VDAO Ep.3 Designing Antifragile Systems Regeneration, Nature & Decentralization with Rob Avis
Release Date: 11/24/2025
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NN Ep:11 Let a Thousand Societies Bloom with Vitalik Buterin
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S.10 Ep.8 Hyperstitions: How Beliefs Become Reality in Networked Systems with Jake Hartnell
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S.10 Ep.7 Prosperous Software: Rethinking Open Source Funding Through Licensing
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VDAO Ep.6 Everyday Resilience Building Anti-Fragility in Suburbia with Gardner
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New @greenpillnet pod out today! 🌐 In this episode of the VDAO × Greenpill Anti-Fragile Network States mini-series, host Kris Miller talks with Gardner, a tech founder exploring how local resilience and self-sovereignty can be built without going off-grid. Gardner shares his hands-on journey of transforming a suburban home into a more resilient system from rainwater harvesting and food forests to community reciprocity and mindset shifts. They discuss why resilience doesn’t mean bunkers or isolation, how small actions compound, and why investing in community, not fear, is the real...
info_outlineNew @greenpillnet pod out today! 🌐
In this episode of the VDAO x Greenpill Antifragile Network States mini-series, host Kris Miller talks with Rob Avis, a permaculture educator, systems thinker, and co-founder of Fifth World.
Rob shares his journey from industrial food and oil & gas to regenerative design, and explains how nature, decentralization, and appropriate technology can help humanity build antifragile food, energy, and water systems.
They explore regeneration, feedback loops, digital tools, beaver-built ecosystems, community resilience, and how to inspire the next generation of earth stewards.
A deeply optimistic, practical, and inspiring conversation for anyone building toward a resilient future.
🌱 greenpill.network
🌐 fifthworld.io
vdao.org
https://x.com/JoinVDAO
https://x.com/rob_5thworld
https://x.com/greenpillnet
🌐 Timestamps
00:00 – Cold Start
01:15 – Rob Avis joins the show
01:38 – Childhood roots: seeing the Amazon rainforest destroyed
04:01 – Cutting down forests in oil & gas the turning point
06:20 – Traveling the world to study energy, food & water systems
08:04 – Cheesecake factories, industrial food & system awareness
09:45 – What antifragility really means
12:06 – The three states: fragile, resilient, antifragile
13:43 – Human body as an antifragile system
16:08 – Ecosystems as antifragile, syntropic systems
18:18 – Why “sustainability” is not enough
20:07 – Regeneration: leaving systems better than we found them
22:17 – The beaver example; disturbance as healing
24:00 – Humans as positive ecological disruptors
25:42 – The “woo-woo” critique of regenerative movements
28:04 – Pragmatic regen: examples from large-scale farmers
30:28 – Using appropriate tools not dogma
32:51 – Global regeneration examples (Saudi, India, China)
35:09 – Land vs tech: bridging permaculture and crypto cultures
36:58 – 10,000 years of “deforest, plow, desertify”
39:24 – How digital tools enable better ecological feedback
41:51 – Tech vs nature: design the right balance
44:00 – Vitalik’s techno-optimism & defensive accelerationism
45:19 – Decentralization as a natural principle
47:01 – From activist to humanist
49:00 – Everything gardens — humans included
51:18 – The biggest challenge: changing mindsets
53:29 – Fifth World: decentralized food, energy & water systems
55:48 – Case study: regenerating a desert property into abundance
58:14 – Why people crave reconnection with land & nature
59:57 – How urban renters can start (the Apple Harvest story)
01:02:37 – Community orchards & urban abundance
01:04:41 – Inspiration vs fear: how to steer the canoe
01:06:48 – Healing ourselves to heal ecosystems
01:09:09 – Bridging crypto + nature: governance & invisible structures
01:11:33 – A call for collaboration (real-world builders hackathon?)
01:13:22 – Regeneration as enlightened self-interest
01:14:40 – Final thoughts: do we want to be on the extinction list?