Libsyn Directory

EP #58: Law Firms, PE, and MSOs: A Legal Ethics Conversation with Lucian Pera

Release Date: 10/07/2025

EP #66: The Middle Market Maverick: Bob Hicks' Insurgent Approach and Vision for Taft

The Future Is Bright Podcast

What does it really take to build a national middle-market law firm that grows fast, integrates cleanly, and keeps its partners committed rather than walking out the door? Bob Hicks, chairman and managing partner of Taft Stettinius & Hollister, explains how middle market mergers have powered Taft’s expansion without sacrificing culture or retention. Rather than chasing scale for its own sake, he lays out a disciplined approach built on cultural alignment, economic fit, and client compatibility. Many conversations never become deals, and Hicks sees that restraint as a competitive...

EP #65: From London to New York, Natasha Harrison with Pallas Partners and her Entrepreneurial Journey

The Future Is Bright Podcast

What does it take to build a high-stakes litigation firm that wins without Big Law scale while staying lean, values-driven, and firmly in control of its future? Chris Batz and Howard Rosenberg speak with Natasha Harrison, founder and managing partner of Pallas Partners, about what it takes to rethink the traditional law firm model from the ground up. Natasha shares why she left Big Law to build a focused litigation boutique rooted in senior judgment, clarity, and results rather than size or leverage. The conversation challenges the assumption that growth and prestige come from scale, offering...

EP #64: Matthew L. Schwartz on The Boies Schiller Way: Excellence and Integrity

The Future Is Bright Podcast

A leader who built his career on high-stakes investigations shares how those experiences now shape the culture, standards, and direction of a top litigation firm. Matthew L. Schwartz, Chair of Boies Schiller Flexner LLP, joins Chris Batz and Howard Rosenberg to talk about what it takes to lead a litigation-first firm without losing the sharpness that defines its work. He reflects on a decade in the Southern District of New York, where cases tied to General Motors, the U.S. Department of the Treasury, and the fallout from Bernie Madoff shaped his views on judgment, clarity, and what clients...

EP #63: Inside the Legal Profession: Trisha Rich on the Surging Interest in MSOs and ABSs

The Future Is Bright Podcast

The legal industry is racing toward new business models, and Trisha Rich offers a grounded view of what that shift actually requires. As a partner at Holland & Knight and a professor at New York University School of Law, she works at the center of the conversations driving MSO growth, ABS experimentation, and rising interest from Private Equity. Firms want support, investors want a foothold, and everyone wants clarity on where the ethical lines sit. Trisha argues that the answers are far less mysterious than people think. Independence, fee structures, and client protection still...

EP #62: Laura Cameron of Pinsent Masons on Law Firm Strategy and Leadership across 4 Continents

The Future Is Bright Podcast

What happens when a 300-year-old law firm builds its future on client-led growth, global collaboration, and a culture that actually holds up across 29 offices? Laura Cameron, Global Managing Partner of Pinsent Masons, shares how she won a contested election with a vision rooted in people, purpose, and progress. She explains why growth only works when clients lead the way, how culture becomes a selection tool, and why she tests every new hire for “chemistry” before skill. The conversation cuts through leadership theory to reveal what it really means to run a global firm, balancing...

EP #61: Changing Perceptions in a Vanilla Market: Mischon de Reya LLP’s Branding Story with Elliot Moss

The Future Is Bright Podcast

Elliot Moss didn’t join a law firm to keep things the same. As Partner and Chief Brand Officer at Mishcon de Reya LLP, he brought a deep understanding of branding into a profession that often dismisses it, and changed how one of the UK’s top firms thinks about growth and perception. He shares how clarity, consistency, and emotional intelligence turned Mishcon from a £45 million practice into a £380 million brand defined by truth and differentiation, not slogans. Clients, he says, may buy expertise, but they stay because of trust and how a firm makes them feel. He talks candidly...

EP #60: Future-Proofing Your Law Firm: An Honest Conversation about Strategy and Growth with Chris Batz

The Future Is Bright Podcast

Many firms say they have a Law Firm Strategy, but few actually do. In this episode, Chris Batz breaks down what true strategy looks like inside corporate law firms and why clarity must come before growth. He introduces his framework for effective law firm strategy, the “three P’s”: positioning, perception, and competition. He explains how each reveals the gap between where a firm stands today and where it aims to be. From understanding client perception to benchmarking against competitors, he outlines how to replace internal optimism with market reality and strategic focus. Chris...

EP #59: Sir Nigel Knowles: Shaping the Future of Biglaw

The Future Is Bright Podcast

Law firms everywhere are debating private equity. Sir Nigel Knowles has already lived the full arc, from global expansion to IPO to take-private. Joining hosts Chris Batz and Howard Rosenberg, the former global managing partner of DLA Piper and former CEO of DWF unpacks a career built on bold growth and tough calls. He shares how a 90-person practice in Sheffield became DLA Piper through disciplined strategy, relentless execution, and a shift from territorial “country barons” to one global firm. He walks through the three-way merger that hit at exactly the right moment, the lessons he...

EP #58: Law Firms, PE, and MSOs: A Legal Ethics Conversation with Lucian Pera

The Future Is Bright Podcast

Private equity is circling the legal industry, and Lucian Pera is helping make sense of what that means for MSO law firms and beyond. Joining Chris Batz and Howard Rosenberg, Lucian breaks down how management services organizations (MSOs) and alternative business structures (ABSs) are giving outside investors new ways to participate in the economics of law - without running afoul of ethics rules like ABA Rule 5.4. Lucian makes it clear that these models are tools, not shortcuts. For some firms, an MSO structure may unlock the capital needed for technology, acquisitions, or ambitious...

EP #57: Feeling the Squeeze: How Mid-Sized Law Firms Adapt and Compete

The Future Is Bright Podcast

Mid-sized law firms are facing pressure from every direction. Associates are poached with six-figure pay bumps, partners are stretched thin between billing and management, and specialty practices vanish without succession plans. At the same time, clients expect broader reach and deeper benches than many firms can deliver. In this episode, host Chris Batz shares what he’s hearing directly from managing partners and executive committee members across the country. He outlines the squeeze mid-sized firms are feeling - lagging organic growth, talent retention challenges, leadership burnout - and...

More Episodes

Private equity is circling the legal industry, and Lucian Pera is helping make sense of what that means for MSO law firms and beyond.

Joining Chris Batz and Howard Rosenberg, Lucian breaks down how management services organizations (MSOs) and alternative business structures (ABSs) are giving outside investors new ways to participate in the economics of law - without running afoul of ethics rules like ABA Rule 5.4.

Lucian makes it clear that these models are tools, not shortcuts. For some firms, an MSO structure may unlock the capital needed for technology, acquisitions, or ambitious growth plans. For others, a traditional loan or internal funding might make more sense. The critical step, he argues, is matching structure to strategy, rather than chasing the latest buzz.

As interest from PE firms and family offices surges, the profession faces a choice: see outside money as a threat, or recognize the opportunities it brings to modernize how law firms operate. Lucian leans toward the latter. Just as medicine and accounting were reshaped by investment, he believes law is in the midst of its own slow-motion revolution where the business side of the profession is finally catching up with reality. For lawyers and investors alike, understanding MSOs, ABSs, and the ethics that govern them is a glimpse into where the legal market is headed next.

Episode Breakdown:

00:00 Meet Lucian Pera

01:04 MSO Law Firms Explained

05:09 Rule 5.4 and Legal Compliance

09:19 Market Trends and Investor Interest

15:45 Which Law Firms Are Using MSOs

18:17 Private Capital: Threat or Opportunity?

25:19 ABS Structures in Law Firms

30:10 ABS vs. MSO: Key Differences

32:10 Future Outlook for Law Firms and PE

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