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The Heart of Magic With Dustin Tavella

Discourse in Magic

Release Date: 11/07/2024

Trading Places: Jonah Babins with The Magic Guys show art Trading Places: Jonah Babins with The Magic Guys

Discourse in Magic

This week, Discourse in Magic looks a little different. Instead of Jonah interviewing a guest, we’re sharing an episode where the tables were turned. Jonah recently sat down with Josh Norbido and Nick Kay—better known as The Magic Guys—on their popular Australian-based livestream and podcast. The Magic Guys actually "robbed" Jonah of the FSM Award for top Magic Podcast this year, but there are no hard feelings here. Their show is famous for its high energy, active YouTube community, and hilarious banter, making this one of the most engaging "crossover" episodes yet. In this session, Josh...

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Mastering the Perfect Sales Call show art Mastering the Perfect Sales Call

Discourse in Magic

In this episode, Jonah Babins breaks down a critical mistake magicians make when a lead finally lands in their inbox: treating the sales call like a logistics checklist. While knowing the venue and guest count is important, a truly professional sales call does something much deeper. Jonah explores how the right questions don't just give you information—they prove your expertise and give you the exact language you need to close the gig. Whether you’re performing at high-end weddings or corporate holiday parties, the strategy remains the same: stop asking about logistics and start asking...

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Where Has Jonah Been? show art Where Has Jonah Been?

Discourse in Magic

In this solo episode, Jonah Babins pulls back the curtain on the eight-month hiatus of Discourse in Magic. Since August 2025, the podcast feed has been quiet, leading many listeners to reach out and check-in. Today, Jonah is back to explain his disappearance, share a major business epiphany from his recent travels, and lay out the future of the show. The truth is, Jonah hasn’t been resting; he’s been on a whirlwind journey across the globe. From Auckland to Melbourne, and Pennsylvania to Denver, Jonah has been physically traveling to visit members of his Magic Business Mastermind. He...

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Weaponize Your Show show art Weaponize Your Show

Discourse in Magic

In this episode of Discourse in Magic, Jonah Babins dives into a powerful concept from his mastermind sessions: Weaponizing Your Show. The idea is simple—make your show book you more shows. Beyond just delivering a strong performance, Jonah shares five practical tactics to turn every gig into a referral engine, rebooking machine, and review generator. If you want your performances to create momentum in your business, this episode is packed with actionable advice you can implement right away. Mention What You Do Onstage Audiences rarely know whether magic is your hobby or your full-time...

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Thoughts on FISM show art Thoughts on FISM

Discourse in Magic

Thoughts on FISM: The Good, The Bad, and The Overwhelming In this solo episode of Discourse in Magic, Jonah Babins shares his raw and honest reflections on FISM 2025. From mind-blowing performances to marathon-length competitions, Jonah walks through the highs and lows of the world’s biggest and most prestigious magic convention and competition. Whether you attended or are just curious about how FISM functions, this episode offers a candid inside look. Highlights from the World Stage Jonah opens with praise for the best of the best—performers whose acts left audiences stunned. Standout...

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Jamie Allan: Building Big Magic With Authenticity show art Jamie Allan: Building Big Magic With Authenticity

Discourse in Magic

In this episode of Discourse in Magic, Jonah sits down with Jamie Allan, a pioneering illusionist and producer known for blending large-scale magic with theatrical storytelling. From growing up in a showbiz family in the UK to launching Broadway-scale productions in New York, Jamie shares the ups and downs of his journey—offering invaluable lessons about reinvention, creative resilience, and staying authentic in a world of illusions. From Red Coats to Broadway Jamie traces his early days performing in holiday parks and on cruise ships, where he learned to love the stage and reject the grind...

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The Art and Hustle of Modern Magic with Xavier Mortimer show art The Art and Hustle of Modern Magic with Xavier Mortimer

Discourse in Magic

Jonah sits down with viral magician  to trace an unlikely journey—from learning back‑and‑front palming out of a gas‑station booklet to topping “Best Family‑Friendly Show” lists on the Las Vegas Strip and amassing billions of social‑video views. Along the way they dig into creative misfires, the treadmill of nightly shows, and why rehearsing a TikTok illusion can cost $20 K.   From Gas‑Station Book to Barn‑Built Show Xavier’s origin story starts with a coincidence: his father picked up a sleight‑of‑hand booklet as a fuel‑pump freebie. Two weeks of rural...

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The Business of Fringe Magic with Luke Oseland show art The Business of Fringe Magic with Luke Oseland

Discourse in Magic

In this episode, Jonah Babins is joined by rising UK magic star to explore a journey that spans from toy magic sets and teenage tinkering to sellouts and cruise ship stints. From co-creating to redefining how young magicians build their brands, Luke shares the behind-the-scenes of developing shows, finding your performance voice, and building a magic career from scratch. You’ll learn how to structure a magic show, when to take creative risks, and why sometimes the best marketing strategy is just putting on a killer show. How Luke Got Started in Magic Luke’s magic journey began like...

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Summit, AI and Where I Am show art Summit, AI and Where I Am

Discourse in Magic

In this week’s episode of Discourse in Magic, Jonah Babins returns with a behind-the-scenes look at the Mexico Mastermind Summit, his latest adventures in AI, and what’s next for the magic community. After a brief hiatus, Jonah shares the lessons, breakthroughs, and future plans that are shaping his approach to magic and business in 2024. The Summit Experience: Magic, Community, and Growth Jonah kicks things off by recapping the recent Mastermind Summit in Cancun, where 40 magicians gathered for a week of learning, jamming, and business breakthroughs. Unlike traditional conventions, this...

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Pioneering Corporate Magic with Bill Herz show art Pioneering Corporate Magic with Bill Herz

Discourse in Magic

In this episode, Jonah Babins is joined by corporate magic legend to unpack a career that spans summer camps, corporate boardrooms, and headline features in . From his early days performing with to founding Magicorp and representing world-class talent, Bill shares the highs, the hustle, and the hilarious behind-the-scenes of building a career in corporate magic. You’ll learn what makes a magician bookable, how to navigate pricing, and why a magician’s greatest asset might be understanding the client better than they understand themselves. How Bill Got Started in Magic Like many...

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More Episodes

Join us as we sit down with the incredibly talented Dustin Tavella, winner of the 2021 season of America's Got Talent, who shares his inspiring journey from a young magician dressed as a clown to a celebrated performer captivating audiences worldwide. Dustin recounts how his passion for magic began with a simple magic kit and a special trick gifted by his uncle, setting him on a path of discovery and performance. His story takes a fascinating turn as he explores the music industry, producing and writing for significant projects before rediscovering his love for magic through a serendipitous encounter. Dustin’s experiences highlight the importance of storytelling and connection in making magic meaningful, and he generously shares how his creative process is influenced by his wife's intuition and his involvement in a homeless ministry.

 

Explore the intersection of music and magic as Dustin reflects on his artistic journey and the challenges of finding a singular style. Despite his success in the music industry, he grappled with the desire for deeper fulfillment, leading him back to the enchanting world of magic. Drawing parallels between these two art forms, Dustin emphasizes the importance of audience engagement over technical perfection, both in music and magic. Through personal anecdotes, he offers valuable insights into balancing skill with the ability to connect and resonate with audiences, a theme that resonates throughout his performances.

 

Listen in as we explore the power of authenticity and originality in magic, particularly in the high-stakes environment of America's Got Talent. Dustin discusses the challenges of crafting unique acts and how personal storytelling sets performers apart. We touch on the influence of mentorship and collaboration, highlighting how diverse perspectives from friends and mentors enriched Dustin’s magic. Finally, Dustin shares his experiences performing in Branson, Missouri, a vibrant backdrop for his evolving magic show. Whether discussing the creative freedom found in Branson or the importance of genuine connection, this episode offers an inspiring look at how personal experiences and feedback shape a truly authentic magic performance.

 

Music, Magic, and Finding Style 

 

Dustin takes us through a fascinating journey of transitioning between two artistic realms: music and magic. He reflects on his experiences in the music industry, where he had the chance to work with producers and contribute to significant projects like ESPN and the 100th anniversary of the Rose Bowl. Despite his success, Dustin grappled with the challenge of not finding a singular style due to his diverse interests in various music genres, which, while a hindrance as an artist, proved beneficial from a production perspective. This reflection led him to a crossroads, where he realized that neither end of the music industry's spectrum were fulfilling. Transitioning into magic, Dustin drew parallels between the two art forms, emphasizing the importance of connecting with audiences. 

Authenticity and Originality in Magic

We unpack the unique challenges and opportunities of performing magic on a platform like America's Got Talent (AGT). We discuss the difficulty of creating new and unique acts in a space where many iconic magicians have already set high standards. The conversation highlights the importance of authenticity and personal storytelling as key differentiators in magic, emphasizing that while many can purchase tricks, the real magic lies in who the magician is as a person. We touch on the notion that people can sense authenticity, which becomes crucial for magicians who inherently deal in illusion. By embracing individuality and honesty, performers can resonate more deeply with their audience. This discussion offers valuable insights for current performers, underscoring the significance of being genuine and how that authenticity can become the defining element of a magician's act.

Authenticity in Gospel Magic

We discuss the intricate balance of performing authentic magic that conveys meaningful messages, particularly within the realm of gospel and inspirational magic. We discuss the challenges that arise when magic feels forced or inauthentic, drawing parallels to scripted and impersonal experiences often felt in churches. Emphasizing the importance of starting with a genuine story, I highlight the need for the message to stand alone, even without the magic trick. The conversation underscores the significance of sharing personal struggles and emotions to connect with audiences, rather than projecting an image of perfection. By revealing our own vulnerabilities and journeys, we aim to resonate more deeply with people, making the magic a supportive element rather than the sole focus.

Endless Chain

Brent Braun

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