The Truth About The Gospel Industry That Is Actually True with Rick Robinson

On July 25, 2025 Isaac Caree released a podcast interview with Norman Gyamfi. Norman is a music industry executive and part owner of Maverick City Music. Suffice it to say, this conversation created a firestorm of controversy and conversation around Gospel Music, CCM, and the racial tension embedded within the music industry. We know these things are going on, but for maybe the first time - a business executive let it ALL out.

Being that Beyond Sunday is a podcast about worship and the church, I wanted to talk about it so I decided to invite Rick Robinson, a Gospel Music vet onto the show to break down what Norman said and why it is so problematic.

One of the things Rick says in the interview is: “Gospel music is a sound. Gospel music is a culture.” And while it’s ok to reinvent and innovate, the beauty of Gospel music does not need toned down or whitewashed in order to succeed. If we do that, we lose the heart and soul of what makes Gospel music what it is.

Topics Covered:

• The history of Gospel Music in Chicago
• The important difference between ministry and industry
• The difference between the sacred music of Gospel and the business of Gospel Music
• The difference between the members of Maverick City and the brand of Maverick City
• How Norman let us see behind the curtain of industry
• Why Norman admitting he was a Trump supporter didn't bolster his argument
• The problem with anti-black rhetoric, especially coming from a black man
• Why worship should be its own award category
• Why artists need to first and foremost be authentic
• Confronting the racial tensions in the music industry
• Why black artists are constantly pitched songs by white songwriters but white artists rarely do songs from black artists

Resources Mentioned:

• Show Sponsor: Planning Center
• Rick Robinson
• Otis Blackwell/David Letterman Interview
• Yacht Rock: A Documentary

Show Sponsor: Planning Center

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