What can AI teach us about the mind?
Many Minds
Everyone is talking about AI these days. Often these conversations are about how AI might upend education, or work, or social life, or maybe civilization itself. But among cognitive scientists and psychologists the conversation inevitably drifts toward other questions. What does this latest generation of AI tell us about the human mind? Is it putting old ideas and theories to rest? Is it ushering in new ones? Will AI—in other words—also upend cognitive science? My guests today are and . Mike is a Professor of Psychology at Stanford University, where focuses on language learning and...
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Mutualisms all the way down
Many Minds
No one is an island. We all depend on each other in critical, often tangled ways. And when I say "we" and "each other" I don't just mean humans. Yes, we humans rely on other humans. But we also rely on bees, yeasts, dogs, bacteria, and countless other creatures big and small. These interspecies dependencies—or mutualisms, as biologists call them—have deflected and inflected our history. And there's no doubt they will also inflect our future. My guest today is . Rob is Professor of Applied Ecology at North Carolina State University, where he studies the creatures and ecologies all...
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Seven metaphors for AI
Many Minds
If you wanted a petri dish for understanding metaphors—how they emerge and evolve and jostle with each other—it would be hard to do better than the world of AI. We talk about AI systems variously as coaches or co-pilots, little genies or alien intelligences. Some researchers claim that AIs "grow," that they're entering their phase of "adolescence." Critics deride AI products as slop and dismiss LLMs as a kind of autocomplete on steroids. What's behind these different characterizations? Which ones are accurate and which are unfair? And are our metaphors mostly colorful rhetoric or do they...
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Origins of the kiss
Many Minds
Humans do some pretty weird things. Some of us will sit in searingly hot rooms or jump into icy ponds. Others risk their lives trying to climb to new heights or dive to new depths. And every once in a while, two otherwise normal-seeming humans will lean in close to each other, open mouths, lock lips, and swap a hearty helping of microbes. You may even know people who've done this. But why? Are we the only animals who kiss? What could be the deeper origins of this truly bizarre behavior? My guest today is Dr. . Matilda is an Evolutionary Biologist at the University of Oxford. She's...
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The aura of metaphor
Many Minds
Metaphors matter. They enliven our speech and our prose; they animate our arguments and stir our passions. Some metaphors power political movements; others propel scientific revolutions. These little figures of speech delight, provoke, captivate, shock, amuse, and galvanize us. In one way or another, metaphors just seem to help us make sense of a messy world. But how do they do all this? Whence their peculiar powers? What does it say about the human mind that we just can’t escape our metaphors—and frankly don’t want to? My guest today is . Steve is an Assistant Professor of...
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From the archive: How should we think about IQ?
Many Minds
Hello friends, and happy new year! We're gearing up for a new run of episodes starting later in January. In the meanwhile, enjoy this pick from our archives. ------ [originally aired October 16, 2024] IQ is, to say the least, a fraught concept. Psychologists have studied IQ—or g for “general cognitive ability”—maybe more than any other psychological construct. And they’ve learned some interesting things about it. That it's remarkably stable over the lifespan. That it really is general: people who ace one test of intellectual ability tend to ace others. And that IQs have...
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From 'On Humans': Can the brain understand itself?
Many Minds
Hello there, friends! We hope you're having a restful holiday, or a lively holiday, or whatever mix of those you prefer. As the year draws to a close, we at Many Minds are taking a much needed pause ourselves. But we wanted to share with you an episode from a podcast that we've been following for some time called . It's hosted by Ilari Mäkelä. It looks at humanity from all angles to understand where we come from and where we're going. The episode we're sharing features an interview with biologist and historian of science, Matthew Cobb; he's also the author of the book, . In...
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In search of names
Many Minds
Alright, friends—we’ve come to the end of the 2025 run of Many Minds! Our final episode of the year is an audio essay by yours truly. This is a classic format for the show, one that we only do every so often. Today’s essay is about names. It’s about the question of whether animals have something like names for each other. And it’s also about a deeper question: What even is a name? How do humans use names? How does the historical and ethnographic record kind of complicate our everyday understanding of what names are. I had a lot of fun putting this together, and I do hope you...
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The value of animal cultures
Many Minds
Not long ago culture was considered rare in nature, maybe even uniquely human. But that's changed. We now know that the tree of life is buzzing with culture—and not just on a few lonely branches. Creatures great and small learn songs, migration routes, and feeding techniques from each other. Many species build up reservoirs of knowledge over generations. This has profound implications, not just for our understanding of the natural world, but also for our efforts to protect it. My guest today is . Philippa is an Honorary Lecturer at the University of Exeter, with one foot in science and...
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What is memory for?
Many Minds
Everyone loves a good evolutionary puzzle. Why do we have appendices? Why do we dream? Why do we blush? At first glance, memory would not seem to be in this category. It's clearly useful to remember stuff, after all—to know where to find food, to remember your mistakes so you don't repeat them, to recall who’s friendly and who’s fierce. In fact, though, certain aspects of memory—when you hold them up to the light—turn out to be quite puzzling indeed. My guests today are and . Ali is a philosopher at the London School of Economics (LSE); Johannes is a philosopher at York University,...
info_outlineAI therapists and caregivers. Digital tutors and advisors and friends. Artificial lovers. Griefbots trained to imitate dead loved ones. Welcome, to the bustling world of AI-powered chatbots. This was once the stuff of science fiction, but it's becoming just the stuff of everyday life. What will these systems do to our society, to our relationships, to our social skills and motivations? Are these bots destined to leave us hollowed out, socially stunted, screen-addicted, and wary of good-old-fashioned, in-the-flesh human interaction? Or could they actually be harnessed for good?
My guest today is Dr. Henry Shevlin. Henry is a philosopher and AI ethicist at the Leverhulme Centre for the Future of Intelligence (CFI) at Cambridge University. In a series of recent papers, Henry has been exploring this brave new world of "social AI" and its philosophical, ethical, and psychological dimensions.
Here, Henry and I sketch the current landscape of social AI—from dedicated platforms like Replika and CharacterAI to the more subtly social uses of ChatGPT and Claude. We consider several tragic cases that have recently rocketed these kinds of services into public awareness. We talk about what's changed about AI systems—quite recently—that’s now made them capable of sustained relationships. We linger on the possible risks of social AI and, perhaps less obviously, on the possible benefits. And we consider the prospects for regulation. Along the way, Henry and I also talk about his 81-year-old father, his teenage self, and, of course, the kids these days; we consider whether social AI, in its potential harms, is more like social media or more like violent video games; we talk about "deskilling" and it's opposite "upskilling"; and we of course take stock of a certain elephant in the room.
Alright friends, this is a fun one. We've been wanting to explore this dawning age of social AI for some time. And we finally found, in Henry, the right person to do it with. Enjoy!
Notes
3:00 – The piece in The Guardian—'It's time to prepare for AI personhood'—by Jacy Reece Anthis.
5:00 – The Replika subreddit.
9:30 – News coverage of recent research on the bedside manner of AI systems.
10:30 – For a recent paper on AI by the philosopher Ophelia Deroy, see here.
11:30 – For some of Dr. Shevlin's recent writing about "social AI", see here and here.
13:30 – OpenAI’s recent report, 'How People Use ChatGPT'.
16:30 – For examples of popular media coverage of recent (tragic) cases involving chatbots, see here, here, here, and here.
21:00 – The paper by Rose Guingrich and Michael Graziano on how users describe their relationships with chatbots.
24:00 – The precise quote by Mark Twain is: “Nothing so needs reforming as other people’s habits.”
25:30 – The classic paper on Mary’s room by Frank Jackson.
27:00 – Dr. Shevlin has also worked on questions about animal minds (e.g., here), as well as a number of issues in AI beyond “social AI” (e.g., here, here).
30:00 – The classic essay by Isaiah Berlin on hedgehogs and foxes.
32:00 – The classic paper on ELIZA, introduced by Joseph Weizenbaum in 1966. A version of ELIZA that you can interact with. For work by Sherry Turkle, see here.
34:00 – Dr. Shevlin’s recent paper about the “anthropomimetic turn” in contemporary AI.
41:00 – For recent work on whether current chatbots pass a version of the Turing test, see here.
45:00 – Ted Chiang’s story, ‘The Lifecycle of Software Objects,’ was re-published as part his collection of short fiction, Exhalation.
46:00 – For Dr. Shevlin’s recent writing on machine consciousness, see here.
48:00 – For more on the possibility of consciousness in borderline cases (like AI systems), see our past episodes here and here.
52:00 – The study on whether people attribute consciousness to LLMs.
54:30 – A recent paper on griefbots by scholars at the University of Cambridge. A popular article about the phenomenon.
55:30 – A blogpost describing the so-called DigiDan experiment.
1:00:00 – Some of the potentially positive social qualities of AIs are discussed in this essay by Paul Bloom.
1:19:30 – For more on Iain Banks’ culture series, see here.
1:20:30 – A popular article on the phenomenon of hikikomori.
Recommendations
The Oxford Intersections: AI in Society collection
The new podcast, Our Lives with Bots
Many Minds is a project of the Diverse Intelligences Summer Institute, which is made possible by a generous grant from the John Templeton Foundation to Indiana University. The show is hosted and produced by Kensy Cooperrider, with help from Assistant Producer Urte Laukaityte and with creative support from DISI Directors Erica Cartmill and Jacob Foster. Our artwork is by Ben Oldroyd.
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