E186 | Paul Young | Embracing Uncertainty: Finding Truth in the Unknowing - Part 2
Release Date: 04/21/2026
E191 | Paul Young | Return to the Shack, Death Row Friendships, and Living in the Grace of the Moment
Face to Face Podcast
E191 | Stories That Heal: An Intimate Talk with William Paul Young Paul Young on Return to the Shack, Death Row Friendships, and Living in the Grace of the Moment Melinda and Cathy welcome back author Paul Young to discuss his new book, Return to the Shack (releasing October 6), describing it as a continuation rather than a sequel and noting it expands the cast into a “choir,” with larger roles for Nan and the community around Mack. Young shares how the story began through a decade-long relationship with men on death row in Nashville, inspiring questions about what happens in Mack’s life...
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E190 | Lysa TerKeurst | Navigating Control and Trust
Face to Face Podcast
E190 | Lysa TerKeurst | Navigating Control and Trust Lysa TerKeurst on Control, Anxiety, and Trusting God with the Outcome | Melinda Wilson and Cathy Little celebrate reaching episode 190, noting the long wait and technical issues that shortened their interview with Lysa TerKeurst. TerKeurst, Proverbs 31 Ministries president and bestselling author, shares how her husband’s double life led to an unwanted divorce and shaped her recent books on rejection, forgiveness, boundaries, trust, and her new release, Making Peace With What I Can’t Control. She explains how anxiety and fear often...
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E189 | Dr. Alison Cook | The Secure Soul: Healing Through Presence, Parts Work, and God’s With-ness
Face to Face Podcast
The Secure Soul: Healing Through Presence, Parts Work, and God’s With-ness Therapist and psychologist of religion Dr. Alison Cook explains her work at the intersection of attachment wounds, emotional life, and how people experience God, including her training in Internal Family Systems (IFS) and her books Boundaries for Your Soul and The Secure Soul. She and discusses with us “with-ness” and presence as central to healing, contrasting quick-fix problem solving and religious bypassing with learning to be with uncomfortable parts without shame. Cook outlines her “recognize and...
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E188 | Susan Carson | Safe Enough to Heal: Why the Church Gets Trauma Wrong and What to Do Instead
Face to Face Podcast
E188 | Susan Carson | Safe Enough to Heal: Why the Church Gets Trauma Wrong and What to Do Instead Welcome to the Face to Face podcast and episode 188 with spiritual director and author Susan Carson. Susan tells her story of meeting Jesus at 18, later experiencing spiritual trauma, and moving into a contemplative path of prayer and inner healing. We talk about how neuroscience, Christian mystics (especially Julian of Norwich), and the biblical idea of kenosis (Philippians 2) come together in her “safe space” approach—noise-free, shame-free, and formula-free—focused on embodied,...
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E187 | Dr. Jason Swan Clark | Trauma Healing, Mental Health and Ignatian Spiritual Exercises
Face to Face Podcast
In episode 187, we welcome Dr. Jason Swan Clark, a professor, spiritual director, former pastor, and theologian, who recounts his traumatic childhood, coming to faith at 17, decades of church planting and pastoral leadership, a nervous breakdown at 30, and ongoing work integrating mental health and faith. Jason describes how suffering shaped his leadership, distinguishes healing from transformation, and explains Ignatian spirituality and the Spiritual Exercises, including consolation/desolation and a practical discernment process. He closes with a personal story of meeting Jesus in...
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E186 | Paul Young | Embracing Uncertainty: Finding Truth in the Unknowing - Part 2
Face to Face Podcast
E186 | Paul Young | Embracing Uncertainty: Finding Truth in the Unknowing - Part 2 Paul Young (Part 2) on Prayer as Relationship, 12-Step Community, Healing vs Curing, and Return to the Shack In episode 186 (Part 2) of the Face to Face Podcast, we continue our conversation with Paul Young, discussing prayer as ongoing conversation within relationship and how spiritual practices can help but often need community to endure. We talk about honesty without fixing, and how close relationships expose areas needing healing. The conversation explores reclaiming inner wisdom, resisting church-driven...
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E185 | Paul Young | Embracing Uncertainty: Finding Truth in the Unknowing - Part 1
Face to Face Podcast
E185 | Paul Young | Embracing Uncertainty: Finding Truth in the Unknowing - Part 1 We are excited to welcome back one of our favorites - Paul Young (author of The Shack) for part one of a two-episode conversation, while also sharing updates on Immanuel Approach for Life Level 1 and 2 cohorts and a Wheaton College research team studying the model’s efficacy. Paul reflects on the necessity of “unknowing” as humility and openness, contrasting intellectual belief with whole-person trust and relational knowing. The discussion explores trauma and religious performance...
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E184 | Dr. Bob Schuchts on Healing the Whole Person, Spiritual Formation, and Bridging Catholic–Protestant Divides
Face to Face Podcast
Episode 184: Dr. Bob Schuchts on Healing the Whole Person, Spiritual Formation, and Bridging Catholic–Protestant Divides On Episode 184 of the Face to Face Podcast, we welcome Dr. Bob Schuchts, founder of the John Paul II Healing Center, to discuss healing ministry from a Catholic perspective and its overlap with the Immanuel Approach. Dr. Schuchts shares his background as a longtime therapist, a pivotal spiritual encounter that led him to study many prayer modalities, and his current work offering healing and training conferences that emphasize safety, surrender to the Holy Spirit, abiding,...
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E183 | Untangling Love: A Journey with Wayne Jacobsen
Face to Face Podcast
Wayne Jacobson on Experiencing God’s Love, Presence, and Freedom Beyond Performance | Face to Face Podcast Ep. 183 In this episode of the Face to Face Podcast, we interview author and former pastor Wayne Jacobson about moving from a transactional, performance-based faith to an experiential life rooted in God’s affection, presence, and fullness. Wayne shares his background, ministry disillusionment, repeated experiences of betrayal, and how God’s presence slowly meets people in pain and trauma. He explains how a curative (not punitive) view of the atonement reshaped his view of the...
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E182 | Brian Zhand | Christian Nationalism, the Kingdom of Jesus, and a More Beautiful Christianity
Face to Face Podcast
Brian Zahnd on Christian Nationalism, the Kingdom of Jesus, and a More Beautiful Christianity | Face to Face Podcast Ep. 182 In episode 182 of the podcast, Melinda interviews pastor, author, and theologian Brian Zahnd (Word of Life Church, St. Joseph, Missouri), while co-host Cathy is absent due to losing her voice and shares updates on Immanuel Institute trainings and the standalone Understanding Trauma Course. Zahnd recounts leading one congregation for 44 years, the church’s early rapid growth, and a major theological recalibration that moved them toward the Christian tradition and...
info_outlineE186 | Paul Young | Embracing Uncertainty: Finding Truth in the Unknowing - Part 2