#321 – Dopamine and addiction: navigating pleasure, pain, and the path to recovery | Anna Lembke, M.D.
Release Date: 10/14/2024
The Peter Attia Drive
In this quarterly podcast summary (QPS) episode, Peter summarizes his biggest takeaways from the last three months of guest interviews on the podcast. Peter shares key insights from his discussions on diverse topics such as aerobic efficiency and VO2 max with Olav Aleksander Bu; insulin resistance with Ralph DeFronzo; economics of the US healthcare system and cost-saving strategies with Saum Sutaria; diagnosis and treatment of autism, ADHD, and anxiety in children with Trenna Sutcliffe; and strength training with Mike Israetel. Additionally, Peter shares any personal behavioral adjustments...
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Ralph DeFronzo is a distinguished diabetes researcher and clinician whose groundbreaking work on insulin resistance has reshaped the understanding and treatment of type 2 diabetes. In this episode, Ralph shares insights from his five decades of research, including his pivotal role in bringing metformin to the U.S. and developing SGLT2 inhibitors. Ralph explores the impacts of insulin resistance on specific organs, the pharmacologic interventions available, and the gold-standard euglycemic clamp method for measuring insulin resistance. This episode is a masterclass in the pathophysiology and...
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Mike Israetel is a sports physiologist, competitive bodybuilder, and co-founder of Renaissance Periodization, where he coaches athletes and professionals in diet and weight training. In this episode, Mike shares his journey from powerlifting to academia, breaking down the core principles of resistance training, including exercise selection, volume, intensity, and frequency. He debunks common misconceptions about strength training, explains how to structure an effective program for beginners and advanced lifters, and provides candid insights into his experience with anabolic steroids,...
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Tom Dayspring is a world-renowned expert in clinical lipidology and a previous guest on The Drive. In this episode, Tom explores the foundations of atherosclerosis and why atherosclerotic cardiovascular disease (ASCVD) is the leading cause of death worldwide for both men and women. He examines how the disease develops from a pathological perspective and discusses key risk factors, including often-overlooked contributors such as insulin resistance and chronic kidney disease. He breaks down the complexities of cholesterol and lipoproteins—including LDL, VLDL, IDL, and HDL—with an in-depth...
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Olav Aleksander Bu is an internationally renowned sports scientist acclaimed for his coaching prowess with elite athletes spanning a diverse range of sports disciplines. In this episode, Olav returns to dive deeper into his groundbreaking work as an endurance coach, exercise scientist, engineer, and physiologist. The discussion explores his data-driven approach to coaching, unpacking key performance metrics like functional threshold power, VO2 max, and lactate threshold, while emphasizing the importance of consistent testing protocols. Olav shares insights on how training methodologies...
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Trenna Sutcliffe is a developmental behavioral pediatrician and the founder and medical director of the Sutcliffe Clinic in the San Francisco Bay Area, where she partners with families to provide care for children facing behavioral challenges, developmental differences, and school struggles. In this episode, Trenna shares her journey into developmental and behavioral pediatrics, including her pioneering work at Stanford and her expertise in autism, ADHD, and anxiety—the "three As." She explores the diagnostic processes, the overlap and comorbidities of these conditions, and the importance...
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James Clear is the author of the New York Times bestseller Atomic Habits. His extensive research into human behavior has helped him identify key components of habit formation and develop the “Four Laws of Behavioral Change.” In this episode, James provides insights into how both good and bad habits are formed, including the influence of genetics, environment, social circles, and more. He points to changes one can make to cultivate more perseverance and discipline and describes the profound impact habits can have when tying them into one’s self-identity. Finally, James breaks down his...
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Anna Lembke is the Chief of the Stanford Addiction Medicine Dual Diagnosis Clinic and author of Dopamine Nation: Finding Balance in the Age of Indulgence. In this episode, Anna dives deep into the biochemistry and neurobiology of addiction, exploring the critical role of dopamine and the prefrontal cortex. She shares her framework for diagnosing and treating addiction, providing real-world examples involving alcohol, gambling, cannabis, social media, and more. Anna outlines the risk factors for addiction, including inherited and nurture-based risks, explores the rise of addictions in younger generations, and discusses effective ways to address these issues with children. Additionally, she touches on healthy coping strategies, the evolution of the “marshmallow experiment,” and provides insights into GLP-1 agonists as a possible tool for addiction treatment. Finally, she reflects on the value of 12-step programs and how she navigates the emotional challenges of her work.
We discuss:
- The role of dopamine and the prefrontal cortex in addiction [3:00];
- The clinical definition of addiction and the behavioral criteria for diagnosing it [13:00];
- Assessing alcohol use: patterns, risks, and addiction diagnosis [17:15];
- Applying the addiction diagnosis framework using gambling as an example [21:45];
- Exploring addiction variability: how nature, nurture, and access shape individual vulnerability and drug of choice [25:15];
- How abstinence from addictive behaviors can help reset the brain’s reward system and improve mental health [41:15];
- Safely abstaining from addiction substances, drugs needing medical supervision, and other key considerations [51:30];
- Transitioning from abstinence to long-term recovery: tools and considerations [59:00];
- Exploring behavioral addictions like sex addiction, and the gender differences in addiction patterns [1:08:30];
- Factors contributing to the increasing levels of addiction across the world [1:13:45];
- How online pornography can affect young boys' developing brains and lead to addictive behaviors, and strategies for parents to address this issue [1:23:30];
- The link between social media use and declines in mental health, potential solutions, and protective measures [1:34:45];
- How exercise affects brain chemistry, the role of dopamine and endorphins, and how exercise can become addictive [1:44:00];
- Cold-water immersion for mood regulation, and other healthy coping strategies [1:47:15];
- The “marshmallow experiment”: how broken promises affect behavior and trustworthy environments help children develop self-control [1:54:00];
- Can GLP-1 agonists be useful in treating addiction? [1:58:30];
- The benefits of 12-step programs [2:06:00];
- Why understanding a patient’s story is essential for meaningful psychiatric care [2:11:45]; and
- More.
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