EP249 - From License Costs to Lasting Value - Mastering M365 & Copilot ROI with Phil Hames and Ian Luckett

Phil explained that Microsoft has made Copilot a central part of its roadmap. This means MSPs cannot afford to sit back and wait. If you are not leading your clients into Copilot, someone else will. That could mean losing accounts that you have worked hard to win. Phil shared how his own business moved from experimenting with ChatGPT into fully embedding Copilot across their development and operations. By doing so, they cut development cycles down to a fraction of the time. What used to take ten days is now done in a single day. That sort of productivity gain is not about gimmicks, it is about efficiency, growth, and having more capacity to serve clients better. 

One of the big themes from our conversation was the need to link Copilot to ROI. Phil Hames emphasised that clients do not care about the tech in isolation, they care about outcomes. If you are speaking to an MD or FD, the language is about time saved, money protected, and revenue increased. A great example Phil shared was a systems integrator who said without Copilot he would need two assistants to handle the workload. That is the kind of proof point that matters in boardroom conversations. If MSPs focus on ROI, then Copilot becomes a way to open up strategic sales conversations instead of ending up as small talk at events. 

We also talked about how to use Copilot to create professional service opportunities. Too often, MSPs risk giving it away by showing the wow factor without packaging it up. Phil outlined how readiness assessments can form the foundation. By reviewing secure scores, checking for malware, ensuring data backup practices are solid, and highlighting user adoption gaps, you immediately move the discussion into risk management and ongoing service delivery. He explained that the average secure score across Microsoft 365 tenants is barely above 50 per cent, and only a small minority get above 70 per cent. That means the majority of businesses are leaving themselves exposed. By positioning Copilot readiness alongside security and compliance, MSPs can frame projects that deliver real value and recurring service opportunities. 

One of the most powerful ideas from Phil Hames was how to approach Copilot not as a standalone toy but as part of the wider Microsoft stack. That means choosing strategic projects with clients, solving real problems with measurable outcomes, and then wrapping managed services around them. He shared the story of an agricultural business that used AI to transform their call handling process. By capturing information automatically, decisions could be made faster, response times improved, and fewer staff were needed to handle the same volume. That is where Copilot creates ROI. MSPs who take this approach will have clear case studies to take to prospects and new markets. 

We also explored the risk conversation. Many MSPs worry about how to move from talking about features to talking about business value. A practical way is to ask a client to outline their biggest business risks. If IT is not near the top, that raises alarms in itself. By integrating Copilot into this discussion, MSPs can highlight how unprotected data, misconfigured SharePoint access, or weak security controls can turn new AI functionality into a huge vulnerability. As Phil put it, switching on Copilot without readiness is like leaving the office door wide open overnight. This makes the need for ongoing management, monitoring, and support services absolutely clear. 

Phil also encouraged MSPs to think about specialisation. If you build a Copilot project in one sector, do not reinvent the wheel for the next client. Package it up, document it, and replicate it across similar businesses. This approach means MSPs can build repeatable services, increase margins, and create frameworks that scale. It is the same principle as writing a book that sells thousands of copies instead of a single edition. By niching down, you can become the go to provider for that sector’s AI and Copilot needs. 

As we wrapped up the conversation, Phil Hames outlined three clear actions for MSPs. First, use Copilot internally so you have credibility and real stories to share. Second, package your offering so it is not only about licences but about readiness, adoption, and measurable usage. Third, keep ROI at the centre of every conversation. Without showing return on investment, clients will not stay engaged and you will miss the chance to build lasting value. 

This episode was packed with practical insight that every MSP can take away. Copilot is not a passing trend, it is a core part of Microsoft’s future and therefore a core part of the MSP service stack. If you approach it with the mindset of ROI, risk management, and repeatable solutions, then it becomes a gateway to bigger projects, stronger client relationships, and more profitable services. Phil Hames summed it up perfectly: if you are not in AI, how are you going to be in IT? It is time to embrace Copilot, not as a gimmick, but as a tool for growth, security, and long term client value. 

Reach out to Phil Hames by visiting the TBSC website, just click HERE, or you can also email him directly at [e-mail] 

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Until next time, look after yourself and I’ll catch up with you soon!