A Sabbath Summer, Part 1: Anticipating Rest
The Allender Center Podcast
What if Sabbath isn’t just a day on your calendar—but a mindset you carry with you into every part of your life? In the first bite-sized episode of our 3-part summer series, Dr. Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen invite us to anticipate rest and play, not just plan for it. They explore how Sabbath can be more than a scheduled pause—it can be a rhythm woven into your days, your relationships, even a quiet afternoon on the porch. Can you give yourself permission to imagine delight this summer—without immediately turning it into a to-do list? And how do we hold space for the...
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The Dynamics of DARVO
The Allender Center Podcast
DARVO—”Deny, Attack, Reverse Victim and Offender”—is a powerful manipulation tactic often used to silence those who speak up about harm. In this episode, Dan and Rachael unpack how DARVO shows up not only in personal relationships but also in churches, politics, and other systems where power is protected at all costs. Together, they explore the deep psychological and spiritual impact of DARVO, particularly in narcissistic relationships or systems. Drawing from Dr. Jennifer Freyd’s work on betrayal trauma, they name the disorientation, grief, and exile that often follow when someone...
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How to Bring Story Work to Your Faith Community with Petra Malekzadeh
The Allender Center Podcast
What does it take to cultivate real transformation in a faith community? Not just busier programs or better Bible studies, but real change – mind, body, and soul? In this episode, Dr. Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen talk with Petra Malekzadeh, Facilitation Development Manager at the Allender Center, about what it looks like to bring story work into the life of a local church. Drawing on her years of ministry leadership and her training in Narrative Focused Trauma Care®, Petra shares both the challenges and beauty of inviting people to engage their stories as part of...
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“Heaven Help Us” with John Kasich
The Allender Center Podcast
If you like a good story, we think you’ll like this episode. This week, we’re honored to welcome John Kasich—a national leader, lifelong public servant, and gifted storyteller. Throughout his career, he’s met thousands of people, and he’s here to share just a few of the stories that have stayed with him. As the 69th Governor of Ohio (2011–2019), Gov. Kasich led with a focus on unity and problem-solving. He rose to national prominence during his 2016 presidential run and continues to serve today through his work with the Kasich Company, his role as a political analyst for NBC and...
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“Experience Jesus. Really.” with John Eldredge
The Allender Center Podcast
We’re living in a time that’s quietly—but profoundly—reshaping our souls. Formed by a world of speed, efficiency, and endless information, most of us have been trained to seek quick answers, avoid ambiguity, and live with the belief that if we just do X, then Y will happen. It's not our fault—we’ve been discipled by our cultural moment, where data is king and mystery is often treated with suspicion. In the process, many of us have come to approach faith with an overdeveloped left brain—craving clarity and control, while growing uncomfortable with the unknown, the mystical, the...
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“Saving Face” with Aimee Byrd
The Allender Center Podcast
Have you ever felt unseen in a place where you were supposed to be known? Or like the more you tried to bring your true self forward, the more you were asked to hide it? Today on the podcast, author Aimee Byrd joins Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen to talk about her new book, Saving Face: Finding My Self, God, and One Another Outside a Defaced Church. It’s a deeply personal and theological reflection on spiritual abuse, identity, and healing—especially in the wake of church systems that no longer reflect the face of Christ. Together, they explore what it means to reclaim your...
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Trauma, Addiction, and the Twelve Steps – Part 2 with Ian Morgan Cron
The Allender Center Podcast
What if your first addiction wasn’t to a substance, but to someone’s approval? In part two of our conversation with Ian Morgan Cron, we go deeper into the cycle of addiction, codependency, and the hope of recovery. Whether you're struggling with a relationship, a habit, a performance-driven mindset, or just the weight of trying to “be good,” this episode offers a profound invitation: transformation doesn't come from trying harder—it comes from surrender. You'll hear stories about the power of the 12 Steps, why spiritual awakening matters more than willpower, and how our early...
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Trauma, Addiction, and the Twelve Steps – Part 1 with Ian Morgan Cron
The Allender Center Podcast
Underneath every addiction is a deeper ache—and a surprising path to healing. Bestselling author, therapist, and Episcopal priest Ian Morgan Cron joins Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen to share insights from his newest book, Ian invites us to reconsider the Twelve Steps—not just as a recovery tool for addicts, but as a grace-filled path of spiritual awakening for anyone longing for freedom, connection, and intimacy with God. This conversation is for everyone—not just those who identify as alcoholics or addicts. As Ian says, these steps offer healing to people who struggle with all...
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“How to Guard Against Sexism and Abuse in Christian Communities” with Dr. Andrew J. Bauman
The Allender Center Podcast
What happens when a woman names harm in her church community—and instead of support, she’s met with silence, suspicion, or even exile? Too often, the church’s response to abuse and inequity reveals a painful truth: that protecting systems has taken precedence over protecting people. In this powerful and layered conversation, Dr. Andrew J. Bauman joins Dr. Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen to confront the realities explored in Andrew’s new book Safe Church: How to Guard Against Sexism and Abuse in Christian Communities. Together, they discuss: The cost many women pay...
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The Research Behind Narrative Focused Trauma Care®
The Allender Center Podcast
If you’ve experienced the healing power of engaging your story—through a Story Workshop, Recovery Week, Narrative Focused Trauma Care® (NFTC) training, or a Story Group in your own context—you may have found yourself wondering: Why does this work feel so deeply transformative? What’s actually happening here? In this special episode, we’re pulling back the curtain on a groundbreaking, multi-year research project that’s beginning to explore those very questions. Dr. Danielle Zurinsky of the Allender Center and Dr. David C. Wang of Fuller Theological Seminary join Dr. Dan Allender...
info_outlineHave you ever felt unseen in a place where you were supposed to be known? Or like the more you tried to bring your true self forward, the more you were asked to hide it?
Today on the podcast, author Aimee Byrd joins Dan Allender and Rachael Clinton Chen to talk about her new book, Saving Face: Finding My Self, God, and One Another Outside a Defaced Church.
It’s a deeply personal and theological reflection on spiritual abuse, identity, and healing—especially in the wake of church systems that no longer reflect the face of Christ.
Together, they explore what it means to reclaim your face—your personhood, your story, your sacred calling. Aimee draws on the rich insight of philosopher Emmanuel Levinas, who wrote that the face is not merely a physical feature, but the place where we encounter both God and one another. To truly see another’s face is to take responsibility for their dignity and to recognize Christ’s presence there.
Aimee shares her story of how a system that promised reform instead left her mocked, erased, and dehumanized. In that disillusionment, she came to a painful but powerful realization: we don’t just need reform. We need resurrection. A death to false forms of power, toxic moralism, and spiritual posturing—and a return to humility, presence, and love.
This conversation offers an honest look at the loneliness of holding onto your God-given identity when others turn away, the courage it takes to seek the face of God in others, and the deep hope that emerges when we begin to see—and be seen—face to face.
Listen to this week’s episode about “Saving Face” with Aimee Byrd, and be sure to pick up a copy of her book at:
https://aimeebyrd.com/saving-face/