Episode 484: Why to Leave Evangelicalism & How to Stay with Dan Stringer
Release Date: 11/24/2021
702: Venezuela, Vanilla Ice, & the Church’s Anxious Nerves with Sara Billups
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The new year began with a successful U.S. military operation to capture Venezuela’s president. But the mission killed approximately 80 people and is being condemned by some American and international leaders as illegal. Esau McCaulley joins Phil and Skye this week to discuss the fallout from the operation. Was it legal? Was it moral? And what does it reveal about Trump’s vision of America? Kaitlyn talks with author Sara Billups about her new book, “Nervous System,” and how our age of anxiety is affecting Christians and the whole church. Also this week—the Trump administration...
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Bothsidesism Isn’t What You Think
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Holy Post Media is no stranger to accusations of both-sidesism. Skye and Kaitlyn talk about why they believe pointing it out on both sides isn’t simple equivocation or conflict-avoidance, but instead a responsibility… depending on the context. Holy Post Plus: Ad-Free Version of this Episode: 0:00 - Intro 0:58 - Theme Song 1:18 - Defining Both-Sidesism 8:40 - Sponsor - Sponsor - Poncho - If you’ve been looking for the perfect shirt—something breathable, fits great, feels even better, and stands out in a good way—give Poncho a try. Get $10 off your...
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701: Mailbag! Decompressing, Demonology, & Dreams for 2026
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We’ve reached the end of 2025, so we thought it’s a good time to answer questions from the Holy Post community. Phil, Skye, and Kaitlyn cover a wide assortment of issues, from how they decompress after a difficult podcast, and how they pick which politicians to interview, to their favorite movies, and who is best at changing a tire. They also tackle theological questions about the nature of grace, the limitations we will still have in the new creation, and why demons may not be fallen angels. They also give their predictions for 2026. Along the way, Phil has weird ideas about hair, Skye...
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700: What Every Christian Can Learn from A.A. with John Ortberg
The Holy Post
Last weekend was filled with terrible news, including a mass shooting in Australia, another at Brown University, and the murder of Rob Reiner and his wife. Mike Erre joins Phil and Skye to discuss these events and why rediscovering the biblical practice of lament is better than just “thoughts and prayers.” The Catholic Church has taken a nuanced and principled position on the deportation of immigrants. Why do evangelicals find that so difficult? Then John Ortberg talks with Skye about his latest book, which applies the 12 Steps of Alcoholics Anonymous to Christian spiritual formation....
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699: The Limits of Liberalism & Punishing Immigrants with Matthew Soerens
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Two writers from the New York Times say the liberal values that have flooded our culture with online gambling, pornography, and cannabis have backfired, but secular progressives, like Ezra Klein, admit that they don’t have a framework for explaining why. Phil, Skye, and Kaitlyn discuss the benefits and limitations of liberalism as a political and social philosophy, and why those on the left are increasingly aware of their need for religion. Matthew Soerens from World Relief is back to discuss why the Trump administration’s immigration policies are so different in his second term, how the...
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698: De-Christianizing America & Re-Christianizing Advent with Rich Villodas
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The government of Israel has been criticized for building fences in Gaza and the West Bank, but now it’s geofencing American churches. Will its plan reverse the decline of evangelical support for the Jewish state? Donald Trump says he’s making the country more Christian, but data shows his immigration policy favors secular immigrants and rejects Christians. Rich Villodas is back to talk about his new book for Advent, “Waiting for Jesus.” He says we should use this season to resist consumerism, commercialism, and Christian culturalism. Also this week, a giant flightless parrot has...
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What Does the Magi Story Really Tell Us About Jesus? (From this week's Curiously Kaitlyn)
The Holy Post
We’re popping a Curiously Kaitlyn episode into your feed this week because we’re starting a brand-new Advent series, and—let’s be honest—the nativity story gets weird. Kids notice all the odd details we learned to ignore, and suddenly you’re fielding questions you did not prepare for in Sunday School.So instead of scrambling for answers all by yourself, you can join us all month as we explore the questions your kids (and most adults!) are genuinely curious about. First up: Who exactly are the wise men, and why do they show up in the nativity scene at all? If you...
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697: Cancelling “Judeo-Christian,” Defending Slavery, & Rethinking Gaza with J. Ross Wagner
The Holy Post
The term “Judeo-Christian” has been used by the Religious Right for decades as a positive shorthand for biblical values in the culture, so why are conservative Christians now rejecting the label? And why are Christian defenses of slavery and the Confederacy gaining popularity 160 years after the Civil War? Phil, Skye, and Kaitlyn explain how the rising influence of Christian nationalism drives both trends. J. Ross Wagner, editor of the new book, “Being Christian After the Desolation of Gaza,” talks to Skye about how both American and Palestinian Christians are reexamining evangelical...
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696: Transcending Our Political Divisions & Labels with Andy Beshear
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Mike Erre joins Phil and Skye to discuss a New York Times column by David Brooks. He says America’s divisions will only heal when we abandon shallow labels and war metaphors, and instead see one another as fellow pilgrims on a journey. America’s Catholic bishops issue a stern rebuke of the Trump administration’s dehumanizing rhetoric and policies, which makes Phil wonder why evangelical leaders can’t do the same. Then, Skye talks to Kentucky’s Democratic governor, Andy Beshear, about why he’s so popular in a state that Donald Trump won by 30 points, and how his party can begin to...
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695: Analyzing the Blue Wave & Why the Church Still Matters with Carmen Joy Imes
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The Democratic Party swept the off-cycle elections last week, but this isn’t the first blue wave we’ve seen in the Trump era. Phil, Skye, and Kaitlyn discuss what it means and the significance of New York City electing a Muslim, democratic socialist as mayor. Does Mamdani represent the death of New York, and possibly America, as one Baptist leader claims? Old Testament scholar Carmen Imes is back to discuss why she hasn’t given up on the church, and we shouldn’t either. Her new book is “Becoming God’s Family: Why the Church Still Matters.” Also this week—how social media is...
info_outlineIn case you haven’t noticed, the evangelical movement in America is a mess. Some say we should let it all burn down. Others fiercely defend the historic and theological richness of the tradition. Dan Stringer says there’s a third option that is honest about evangelicalism’s failures, while also valuing its strengths. Kaitlyn interviews Stringer about his new book “Struggling with Evangelicalism: Why I Want to Leave and What It Takes to Stay.”
Also this week, former Trump national security advisor Michael Flynn says the U.S. should only allow one religion. Skye explains why the Pilgrims did not come to America for religious freedom, and Christian explores healthy and toxic patriotism. Then, what should we conclude from the Kyle Rittenhouse verdict? Plus, orcas are attacking yachts and Phil celebrates World Toilet Day.
Thanks to the Grow Center for sponsoring this episode. More information about The Ray Bakke Certificate of Biblical and Entrepreneurial Thinking is available here: https://www.thegrowcenter.com
News Segment
0:00 - Intro
04:07 - World Toilet Day12:28 Animal News: Orcas attacking yachts
https://www.yachtingworld.com/cruising/orca-attacks-rudder-losses-and-damage-as-incidents-escalate-133968
18:43 - Michael Flynn says U.S. should mandate one religion
https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/columnists/2021/11/20/michael-flynn-john-hagee-ed-stetzer-one-religion/8649034002/?gnt-cfr=1
42:45 - Kyle Rittenhouse verdict
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2021/11/kyle-rittenhouse-right-self-defense-role-model/620715/https://robertpjones.substack.com/p/free-as-f-kyle-rittenhouse-whiteness
Interview w/ Dan Stringer “Struggling with Evangelicalism: Why I Want to Leave and What It Takes to Stay” - https://amzn.to/3FIPkyc
54:43 - Interview Start & Guest Background
59:55 - Shifting perspective on evangelicalism
01:04:13 - Importance of remembering our history/tradition
01:12:46 - Communal repentance
https://urbana.org/message/litany
01:16:46 - Learning from each other
01:22:37 - Is this the moment for renewal?
01:27:06 - What next? Responding after pain
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