Episode 129: “Helping myself by helping other people: In Conversation with Cindy “Yee” Lam-Walker”

In this episode you will:

• Discover how transitioning from participant to facilitator can accelerate personal recovery while creating meaningful support for others living with aphasia, demonstrating that helping others is often one of the most powerful ways to help yourself continue growing.
• Learn practical strategies for building and sustaining aphasia support communities both online and in-person, including how to adapt materials for different communication abilities, recruit co-facilitators with complementary strengths, and grow through word-of-mouth rather than formal advertising.
• Understand how creative activities like movie groups, singing and dancing, and talk of the town (current events) serve as powerful therapy tools for participation and language recovery.

Welcome to the Aphasia Access Conversations Podcast. I'm Jerry Hoepner. I'm a professor at the University of Wisconsin – Eau Claire and co-facilitator of the Chippewa Valley Aphasia Camp, Blugold Brain Injury Group, Mayo Brain Injury Group, Young Person’s Brain Injury Group, and Thursday Night Poets. 

I'm also a member of the Aphasia Access Podcast Working Group. Aphasia Access strives to provide members with information, inspiration, and ideas that support their aphasia care through a variety of educational materials and resources.

I’m today’s host for an episode that will feature Cindy “Yee” Lam-Walker. We’ll be talking about her programming for individuals with aphasia by individuals with aphasia. This is the second episode in a two-part series featuring remarkable individuals who discovered that one of the most powerful ways to support their own recovery was by creating spaces to help others.

We’re continuing our June celebration of Aphasia Awareness Month, where we’re highlighting the Life Participation Approach to Aphasia by featuring people who are living successfully with aphasia. Earlier this month, we heard from Sherry Lovellette, who started several online opportunities for individuals with aphasia, including Aphasia Gatherings, Online Book Club, sewing, and an in-person support group. We also heard from Dr. Lori Gray about her groundbreaking work integrating mindfulness into stroke recovery.

Before we begin today’s conversation, I’d like to share a bit about today’s guest.

Cindy “Yee” Lam Walker is a person with aphasia from Atlanta, Georgia. She was a Treasury Officer before her stroke and was great with numbers and money.

 

On March 19th, 2019, she experienced a ruptured brain aneurysm. It caused bleeding in her brain, which required brain surgery. After the surgery, she didn’t remember what happened for the first 3 months.

 

She began to speak, but it was difficult. She couldn’t walk. She had to use the wheelchair, and she was in the hospital for 5 months. She wouldn’t eat. She couldn’t go back to her job, a job that she loved but she could no longer do math. Her whole life changed! ​

 

In winter, she was depressed and didn’t want to live. She wanted to die so she could see God and my parents in heaven. In spring, her doctor prescribed some new medications, and she began to feel better. She met her speech therapist, Emily. With her help, she started to talk, to read, and to learn simple math. ​

 

After her stroke, she didn’t care about money anymore. She has many new friends and makes origami to give to people. When she is folding origami, she feels like her mother is teaching me how to fold. ​Now she writes poetry and leads groups for other people with aphasia.

 

 

Transcript:

 

Jerry Hoepner: Well, I'm really excited to have a conversation with you. Katie Strong said that she connected you with you when she was in Atlanta a few weeks ago, and.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah, we had a great time.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Yeah, sounds like it. And she had this idea for a conversation with you about your experience starting an aphasia group for people with aphasia by people with aphasia. And we just think it's a wonderful idea. And I didn't even realize how much you were doing until I saw some of the things that you sent me, and I've heard a little bit here and there from others. But wow! It's really. It's really impressive.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: The number of people in those classes. Scott did that. I couldn't add up things like he does, so he took care of that I don't even know he was doing it for my classes, but he spent time doing that. But I'm the one who likes to organize it among people and I. I pick some of my other friends to be the host. I'm not always the host for all these classes, so.

 

Jerry Hoepner: See that. That's really a great idea on your part. People with interest or expertise in those different areas. And yeah, it's quite the lineup of activities that you have kind of across the whole range of interests and topics. So, I'm excited to talk about it.

Yeah. Those numbers that Scott put together are really impressive. 2,400 people. Wow.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Not at different times, you know, it's not like, yeah. He did the math.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Yeah, that's a that's a lot of people, though, when you think about how much people struggle to pull people together, those are really great numbers. And obviously you're doing something really well.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah, I enjoyed it, I think. You know, right now I don't have a real job. So, I like doing this to help myself and to help other people, too, you know.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Yeah, absolutely. I think it's as good or as meaningful as any job. The things that you're doing so really excellent work. Well, is it okay? If we kind of start having a conversation about those questions that I sent and try to pull those pieces together.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yes.

 

Jerry Hoepner: That sounds good. As I said, I'm really interested to learn about your background and kind of your journey through this experience. How has your personal experience with aphasia shaped your approach to community leadership?

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: For me. After my stroke efforts. I was depressed; you know my whole life changed. I didn't really want to live. Really, my parents passed. I figure, you know, if I die, I will see them in heaven with God and my parents. I didn't want to live after the hospital. I was there for 5 months, and I got home. I told Scott that just leave me in the bedroom. Leave it there for one week, then I'll be gone. And he worried about me. So, he kept calling people to help people understand what I'm going through. And shortly after I started to go to an Emory office, where I met my speech therapist. Her name is Emily, and she can tell by she looks at me, and she's like, “Are you depressed right now?” And I'm like, “Yeah, I don't really want to live.” And then she said, “Well, you know, you come to my office here. You are aphasia.” And I'm like. “Wait what?” And she said, “aphasia. And there are lots of people with aphasia all over the world. It is the inability to read and talk, but we can help you.” And when she said that to me I all of a sudden woke up like, “Oh, I can't! I'm not the only person with this, you know.” I knew I had stroke, but I never heard of the word aphasia and when she said that she woke me up and I started to read and talk with her. So, And because of that I felt like she helped me. I want to help other people, too you know. I started to start to like my life a little bit and then, after a while, I tell myself you know, your life right now is actually much better than before. You know I care a lot about money and all that stuff. But now I don't care about money anymore. I'm glad that I'm alive and I like to help people because a lot of people helped me when I was going through stroke, and later with my Chemo people there helped me so much that I want to be there to help them. and that makes me feel happy to be able to help others.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Absolutely that sounds like that. Conversation with Emily was a real turning point for you. Yeah.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah, and that.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Moving forward.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: I always tell people who are studying to be speech therapists. If I can do it all again. I wouldn't want to be a Treasury officer. I want to be a speech therapist because you get you guys to help so many people. You know, nobody really knows about that until they're going through stroke or other stuff. A regular person wouldn’t know what is aphasia, you know.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Right. You mentioned, as you were describing that journey, the stroke and the aphasia. And then you briefly mentioned your chemo. Can you tell us a little bit about that journey from recovering from the stroke and then finding out about the breast cancer?

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah. Well, you know After my stroke. I hate going to the hospital, anyway. I've been in the hospital for 5 months but every year we get this mail, saying that oh, it's time for your mammogram.

And so, Scott, usually he goes to the mailbox, and he likes going to the mailbox. I don't like to go. I don't really care what I get from the mailbox, but he likes to look through them and he told me. Oh, it's time for you to have mammograms and I'm like, I don't really want to go. And he said, No, I think you know you should do it, and I'm like, no, I said that. You know I hate being in a hospital. I'm so flat over there. There's no way I'll ever get breast cancer. But he kept forcing me and forcing me. And I finally went. And I'm so glad that I went, you know, because I have breast cancer Stage 2. If I didn't go, it could be Stage 3 or Stage 4 so, and it's him kind of forcing me to go. And I always thank him so much for keep forcing me to go. You know, and when I found out I have breast cancer. I never heard of this name called triple negative breast cancer. You know I was kind of surprised that I got this, but I never got angry or anything. The 1st thing I said to myself, is, you can handle it. You went through stroke, and now you're going through breast cancer, but you can handle it. And so, I you know, I went through all the stuff that goes through chemo. You know I yeah. And I'm glad that I never felt angry with anything. I just think that there's a reason for me to be going through this. Perhaps I'm there to tell people that like me you should go get your mammogram. You know so, and my life's still better, too, after that.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Well, it seems like that. Mind shift, or that mindset shift that you experienced with Emily kind of led to the way that you responded to the cancer as well, just really, positively and forward looking.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yes, yeah. And I didn't try to be happy or anything. It just happened to me that you know I enjoy my life. Now I like my job before I was a Treasury officer, and I love the people. I work with my manager and shortly after I got my stroke and back then. I care so much about money now. I don't care about money anymore, you know. I think my life is even better. I get I met people that I never met before, and I spend more time with them now, like my husband's mother, Joyce. She was always very nice to me, but I didn't really like her too much back then. Perhaps my own mother was going through Chemo, and you know I didn't really like Joyce, but when I was going through stroke. She came to the hospital here. She came from Florida to Atlanta, and she was always in the hospital to help me you know, so I'm much closer to her now, you know, like people that I never really care about. They all came to help me.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Wow! It sounds like you've got quite a quite the supportive network you've mentioned Scott a couple of times. Can you tell people just a little bit about who Scott is?

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah, my husband he taught me a lot, I mean, he was helping me with my stroke and through Chemo you know, and neither one of us were us were angry. Well, he was a bit angry, not at me. But why are you having breast cancer now? He just couldn't believe it, but I'm like, well, it happened so let's just handle it. But most of all, he's always been here. Always drive me to the hospital you know, he would bring his computer in the hospital because he need to do his work. And I'm in there getting chemo all that stuff, you know? Yeah. So yeah. And you know, we met when we were college and I think our personality has changed a little bit since you know when we were in college. But we we're getting even closer now than before, I think, for some reason. Yeah.

 

Jerry Hoepner: That's really great to hear that. And it just seems like you've kind of found your way through this process, and you just have such a good attitude. I'm interested. What was the moment you decided you kind of talked about this, that you were inspired by the people that were helping you. But what was the moment that you transitioned from being a participant in in various groups to being a facilitator and a leader?

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Well, I think I've been to some of those visual connections, you know that. And when I was part of them, I was shortly after my stroke. So after, like 2, 3 years later. I felt like, perhaps I should go to some classes for people who were not recently from stroke, but like me after several years and we might do something different compared to before. So, I decided that I would get a zoom where people can come, and you know and do certain things like we can read the news, or we can read about history articles. I think it's important that people can start to talk and weep. Because I mean, you know, right after my stroke. I had to learn all my ABCs you know, but it takes time, and that's why I felt people when they come to our zoom. If you want to just come, you don't have to say anything. Just see what we're doing, and then, by the time, whenever you feel like, it's the right time for you to start talking, then you can. I don't want them to think that. Oh, you come to the zoom, and you will start reading a sentence. No, I think it's just in your time. Whenever you're ready for it. You can, you know we will help you with seeing one sentence or something like that. So even though you know, people might come, and they couldn't say the sentence, which is fine because they can hear it and understand it right. They just can't say it. So, I started with like the conversation group and then talk of the town, and then I ask others to be host. So, I don't have to be the host for all of them movies and stuff like that. So, and you know it. And then I didn't really go and tell a lot of people about it. I just told several, and then they then they went and recruit more people, so.

 

Jerry Hoepner: That's a a perfect transition to my next question, because it sounds like one of the. My next question was going to be, what strategies have been effective for you and growing your community. But you said, one thing is just let people join on their own time and and participate when they're ready to and then you mentioned that you shared with a few people, and they shared and kind of that word of mouth any anything else that's been helpful in growing that community.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah, I think for the zoom I want between, like, you know, 4 to 8 people, because if it's more than 12 people, it's hard to be able to read the sentence, because sometimes you need to go to the second page, you know, when you look at, you know, so I don't want to have too many people in in a zoom between 4 to 10 actually will be good because I want them to have several times to read instead of do it once, you know, if there's too many people there, so that's that I think will be good. I think that's it. I don't really yeah. And sometimes I will ask them, what kind of zoom do you want? And somebody might say, What about baking? I'm like, okay, that might be good, you know. I'm not a baker, or I don't like to cook. But if someone wants to be involved in that you can, but you need to be the host, because I won't say anything about cooking, because I don't really know too much about them you know. So.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Yeah, it sounds like you have a lot of good things that you've kind of done through the program. I mean, just asking people what they want. Clearly with your numbers. Since 2023, 2,400 people that have attended, I mean, that's a lot. You're doing some things really well. To create that sense of community in that space where people can learn and continue to improve.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah, and I think, the I. So, I have like talk of the town. We had 3 classes talk of the town news and then talk of the town history article and talk of the town people.com. and I think someone who just recently have stroke or other illnesses. They might want to start with people.com. Then they can go to the second one, which is news, and then the last one is history articles, because history articles are pretty hard to read them. Lots of numbers like 1492, you know, for a lot of people. Those words are hard a lot of, so that will be the order. I would tell them. You can start with people.com. Those are pretty easy, you know, and then you move to the news article like what's going on like, you know. Pope is from United States that type of articles, and then history new articles, because they are really hard to say. A lot of the names and the years. I'm okay with the numbers. But a lot. They have a lot of problem with reading the numbers.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Gotcha, you know, as long as you're talking about those I think might be a good time for me to kind of mention a few of them. So, you have one entitled, Wake up the week.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Oh!

 

Jerry Hoepner: Yeah, what's that one about.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Oh, it was somebody wanted to host one with my group. His name is Ed, and she wants to talk about wake up this week just to see what people did during weekends, and then what you plan to do in, you know, this week, and so so about that. So, they can talk, you know and that's what it is about like. Oh, we went to see a movie, you know, did you like this movie? Or, Oh, how are your pets? How is the kitten? You know, stuff like that? So, it's a.

 

Jerry Hoepner: That's a great idea, so kind of catching up with each other, and then.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Talking about plans for the future.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah. And he was the host. But then he started to go through therapy, so he's not the host. Now, this one really doesn't have a host. I kind of am the host, but you know, with the same people would come back anyway. So, I don't think we really need a host for this one.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Gotcha, you have a conversation group that's pretty self-explanatory. And then you have one on movies and looks like TV series. And things like that.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah, yeah, like, we were watching. What is that one? I forgot the name. Yeah, like I would have. I would play the movie whiplash, you know. Have you seen Whiplash?

 

Jerry Hoepner: I haven't seen that one yet. I've heard it's good.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: They! They use a lot of bad words in it. But if you're okay with that, then I think you might like whiplash. Yes, and then we'll ask people. So, what do you think about what happened to so and so you know that get them to talk? Yeah. Point is for people to able to talk. It doesn't have to be a long sentence. But you know, what did he do? Do you like his you know, Job, or, you know, stuff like that get people to.

 

Jerry Hoepner: That's great. And then you have a singing and dance group, too. What's that one like?

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Oh, I just go onto YouTube and get the songs with the caption on the bottom so they can sing and listen to the song. I think somebody told me that if you have a tough time reading a sentence, but when you're listening to the music, actually, you can sing pretty fast like than just reading a line, or something like that.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Yeah, that definitely can help get some of those words out for a lot of people with aphasia. So yeah, great a lot of really great offerings. As we're thinking about your programs. Is there anything you wish? Like? One thing you wish you had known before starting the process? Or maybe something you've learned throughout the process.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah, something that I learned that I never really thought about that is. So, it happened like half a year ago my class was going to at 5 pm, okay? And I decided, I'm going to go earlier than 5. I just want to get there. So, I can put the information. I got there at 4, 45, and there were 2 people there already. They were talking about their book, and then I'm like, I was just surprised like, how could somebody just enter the zoom, you know, and she told me, oh, I have this book club now. And I'm like, hmm! I never thought like I never thought. Oh, I can just go use somebody soon without telling her you know. I never even think about that. I I'm like what you know. And she said, Oh, yeah, she came on. I said you need to let me know, because I need to record.

You've been into these classes, you know, you're going to be part of aphasia forward Book Club. Okay? So, I need to know if you will be coming here and stuff like that. But just the fact that I should have told people you use assume only from a facia forward. Don't just come out of nowhere and use this. Okay, it's free. Because somebody pays for this, you know. And if you want a free zoom, you can't. You can have the conversation for less than 40 min. Those are free. Then go to those and get them yourself. Don't just come here and use the zoom so.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Gotcha. Yep, yeah. Good things. There's always a lot of logistics to to sort out. For Aphasia Forward. What? What are your hopes for the future, for your community?

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: I think I want it to grow more in Georgia here. I kind of want it to be more like you guys in Wisconsin. We didn't have that. You know how we go to the camp there. I want people in Georgia can do that here because and they are starting with like a community right now. It will kind of, you know, far away before they can become like Wisconsin, but at least they are starting one here like there's like we. I saw them last Friday, when we went to Good morning. A facie when Jacqueline was there, you know. So. And then I met the 2 ladies who's going to be forming a company or something about a aphasia and help each other like that. So, I want my zoom to, for people who like they don't have to drive to an office. They can just be on my zoom at home. So yeah, if they want to learn how to, you know, sing, or read again, we can help.

 

Jerry Hoepner: That's excellent. So, sounds like 2 big missions getting them to participate and to get kind of get back into doing things and then creating that community, that group of people with aphasia that understand one another and can connect with one another.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah, and I told them, you know. It might be good to have pickleball here, too.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Yeah.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: I think a lot of people like it, you know. So, or like, you know, we would be surrounded by the fireplace, and we sang. You know those are nice things, you know words, you know, but we don't have one right now.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Yeah, yeah, I think those are great aspirations for the future. I hope that it continues to grow. And you develop that community even further. If you had a suggestion, this is kind of a little add on question. But if you had a suggestion for someone with aphasia who is thinking? I want to start something like this. Where would you begin?

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Well, they can. I mean they can talk with me, and I can show them the list of clauses. And then, I guess, like, you need to be able to tell other people about it. I mean, there's not much you need to do. You just create one using a zoom, and then you know, people will start talking to each other, and then you will find more about people who are coming what they want to do. So perhaps, like, I can help in that way. I guess. Yeah, like I, I can give them some ideas of what I went through to get to where I am now.

 

Jerry Hoepner: That's fantastic. I don't know if you know this, but you're a pioneer and definitely. There will be people, I'm sure, that'll reach out to you and ask you about how you made it happen. So? It's been really fun having this conversation. Is there anything else you want to share with our listeners?

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: No, I don't think so. I mean yeah, I mean, at some point before I thought it would be good to have poetry class. But since you guys are so good in Wisconsin, I don't think I need to do another one. There'll be too many poetry for me a week.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Well, it's certainly been fun getting to know you through aphasia camp and through poetry. And it is absolutely inspiring to see you continue to improve and to and to grow, and to be doing all of these things on your own. So, you are truly an inspiration and I'm glad to know you.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Oh, thank you. Same to you. Yeah. Oh, I think a lot of people has been coming to Thursday night poetry.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Yeah, we've had some really yeah good numbers and a lot of great people. I always think it's fun to see the new people, and to see how much you know. They kind of start out, and they're a little bit quiet, and then they just continue to grow. So it's really fun to watch that.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Yeah. And a lot of people really enjoy listening to poetry or working so.

 

Jerry Hoepner: Agreed.

 

Yee Cindy Lam Walker: Okay. Thank you.

 

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Jerry Hoepner: All right. Good to see you.

 

On behalf of Aphasia Access, thank you for listening to this episode of the Aphasia Access Conversations Podcast. For more information on Aphasia Access and to access our growing library of materials go to www.aphasiaaccess.org. If you have an idea for a future podcast series or topic, email us at [email protected]. Thanks again for your ongoing support of Aphasia Access.