The Parenting Long Game: Finding the Problem Under the Problem
Neurodiversity Podcast
Today we talk about how parent reactivity, historical family patterns, and systemic overwhelm inadvertently trap families in cyclical power struggles. Emily Kircher-Morris welcomes Diane Dempster, a professional coach, author, and co-founder of ImpactParents, to talk about how urgency often drives parents out of an objective problem-solving mindset, and toward reactionary behaviors that over-manage their kids, rather than supporting their neurological growth. They talk about the family as an interdependent system, and about how interpersonal traps of the traditional drama triangle can cause...
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The Rewards and Punishment Paradox with Alfie Kohn
Neurodiversity Podcast
Within traditional educational and parenting paradigms, behaviorist strategies such as token economies, behavior color charts, and positive reinforcement models are frequently treated as standard mechanisms for human development. However, these compliance-driven metrics often collapse under long-term evaluation, obscuring the critical psychological friction they introduce. Alfie Kohn, a prominent educational theorist and author of Punished by Rewards, joins the program to systematically critique the reliance on traditional behavioral modification systems, including school-wide positive...
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Educator Burnout: Why "Remember Your Why" Isn't Enough
Neurodiversity Podcast
The high statistical prevalence of burnout in the education system has moved past the realm of speculation and into undeniable systemic reality. While modern teacher preparation programs provide good technical training, they consistently fail to equip people with the emotional tools required to withstand chronic occupational stress. Katrina G. Huels, an educational consultant, former special education leader, and author of Transformational Tools for Special Educators, joins Emily to talk about the cumulative emotional load of behavior management, chronic staffing shortages, and high...
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Deconstructing Gifted Burnout
Neurodiversity Podcast
When highly capable children spend years cruising through an educational system where academic rigor is geared toward the average, they fail to develop the neurological muscles required to process difficulty. This week, we present an encore chat with Dr. Brian Housand, coordinator of the academically or intellectually gifted program at the University of North Carolina Wilmington, and Andi McNair, a gifted education author and digital innovation specialist. They discuss how burnout can be a result of long-term exposure to unrealistic expectations and a profound fear of failure, and how it can...
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Waiting for Sleep: Chronobiology and Neurodivergence
Neurodiversity Podcast
When a neurodivergent child or teen struggles with daytime focus, emotional volatility, or low frustration tolerance, caregivers naturally look for behavioral or psychological explanations. However, chronic sleep deprivation frequently hides behind these daytime struggles, acting as an unseen amplifier for executive dysfunction and sensory overload. Dr. Melisa Moore, a clinical psychologist and board-certified behavioral sleep medicine specialist at Rady Children's Health San Diego, joins Emily Kircher-Morris to reframe sleep not as an isolated nighttime issue, but as a continuous 24-hour...
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Understanding ADHD Children
Neurodiversity Podcast
Parents often believe they know their children, when in reality they haven’t made the effort to really understand them. That understanding can be even harder when adding ADHD into the mix. Dr. Sharon Saline is a clinical psychologist and author of the book, What Your ADHD Child Wishes You Knew. She talks with Emily Kircher-Morris about how to go about understanding your child better, and how ADHD can complicate the relationship. This conversation was previously released. Perfectionism can be difficult to identify in therapy, and once identified, still very difficult to overcome. If you're a...
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From Special Ed to Law School: Redefining Autistic Potential
Neurodiversity Podcast
When creating policies and environments for neurodivergent students, schools frequently rely on outward observations, behavioral data, and the opinions of non-autistic professionals. But this approach often misses the most critical perspective of all: the lived, internal experience of autistic individuals. Today, Emily Kircher-Morris welcomes David Rivera, an autistic self-advocate, UC Berkeley student, and founder of the nonprofit organization Mentoring Autistic Minds, and they talk about why autistic adults must be recognized as a primary epistemic resource in the fight for educational...
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The Secret Ingredients for Emotional Regulation
Neurodiversity Podcast
When a student or child is dysregulated, adults often focus entirely on finding the right words to say or the appropriate consequence to give. But what if the most critical factor in that interaction isn't the consequence itself, but the energy of the adult delivering it? Dr. Lori Desautels, an educator, researcher, and professor of applied educational neuroscience at Butler University, joins the podcast to reframe how we approach discipline, emotional regulation, and transitions. Her latest manual, Body and Brain Brilliance, emphasizes that true support, whether in a classroom or a living...
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Beyond Motivation: Why We Struggle to Start
Neurodiversity Podcast
How often do we label someone "unmotivated" or "defiant" when they fail to start a task? What if the barrier isn't a lack of will, but an inability to simulate the future? Sarah Ward, a speech-language pathologist and co-director of Cognitive Connections, joins Emily to redefine how we conceptualize executive function. Sarah moves the conversation beyond the ability to get things done and instead frames it as a complex mental simulation. They discuss the "time horizon" and why students with ADHD often experience time blindness not as a lack of awareness, but as a developmentally delayed...
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Interoception Is a Sense Few Understand
Neurodiversity Podcast
Interoception plays a pivotal role in how all people perceive and engage with their bodies and the world around them. For neurodivergent people, the differences we experience in interoception can have a bigger effect than we might expect. From the very sensation of 'feeling our feelings,' to the day-to-day experiences and potential supports for those with variations in their interoceptive system, we dig into the subject with Dr. Kelly Mahler, an occupational therapist and professor at Elizabethtown University. How well do we truly understand interoception, and how does it influence those who...
info_outlineWithin traditional educational and parenting paradigms, behaviorist strategies such as token economies, behavior color charts, and positive reinforcement models are frequently treated as standard mechanisms for human development. However, these compliance-driven metrics often collapse under long-term evaluation, obscuring the critical psychological friction they introduce. Alfie Kohn, a prominent educational theorist and author of Punished by Rewards, joins the program to systematically critique the reliance on traditional behavioral modification systems, including school-wide positive behavioral interventions and supports (PBIS).
Emily and Alfie break down the critical neurodivergent intersections of these models, explore the hidden psychological cost of praise, and discuss ways of shifting focus away from surface-level behavior modification and toward the collaborative cultivation of student-led problem-solving.
TAKEAWAYS
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Behaviorist interventions like rewards and punishments function as temporary methods of external control rather than sustainable catalysts for authentic development.
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Extrinsic rewards actively diminish intrinsic motivation by shifting focus away from the task itself and toward the acquisition of the reward.
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Conditional rewards and continuous verbal praise implicitly communicates that fundamental human worth is tethered to performance and utility.
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Applied behavioral modification techniques often target observable surface actions while systematically ignoring the underlying physical, emotional, and sensory needs driving those behaviors.
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Cultivating a child's authentic self-regulation requires shifting from unilateral adult control to active, collaborative decision-making processes.
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Alfie Kohn is a prominent author, lecturer, and progressive education advocate whose work challenges traditional frameworks in schooling, parenting, and human behavior. He holds a bachelor’s degree from Brown University and a master’s degree from the University of Chicago. He has authored 14 books, including seminal titles such as Punished by Rewards, The Schools Our Children Deserve, Unconditional Parenting, and The Myth of the Spoiled Child.
Described by Time magazine as perhaps the country's most outspoken critic of education's fixation on grades and test scores, Kohn’s insights have significantly shaped the practices of educators, parents, and managers worldwide. His work has been profiled in major publications like the Washington Post and the Los Angeles Times, and he has been featured on hundreds of TV and radio programs, including The Today Show and two appearances on Oprah. Based in the Boston area, Kohn lectures extensively at universities, national education conferences, and parent organizations while maintaining his comprehensive digital archive at alfiekohn.org.
BACKGROUND READING
Alfie’s books, website, Twitter/X
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If you'd like members of your organization, school district, or company to know more about the subjects discussed on our podcast, Emily Kircher-Morris provides keynote addresses, workshops, and training sessions worldwide, in-person or virtually. You can choose from a list of established presentations, or work with Emily to develop a custom talk to fit your unique situation. To learn more, visit our website.