and could get away with a lot of, you know, poor exactly. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (05:53) Right. You made a rubber. Jason Fitzgerald (05:56) You know, I could just go to sleep at night and then any problem I was dealing with would be gone by morning. You know, to be 18 again. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (06:00) Right, right. Right. Jason Fitzgerald (06:03) So I think my youth masked a lot of the training errors I was making at the time. And now that I'm 42 years old, I really have to be thinking a lot more strategically about Jason Fitzgerald (06:15) How I'm structuring my training. And, you know, coming from that college cross-country and track background, it has been very eye-opening coaching adult recreational runners over the last 16 years because, you know, they don't have the same kind of movement fluency that a lot of college athletes have. And so we've got to build a lot of that into the training program so that number one, they just feel much better on a day-to-day Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (06:42) Mm-hmm. Jason Fitzgerald (06:42) basis, but also. Jason Fitzgerald (06:44) They're building that resilience into the program. They're they're getting the results that they're looking for. They're getting injured less. They're staying healthy for longer. So, you know, I I'm I'm now someone who is such a big proponent of strength training. Now, look, that doesn't mean I love it. I'd rather be out there running a couple more miles. I mean, you know, Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (07:00) Right. Right, right. Jason Fitzgerald (07:02) I'll raise my hand. I'm a pure runner through and through. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (07:04) Totally. Same. Jason Fitzgerald (07:06) I don't like being in the weight room, but I understand that it allows me to do what I love to do. And so now I make it a priority. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (07:14) Yeah, it's like going and, you know, buying shoes. It's not I don't have a passion for shopping, but I need shoes, so I will go get shoes. But I know what you mean about the literacy. So just on the side for fun, I I coach high school cross country and having them in the weight room once a week. You know, they're like fourteen year old kids, just the you know, the kids who've been returning and doing all the other maxing out their mileage and all that. but you know, getting them in a on a hex bar Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (07:42) for the first time ever and they're they're growing, they barely know where their limbs are. It's it's a it's a very different coaching experience than say my patients who I'm transitioning out of care that have been lifting for twenty years already. It's a a different type of education and a different type of like coaching queuing situation. Jason Fitzgerald (08:01) Yeah, I think it's really it's always really interesting looking at different types of people in the weight room. And and I'll never forget a conversation I had with a USA weightlifting national coach who was talking about why runners should be lifting weights. And he said, Yes, look, the weight is important, but a lot of what we're doing is simply a movement practice. You Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (08:22) Yes. Jason Fitzgerald (08:22) know, we're we're we're working through bigger ranges of motion, different ranges of motion than we would typically get. Jason Fitzgerald (08:30) if we were only doing our run training. And, you know, for the adult who sits at a desk for eight hours a day, or, you know, who isn't going to the playground and doing all kinds of, you know, weird and wacky movements with their toddlers all the time, like you've got to build in some of this movement practice into your program. And so, you know, when you get your 40, 50, 60 year old client in in the weight room, you're probably going to notice that their limbs aren't all over the place. They, Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (08:58) Right. Jason Fitzgerald (08:58) they Jason Fitzgerald (08:59) really aren't going anywhere. You know, they they Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (09:00) Right. Jason Fitzgerald (09:01) they're not moving quite well at all. And so that's that's a big glaring red flag in my mind that we just need to do more of this. We need Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (09:08) Mm-hmm. Jason Fitzgerald (09:08) to get good at it. It's like someone who, you know, can barely run a mile without stopping. It's like, well, maybe we just need to do more aerobic development. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (09:18) Totally. Yeah, I I see it with my patients too. I don't know if you're familiar with attractor state models much, but for trying to change something biomechanically, part of the idea instead of just thinking this is perhaps controversial, so instead of just thinking, you know, run on your forefoot, increase cadence, that stuff can be useful. but if you're trying to change it for say a fifty mile race, you're gonna forget at some point those cues. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (09:48) If you're throwing up at an aid station and then trying to trot out of it, you're not gonna be thinking about like, okay, swing my arms. so part of the way that you can hack that, so to speak, is through attractor state models, which essentially says pattern a movement, load it, and then it'll stick better because you're overloading it, you're demanding more of that movement than you will in your sport. That means that it'll kind of settle into your body. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (10:16) more naturally than if you were to just think about a form change. But you have to have the load. You have to have strength training with it. So super on board with everything you just said. Jason Fitzgerald (10:25) I'm not sure if that was controversial. I've I've been saying some version of that Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (10:27) Okay. Jason Fitzgerald (10:29) for years. I I think Dr. Mandy probably put that in just a smarter way than I would have said it. But yeah, I'm I'm such a firm believer in that. Like if you want to improve your running form, if you want to get more economical, sure, some cues can be generally helpful, but the best way to do that is to do the things in training that help you improve your form, you know, and and there's very varied things like. Jason Fitzgerald (10:55) You could do hill strides or hill sprints. That's really good for your running economy and your in your overall form. So is just running a lot, you know, just practice Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (11:02) Mm-hmm. Jason Fitzgerald (11:03) running it, you know, at easy efforts. And, you know, heavier weightlifting is also a really wonderful way of building that kind of intra and intra muscle coordination that's really important when you want to get good running economy, which is probably the number one benefit of lifting for runners, is that. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (11:21) Yes. Jason Fitzgerald (11:22) You know, you just become a lot more economical at going from point A to point B. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (11:27) Mm-hmm. Yeah, for distance running, it's your body takes the path of least resistance. That is running economy, so to speak. It's how little energy can I spend in order to move forward in a running fashion. and there's, you know, you can get really in the weeds in the science of it, as you obviously know. But for most people it's hey, I want to run a longer race or I want to run faster with the same amount of energy, right? You're trying to not have any gas left in the tank by the finish line. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (11:56) How can I get faster? Well, you get more efficient. And so yes, training more, but having your running economy improve is like a it's a total game changer, right? So for people who are just starting to get into running, obviously both Jason and I are proponents of strength training, but getting more training in in general helps as long as you're doing it wisely. And for those of you who have been in the game for a long time and you feel like you've plateaued and you know you have more there, but you can't access it. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (12:26) That's really where strength training can come in and give you an extra edge if you haven't done it before. Jason Fitzgerald (12:31) Yeah, for sure. And and I I I especially think that it's probably more important for the longer distances. So if you're a trail runner and you're getting into fifty Ks or you're doing some of the longer ultra marathons, you know, the longer event is, the more important running economy becomes. You know, if if you want to become the next Josh Kerr and, you know, run a three forty-one mile, well, you Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (12:53) Crazy. Jason Fitzgerald (12:54) know, you could you could almost Jason Fitzgerald (12:57) Focus on like your your VO2 max and some of the other metrics of performance and and kind of gut your way through a fast mile. But when those inefficiencies are magnified for, you know, a hundred times the distance in a hundred mile ultramarathon, you know, you're really going to kind of see those weak links really be exposed. So yeah, I mean, for especially for for injury prone runners, for those runners who you want to become more durable. Jason Fitzgerald (13:26) and and build some resilience for those long races. I think it's a no brainer. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (13:30) Totally. Yeah, on that note too, so like I mentioned, a lot of people might be listening from a place of either currently having an injury or recovering from one. what's your philosophy on getting into strength training or continuing strength training when there is an injury going on concurrently? Jason Fitzgerald (13:48) I I think you have to let pain be your guide. You know, I'm I'm a big believer in just because you're injured doesn't mean that the training has to stop. You Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (13:56) Mm-hmm. Jason Fitzgerald (13:56) just have to train a little bit differently. So may even if you can't run at all, can you do some cycling? Can you get in the pool and do some aqua jogging or pool running? and that'll that'll do a lot at at maintaining your aerobic fitness, you know, and and one of the problems that runners often have when they're injured is that they do do a lot of that cross training. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (14:17) Mm-hmm. Jason Fitzgerald (14:17) And and they Jason Fitzgerald (14:18) keep their aerobic system very topped up. They're still, you know, very fit, but they're just not used to any of the pounding of running because you know they're on a bike or they're in the pool. And so what happens is they come back to running, say, one, two, three weeks later, and they go do a long run or they do a hard workout, or they do two hard workouts and a long run in a single week. And because they just haven't been running for the last like 16 days or whatever it might have been. Jason Fitzgerald (14:46) Their body is so unaccustomed to the impact forces of running that they end up with some new injury or some new little niggle that kind of pops up. So strength training can kind of help, you know, keep your muscles' ability to withstand some of those impact forces when you get back to your run training after, you know, you're healthy and your PT has cleared you to start running again. and it also is just as really good at kind of, you know, toughening up. Jason Fitzgerald (15:14) those those connective tissues and making your joints a little bit more durable as well. So if you're injured, I I almost think it's the best time to start strength training, you know, unless Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (15:24) Definitely. Jason Fitzgerald (15:24) there's obviously, you know, clear pain that is preventing you from doing a particular movement or or lifting, you know, a lot of weight or whatever the exercise might be. You know, so of course let pain be your guide. But, you know, when you're injured, it is often the time to start a new Jason Fitzgerald (15:43) healthier habit, you know, to Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (15:44) Mm-hmm. Jason Fitzgerald (15:44) kind of revamp your training in a little bit so that the next injury isn't as severe as this current one, or or you can sidestep the next injury. And so if you're someone who hasn't been strength training at all, and then you get this this injury and you can't run for a little while, this to me is like the perfect time to start strength training. As long as you know it's not causing any additional problems, you now have the time in your schedule. You're not running Jason Fitzgerald (16:10) to to focus on that, to make it a habit so that when you do start running again, you know, you can kind of maintain that habit over time. Dr. Mandy Riehl (Wainfan) DC (16:17) Totally. Yeah. And it's amazing what you can do modification wise. Instead of saying like I get a lot of nerve mediated pain injury folks who maybe they think they had planar fasciitis that's there for five years. It turns out it's nerve mediated, that sort of thing. So there's for me and my patient population, there's a lot of fear around deadlifting, for example. and it's like I'm not gonna deadlift, something's gonna explode. I've had problems in...
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