Are You Calculating Your Agency’s Profits Correctly? | EP 3
Release Date: 07/15/2025
Turning Every New Client Opportunity Into an Agency’s Compounding Asset | EP25
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Most agencies treat client work as a series of one-off transactions. But the most successful firms treat every engagement as an investment that compounds over time. In this episode, hosts Peter Kang and Sei Wook Kim introduce the concept of engagement yield: the tangible and intangible value that extends far beyond the invoice. They break down the four components of engagement yield; proof, leverage, relationships, and referrals. And explains how agencies can systematically capture this value. Peter and Sei Wook share practical strategies for turning client work into lasting assets: from...
info_outline
Why Peter Wrote a Book on Holding Companies | EP24
The AgencyHabits Podcast
In this special episode, host Sei-Wook Kim interviews Barrel Holdings co-founder Peter Kang about his new book, The HoldCo Guide: How Entrepreneurs Structure and Build a Holding Company That Lasts. Peter shares the organic journey that led him to write the book, from scaling a single agency to building a multi-agency holding company, and why no existing resource fully addressed the topic. He breaks down the core concepts every entrepreneur should understand: the spectrum between capital allocator and operational HoldCos, the critical balance of centralization vs. decentralization, and the...
info_outline
Breaking Down Agency Employee Compensation | EP23
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Compensation is more than just a number. It’s a strategic tool for attracting, retaining, and motivating talent. In this episode, hosts Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim unpack the full spectrum of employee compensation in an agency setting. They start by acknowledging that while pay is crucial, it’s not the only factor. Culture, management, challenging work, and company trajectory all play vital roles. From there, they dive into the core components: base salary (and how to set competitive, geographically-aware bands), benefits (health insurance, 401k, PTO, and creative perks), and both short-...
info_outline
Annual Checkup: 9 Markers to Diagnose Your Agency’s Health | EP22
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Most agencies only seek help when something is broken. But by then, the problems are often systemic. In this episode, hosts Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim shift the conversation from reactive fixes to proactive health. They introduce a holistic “annual checkup” framework, mapping nine critical agency functions to body parts and their vital signs: from positioning (vision) and client trust (heart rate) to revenue stability (blood pressure) and risk resilience (immune system). Drawing from their experience building and scaling Barrel, Peter and Sei-Wook explain how to spot early warning signals...
info_outline
Evolving from Managing Projects to Growing Accounts | EP21
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Growing from single-project engagements to managing multiple, concurrent work streams is a major turning point for any agency. In this episode, hosts Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim unpack the structural shift required to turn this complexity into a sustainable competitive advantage. Drawing from their own hard-earned lessons at Barrel, they dissect the common pitfalls like team silos, client misalignment, and leader burnout, that can derail multi-faceted accounts. Peter and Sei-Wook break down the three critical roles needed for success: Account Leadership for strategy and relationships, Program...
info_outline
How Agencies Should Think About and Manage Risk | EP 20
The AgencyHabits Podcast
In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim break down how agency owners should think about risk, not as isolated problems to react to, but as ongoing exposure that needs to be actively managed. Using a simple risk matrix, they explain how to prioritize risks based on likelihood and impact, and why high-impact risks deserve disproportionate attention. They then walk through nine of the most consequential risks agencies face, from founder burnout and partner misalignment to legal exposure, cash flow insolvency, client concentration, and strategic drift. For each, they share practical ways to...
info_outline
Learning From Other Agency Owners | EP19
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Great agencies are not built in isolation. In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim explore the transformative power of community and peer learning for agency founders. The hosts share their personal journey from working in a silo to actively seeking mentorship and joining dedicated communities, revealing how these connections helped them avoid blind spots, gain crucial perspective, and accelerate their growth. Peter and Sei-Wook break down specific communities that have been instrumental to their journey, including Bureau of Digital, Society of Digital Agencies (SoDA), and Collective 54....
info_outline
Why Agencies Rely on Referrals But Few Treat It as a System | EP18
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Most agencies say they rely on referrals, but few treat them as a system. In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim dismantle the "hope-based" approach to referrals and lay out a strategic framework for building a consistent pipeline. Drawing from the book The Referral Code, they redefine referrals as a transfer of goodwill and share actionable tactics for intentional referral generation. Peter and Sei-Wook cover how to identify the right people to ask, the critical importance of timing your ask within a "state of appreciation," and how to craft effective, open-ended questions. They also...
info_outline
The Six Levers of Profitable Client Engagements | EP17
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Profitability is the lifeblood of any agency, yet it can feel elusive. In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim move beyond surface-level tips to reveal the six fundamental levers that directly impact the bottom line of every project, retainer, and service program. They break down how pricing, staffing, engagement design, scope management, reusable IP, and automation all interlock to create or erode healthy gross margins. Drawing from their experience across the Barrel Holdings portfolio, Peter and Sei-Wook share candid examples of where profitability leaks and provide a practical...
info_outline
Scaling Your Agency Beyond $2M | EP 16
The AgencyHabits Podcast
In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim dissect why agencies hit the $2M and what you can do to break through. They explain how founder-centric systems that work at a smaller scale become the primary constraint to growth, leading to breakdowns in client delivery, team management, and financial visibility. The hosts share actionable solutions, from improving onboarding and implementing debrief processes to strategically hiring for your weaknesses and deepening financial rigor. They also introduce the Agency Systems Playbook, a framework of five core systems that drive a scalable agency....
info_outlineIn this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim tackle one of the most confusing aspects of agency financials: how to properly calculate profitability. They break down the critical difference between SDE (Seller's Discretionary Earnings) and EBITDA, explaining why these metrics can paint vastly different pictures of the same business.
Using concrete examples and spreadsheet walkthroughs, they demonstrate how owner salary calculations can dramatically impact reported profitability margins…sometimes swinging from 15% to 40% depending on how compensation is structured. This episode is essential for any agency owner who wants to understand their true financial performance and how acquirers evaluate businesses.
You'll learn why a "normalized" view of profitability matters, how replacement cost thinking changes valuation conversations, and why scale affects the relationship between owner compensation and overall margins.
Key Moments
1. Defining SDE vs. EBITDA and why the distinction matters for agency owners
2. Breaking down a sample P&L to show real-world profitability calculations
3. How owner salary manipulation can inflate or deflate EBITDA percentages
4. The "replacement cost" framework for normalizing owner compensation
5. Why these calculations become less volatile as agencies scale to $10M+ revenue
6. How Barrel Holdings adjusts for owner salary when evaluating acquisitions
7. The importance of understanding your true role and replacement value
Real Talk Takeaways
1. SDE includes owner compensation; EBITDA doesn't - know which metric you're using
2. Owner salary swings can create 10-20% margin differences in smaller agencies
3. Replacement cost thinking is key…what would you pay someone to do your job?
4. Scale reduces volatility - larger agencies see smaller percentage swings from owner comp
5. Normalize before you negotiate. Buyers will adjust your numbers anyway
6. 40% "profit" might actually be 25% EBITDA when properly calculated
7. Context matters. Highly involved owners need higher replacement cost estimates
Timestamps
00:00 – Welcome to Agency Habits
00:18 – Why profitability discussions often aren't apples-to-apples comparisons
00:44 – Defining SDE (Seller's Discretionary Earnings) vs. EBITDA
01:12 – The importance of understanding these different calculation methods
01:59 – Walking through concrete spreadsheet examples
02:11 – Sample P&L breakdown: $1M revenue agency with $500K COGS
02:35 – What constitutes COGS in an agency business
03:10 – SG&A expenses and how owner salary factors into calculations
03:56 – SDE calculation: adding back owner salary for 40% margin
04:26 – Why owners might take distributions instead of fixed salaries
05:18 – EBITDA scenarios: how different owner salaries create different margins
06:11 – The "too low" scenario: $65K salary inflating EBITDA to 33.5%
06:40 – The "too high" scenario: $250K salary depressing EBITDA to 15%
07:48 – How Barrel Holdings normalizes owner salary for fair comparisons
08:23 – The replacement cost framework for owner compensation
09:27 – Adjusting EBITDA calculations based on realistic replacement costs
11:01 – Why Barrel Holdings requires 15% EBITDA using their calculation method
11:45 – How these calculations change dramatically at scale
12:19 – $10M revenue example: why percentages converge at larger scale
13:20 – When owner salary becomes negligible in large, structured agencies
13:49 – The importance of understanding owner role and replacement cost
14:06 – Practical advice for agency owners on calculating true profitability
Notable Quotes
"It's not always clear what they mean. Are they talking about their profit after paying them a market salary? Are they excluding their comp? Is that inflating their numbers?"
"We're really thinking about what is the replacement cost of that person and making sure that's accurately reflected in the EBITDA."
"Just because your SDE is 400K doesn't mean you're pocketing 400K because there is something to be paid to Uncle Sam."
Links & Resources
Peter Kang on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/peterkang34/
Sei-Wook on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/seiwookkim/
AgencyHabits Website: https://www.agencyhabits.com/
AgencyHabits on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/agencyhabits/
Barrel Holdings Website: https://www.barrel-holdings.com/
Barrel Holdings LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/barrel-holdings/