The Third Story Podcast with Leo Sidran

THE THIRD STORY podcast features long-form interviews with musicians, producers, writers and members of the creative class, hosted by Brooklyn-based musician, Leo Sidran. Their stories of discovery, loss, ambition, identity, risk, and reward are deeply moving and compelling for all of us as we embark on our own creative journeys.

298 - Aron! 06/30/2025

297: Natalia Lafourcade 06/18/2025

296: Terri Lyne Carrington 06/12/2025

295 - pablopablo 05/23/2025

288: Crossing the river - 20 years of "Al otro lado del rio" 05/16/2025

288: Crossing the river - 20 years of "Al otro lado del rio" Twenty years ago, “Al otro lado del río" became the first Spanish-language song to win an Academy Award for Best Original Song. Written by Jorge Drexler in a single day while staying in Madison, Wisconsin, and recorded in a mix of home and studio settings, the song’s journey was as unexpected as its lyrics suggested. At the time, it felt like an anomaly. This year, when “El Mal” from Amelia Perez won the same award, it barely registered as unusual. That alone says something about how much can shift in 20 years—culturally, personally, globally. Here we revisit that historic night through conversations with Jorge Drexler, Ana Laan, Amanda Sidran, Ben Sidran, and the song’s co-producer: me. From the song’s humble origins, its Oscar nomination, and the moment when Drexler—barred from performing his own song during the ceremony—made a quiet but profound statement by singing his acceptance speech a cappella. But this episode isn’t just about the song. It’s about the river crossings—literal and metaphorical—that define our lives. It’s about memory, and how we revise and re-tell our stories over time. It’s about fate, timing, music, and how small decisions can ripple outward in ways we could never expect. It also looks at the aftermath: how the win transformed Drexler’s career, leading to 15 Latin Grammys and three Song of the Year awards by 2024, and how it marked a turning point for me, prompting me to move to New York and ultimately leading to the creation of The Third Story podcast. But even in retelling the story, memory plays tricks—Jorge and I recall that night differently, highlighting a key theme of The Third Story: within every version of events, the truth always lies in the spaces between. This episode is an exploration of music, memory, and history—how a single event can reshape multiple lives in different ways. /episode/index/show/thirdstorypodcast/id/36585660

294: Suzanne Vega 05/10/2025

293: Arturo O'Farrill 05/04/2025

292: Max Pollak 04/21/2025

292: Max Pollak When he was five years old, Max Pollak had a moment. Sitting in front of a black-and-white television in suburban Vienna, he saw Fred Astaire tap dancing for the first time. “I was so spellbound by his elegance and his effortless swinging persona that I immediately decided I have to learn how to do that,” he remembers. He didn’t understand the cultural context or the language, but he knew that whatever was happening on that screen — the rhythm, the movement, the magic — was something he had to pursue. That moment sparked a lifelong journey that would take him from Austria to Harlem to Havana and back again. Here, Max Pollak tells the remarkable story of how he taught himself to dance in a place where no formal tap training existed. Early on, improvisation wasn’t just part of his style — it was the only way forward. That instinctive relationship with rhythm would become the foundation of his unique voice as an artist. At 14, Pollak met his first mentor: Carnell Lyons, a master tap dancer from Kansas City who had relocated to Europe during the civil rights era. Lyons had grown up alongside Charlie Parker and had performed with jazz legends. He passed on not only the technical language of tap, but a deep awareness of the art form’s Black American roots. That relationship shaped the way Max approached dance — not just as choreography, but as culture. After moving to New York, Max began studying drums and enrolled in Bobby Sanabria’s Afro-Cuban ensemble at The New School. It was there that he was asked the question that would redefine his artistic path: Do you want to tap dance to Cuban music — or do you want to tap dance Cuban music? Inspired by that challenge, Pollak dove into Afro-Cuban music, learning the language of clave and fusing it with tap, body percussion, and voice. The result was RumbaTap — a groundbreaking synthesis of traditions that bridges continents and cultures. When members of the legendary Los Muñequitos de Matanzas saw Max perform, they asked him to teach them. That moment affirmed the authenticity of his approach and led to collaborations in Cuba that brought him closer to the source of the music he had been drawn to for so long. Today, Max Pollak is widely recognized as one of the most innovative tap dancers in the world. His contributions to the language of tap, particularly in blending it with Afro-Cuban music and body percussion, have earned him international recognition — including the rare honor of having his image featured on a United States postage stamp. He’s also a vocalist, drummer, composer, and storyteller. This week, he celebrates the 25th anniversary of RumbaTap with a special performance at 92NY, featuring members of Los Muñequitos. This episode came together unexpectedly, sparked by a tip from bassist and composer Alexis Cuadrado, who sent me the press release for the 92NY concert. I reached out to Max for a short interview — and the conversation turned out to be so rich and wide-ranging that I decided to share it in full. We talk about lineage, improvisation, spirituality, and what happens when you follow the rhythm only you can hear. /episode/index/show/thirdstorypodcast/id/36243690

291: Raul Midón 04/10/2025

290: Stephin Merritt (The Magnetic Fields) 03/28/2025

289: Nels Cline 03/18/2025

287: Steven Greenberg (Lipps, Inc.) 01/31/2025

286: Makaya McCraven 01/24/2025

Mary Sweeney (from 2018) 01/17/2025

Mary Sweeney (from 2018) Throwback from 2018. Mary Sweeney needs some air. “There has to be a flow of fast and slow, and a pause to allow the listener or the spectator to digest and to project their own thoughts.” She thinks I should leave more space in my podcasts, to let it breathe. She tells me this as we sit in the screened in porch behind her summer house in Madison, Wisconsin. As she tells me this, cicadas chirp loudly, as if to underscore her point: “Today’s episode will not be edited! You will not remove us from this moment!” Mary Sweeney should know. She spent much of her career as a film editor, producer and writer collaborating with David Lynch. Beginning in 1985 with Blue Velvet, and continuing through the 2006 film Inland Empire, her editing credits include Blue Velvet (1986), Wild at Heart (1990), Twin Peaks (1991), Industrial Symphony (1991), Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With Me (1992), On the Air (1992), Hotel Room(1993), Lost Highway (1996), The Straight Story (2000), Mulholland Drive (2001) and Baraboo (2009). The relationship with Lynch was productive, fruitful, and nuanced (the two were partners in work and in life for much of that time) and they have a son together. At the time of this interview, Mary was working as a consulting producer and writer on Matthew Weiner’s series for Amazon, The Romanoffs. She is the Dino and Martha De Laurentiis Endowed Professor of film at USC, where she teaches Graduate Screenwriting Thesis and “Dreams, The Brain and Storytelling.” Before we had this conversation, Mary cheekily emailed me a list of topics that she would be happy to discuss. They included editing, producing, screenwriting, parenting, Paris, Cairo, pie baking, and the Catholic Church. Guess what we talked about? All of it. And we also talked at length about living and working in an intensely creative partnership with David Lynch for all those years (both personally and professionally), collaborating with one of the most innovative voices in film, and what’s so great about coming from a big family. Visit the Patreon Page for an extra 20 minutes of juicy conversation that didn’t make it into this edit. Thanks for listening. ORIGINAL LINK: /episode/index/show/thirdstorypodcast/id/34889920

285: Jacob Collier's First Interview 01/02/2025

285: Jacob Collier's First Interview In 2013, after having posted a series of videos recorded in his family home in North London of himself singing a cappella arrangements of classic - yet sometimes obscure - songs on YouTube, a critical mass began to form around Jacob Collier. His videos of Stevie Wonder’s “Isn’t She Lovely” and “Don’t You Worry Bout A Thing” were passed around by musicians and music enthusiasts and by 2014 he was being managed by Quincy Jones and traveling around the world. He was one of the first career artists to emerge on YouTube. Jacob’s journey since then has been nothing short of extraordinary. Today, at 30 years old, with six Grammys, millions of fans, and collaborations ranging from Herbie Hancock to Chris Martin, his influence spans generations. His Djesse project—four albums in six years, exploring 50 songs and countless collaborations —represents not just his creativity but his ability to bring others into his world. From arenas to intimate collaborations, Jacob Collier is now a fact of musical life. Yet, he remains tied to his roots: the small room in his mother’s house where it all began. His first album, In My Room, was both a tribute to that space and a manifesto for his artistic philosophy. Before his star had really begun to rise, I met with Collier in late 2014. He invited me to his family home in North London, where his mother greeted me with tea and cookies while he returned from university. When we finally sat down in his music room to talk, his brilliance was immediately apparent. He spoke about sound with sensitivity and clarity, blending perfect pitch, synesthesia, and a boundless curiosity. He was still a kid, but one with an expansive vision. That conversation remains a revelation. It captured a young artist at the cusp of greatness. It is also the first interview of its kind that exists with the extraordinary artist . Ten years after that first interview, I’m reminded why I started this podcast: to capture history as it’s being made. Jacob Collier’s story is one of boundless curiosity and connection—a message in a bottle that changed the tide. Get 45% off the Magic Mind bundle with with my link: /episode/index/show/thirdstorypodcast/id/34700465

284: Aaron Parks and Marta Sanchez 12/26/2024

283: Samora Pinderhughes and Jack DeBoe 12/19/2024

282: Allan Tannenbaum 12/05/2024

281: Maria Schneider 11/20/2024

280: Ben Sidran | The Election 11/11/2024

279: Andrew Bird 10/31/2024

278: Aaron Goldberg 10/22/2024

277: Lucy Kalantari 10/10/2024

276: Riley Mulherkar 09/24/2024

276: Riley Mulherkar Riley Mulherkar grew up in Seattle, the Pacific Northwest enclave that has been home to so many musical innovators over the years. He went to Garfield High School, a school that has fostered countless talents going all the way back to Quincy Jones who was himself a young trumpet player at the school in the 1940s. Riley was just eight years-old when he began seeing the legendary Garfield High School big-band play free gigs in his Seattle neighborhood; it’s one of the reasons he picked up the trumpet. He was clearly meant to play the instrument. By the time he got to Juilliard in New York, Riley had shown up on the radar of Wynton Marsalis, who became a mentor. If this story is sounding familiar, it’s because it resembles the experience of so many musicians of his generation who have similar origin stories. On a deeper level, it’s a story that echoes through the history of jazz - young musicians who are compelled to move to New York after only a small handful of interactions with their heroes. Riley Mulherkar is very much a man of his moment, and also mindful of those echoes from the past. His new album - his first under his own name and called, simply, Riley is awash in the echoes of history but also boldly embraces contemporary sounds and textures, it reframes classic material that was influential to him and positions his original compositions in that continuum. The album was a long time in the making. It’s the result of years of experimentation and reflection, and that patience is palpable in the music. Above all, the feeling of the record is totally compelling. And feeling was at the heart of the project all along. He says he was not interested in making something that sounded like an old record, but rather that felt the way he feels when he listens to his heroes, something he describes as “hyperrealism”. We spoke earlier this year about how the Riley album came together - he worked closely with pianist Chris Pattishall and guitarist/producer Rafiq Bhatia - his diverse career as a collaborator, music presenter, composer, and now solo artist, and how thinking of jazz as a family tree helped him to find his place in the music. /episode/index/show/thirdstorypodcast/id/33186162

275: Jesse Harris 09/03/2024

275: Jesse Harris Jesse Harris belongs to a generation of New York singer songwriters who came of age in the late nineties. He has made over 20 solo albums that walk the line between folk, jazz, pop, Brazilian and art rock. He’s also a much sought after co writer and collaborator who has written songs for and or with many others like Madeleine Peyroux, Melody Gardot, Lana del Rey, and most famously Norah Jones. Jesse was already well into his career when he met a young Norah Jones on a road trip through Texas and played his songs for her. He had already been signed and dropped from a major label with his band Once Blue (a project he started with Rebecca Martin, and which also featured musicians Ben Street, Kurt Rosenwinkel and Kenny Wollesen), and had already been exploring a space in his songwriting that played in between jazz and pop. But that chance encounter with Jones, who was still a student at the University of North Texas at the time, was the one that would change the course of Jesse’s career. They stayed in touch and began working together when Jones eventually moved to New York. Her debut album, 2002’s Come Away With Me contained five of his songs including the now ubiquitous standard “Don’t Know Why”. He also played guitar on the record. Their partnership has endured over the years - Jones and Harris have written together on and off ever since then - but it was that first record that arguably redirected the sound of certain strains of popular music and jazz for a generation. The success of Come Away With Me also opened new doors for Harris as a solo artist and a composer. Ultimately he started a label (Secret Sun, named after a solo album of the same name) to put out the projects that he produced for himself and others, and recently has been dividing his time between New York and Paris. Jesse is a relentlessly prolific songwriter, someone for whom songs are like air and water; they are simply a fact of life. Here he talks about Paper Flower, his most recent album recorded in Paris with American and French musicians, his approach to songwriting (“writer's block is a choice”) and production, taking things as they come, confession versus craft, venturing into the unconscious, and whether it is his fate to work with female artists. /episode/index/show/thirdstorypodcast/id/32869272

274: Ella Feingold 05/28/2024

273: Paula Cole 05/09/2024

272: Ben Sidran on Rainmaker 04/30/2024

272: Ben Sidran on Rainmaker In a career spanning over fifty years and thirty five records, Ben Sidran has established himself as a philosopher poet. Equally celebrated for his precise, probing writing style as he is for his improvised spoken word jazz raps, he has carved out a truly unique space for himself. The Times of London aptly described Ben as “the world’s first existential jazz rapper,” and The Chicago Sun Times once referred to him as “a renaissance man cast adrift in the modern world.” He is one of a kind. And he is, of course, also my dad. There is no one else like Ben so it’s not uncommon for his fans and followers to search his songs for meaning in times of trouble. When the world is uncertain, many find comfort in the wisdom of his words (myself included!). Some of those songs have become classics among his elite tribe of hipster devotees, like “Life’s A Lesson,” “Face Your Fears,” and “Don’t Cry For No Hipster”. So it was curious when, during the Covid pandemic, Ben chose to make his first ever fully instrumental record in 2022, Swing State. It was as if he had finally run out of words, at least for that moment, and he chose to let his piano tell the story that he was unable to sing about. But those who know Ben well understand that he’s never really out of words, so it was just a matter of time before he began to write again. And last summer he found himself back in a Parisian studio joined by a group of American and French musicians to make what would become his latest record, Rainmaker. In many ways Rainmaker is just another in a long line of Ben’s records - a new collection of songs written in his particular style of hipster philosophy set against a backdrop of easily digestible grooves. On the other hand, he describes the process of making it as “wrestling with the devil.” The accumulation of political, environmental and personal conditions made this particular project resonate differently for him. We spoke recently about the process of making Rainmaker, the stories behind the songs, his belief in the power of humor to help survive adverse situations, how Philip Roth’s retirement from writing affected him, whether or not he thinks retirement is truly possible for an artist, if this is in fact his last record, and what French rapper MC Solaar has to do with any of it. Ben has been featured on this podcast many times, most recently on his 80th birthday last August. On each of his birthdays going back a handful of years we have talked, as well as on various other episodes. If you have heard any of them, then you know that it is always a huge treat to have him, and in fact the episodes with him are among the most listened to and shared on the podcast. /episode/index/show/thirdstorypodcast/id/31033923

271: Shabaka 04/18/2024

271: Shabaka Shabaka Hutchings grew up between the UK and Barbados. He started playing clarinet as a young boy in Barbados and eventually moved back to England to go to music school in the early 2000s. After college he began a period of working furiously on a kaleidoscopic range of projects and became an icon of the new sound of London jazz, which integrated African rhythms and modes, Caribbean and Middle eastern sounds and was largely danceable. Shabaka himself has never fully embraced the jazz label. While the music is highly improvised, and it owes much to the American jazz tradition, his influences are very broad. Over the course of the past decade, the majority of his touring and recorded work has been with three bands: Sons of Kemet, The Comet is Coming and Shabaka and the Ancestors. In these formations he displayed a fundamental approach to creative practice in different contexts spanning Afro-Caribbean fusion, London dance music club culture and the South African jazz tradition. Part of his signature on the saxophone has been inspired by rappers, and his sound is often evocative of the human voice, conversational, expressive, and rhythmic. A somewhat chance encounter with a flute maker in Japan several years ago led him to develop an interest in the Shakuhachi flute tradition, and during covid he committed himself to the flute. Last year he announced that he would be putting away his saxophone and ending all of his bands to dedicate himself almost exclusively to playing wooden flutes. His latest release Perceive its beauty, Acknowledge its Grace (Impulse!) is his first full length album since making that transition. It’s more meditative, contemplative and introspective than his earlier work. But it’s still clearly Shabaka. The album features appearances by pianist Jason Moran, drummer Nasheet Waits, harpists Brandee Younger and Charles Overton, vocalists Lianne La Havas, Moses Sumney and Saul Williams, string wizard Miguel Atwood Ferguson and percussionist Carlos Niño. I talked to Shabaka earlier this year at Winter Jazzfest as he was embarking on a new adventure, both personally and musically. It was an absolutely fascinating conversation about his own creative development and philosophy, his new record, and why this historical moment is “showing the importance of slowing down, of patience, of contemplation.” /episode/index/show/thirdstorypodcast/id/30879278

270: Jose James 04/08/2024

The Third Story Podcast with Leo Sidran

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