Why Agencies Rely on Referrals But Few Treat It as a System | EP18
Release Date: 12/17/2025
Turning Every New Client Opportunity Into an Agency’s Compounding Asset | EP25
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Most agencies treat client work as a series of one-off transactions. But the most successful firms treat every engagement as an investment that compounds over time. In this episode, hosts Peter Kang and Sei Wook Kim introduce the concept of engagement yield: the tangible and intangible value that extends far beyond the invoice. They break down the four components of engagement yield; proof, leverage, relationships, and referrals. And explains how agencies can systematically capture this value. Peter and Sei Wook share practical strategies for turning client work into lasting assets: from...
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Why Peter Wrote a Book on Holding Companies | EP24
The AgencyHabits Podcast
In this special episode, host Sei-Wook Kim interviews Barrel Holdings co-founder Peter Kang about his new book, The HoldCo Guide: How Entrepreneurs Structure and Build a Holding Company That Lasts. Peter shares the organic journey that led him to write the book, from scaling a single agency to building a multi-agency holding company, and why no existing resource fully addressed the topic. He breaks down the core concepts every entrepreneur should understand: the spectrum between capital allocator and operational HoldCos, the critical balance of centralization vs. decentralization, and the...
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Breaking Down Agency Employee Compensation | EP23
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Compensation is more than just a number. It’s a strategic tool for attracting, retaining, and motivating talent. In this episode, hosts Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim unpack the full spectrum of employee compensation in an agency setting. They start by acknowledging that while pay is crucial, it’s not the only factor. Culture, management, challenging work, and company trajectory all play vital roles. From there, they dive into the core components: base salary (and how to set competitive, geographically-aware bands), benefits (health insurance, 401k, PTO, and creative perks), and both short-...
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Annual Checkup: 9 Markers to Diagnose Your Agency’s Health | EP22
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Most agencies only seek help when something is broken. But by then, the problems are often systemic. In this episode, hosts Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim shift the conversation from reactive fixes to proactive health. They introduce a holistic “annual checkup” framework, mapping nine critical agency functions to body parts and their vital signs: from positioning (vision) and client trust (heart rate) to revenue stability (blood pressure) and risk resilience (immune system). Drawing from their experience building and scaling Barrel, Peter and Sei-Wook explain how to spot early warning signals...
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Evolving from Managing Projects to Growing Accounts | EP21
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Growing from single-project engagements to managing multiple, concurrent work streams is a major turning point for any agency. In this episode, hosts Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim unpack the structural shift required to turn this complexity into a sustainable competitive advantage. Drawing from their own hard-earned lessons at Barrel, they dissect the common pitfalls like team silos, client misalignment, and leader burnout, that can derail multi-faceted accounts. Peter and Sei-Wook break down the three critical roles needed for success: Account Leadership for strategy and relationships, Program...
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How Agencies Should Think About and Manage Risk | EP 20
The AgencyHabits Podcast
In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim break down how agency owners should think about risk, not as isolated problems to react to, but as ongoing exposure that needs to be actively managed. Using a simple risk matrix, they explain how to prioritize risks based on likelihood and impact, and why high-impact risks deserve disproportionate attention. They then walk through nine of the most consequential risks agencies face, from founder burnout and partner misalignment to legal exposure, cash flow insolvency, client concentration, and strategic drift. For each, they share practical ways to...
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Learning From Other Agency Owners | EP19
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Great agencies are not built in isolation. In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim explore the transformative power of community and peer learning for agency founders. The hosts share their personal journey from working in a silo to actively seeking mentorship and joining dedicated communities, revealing how these connections helped them avoid blind spots, gain crucial perspective, and accelerate their growth. Peter and Sei-Wook break down specific communities that have been instrumental to their journey, including Bureau of Digital, Society of Digital Agencies (SoDA), and Collective 54....
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Why Agencies Rely on Referrals But Few Treat It as a System | EP18
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Most agencies say they rely on referrals, but few treat them as a system. In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim dismantle the "hope-based" approach to referrals and lay out a strategic framework for building a consistent pipeline. Drawing from the book The Referral Code, they redefine referrals as a transfer of goodwill and share actionable tactics for intentional referral generation. Peter and Sei-Wook cover how to identify the right people to ask, the critical importance of timing your ask within a "state of appreciation," and how to craft effective, open-ended questions. They also...
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The Six Levers of Profitable Client Engagements | EP17
The AgencyHabits Podcast
Profitability is the lifeblood of any agency, yet it can feel elusive. In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim move beyond surface-level tips to reveal the six fundamental levers that directly impact the bottom line of every project, retainer, and service program. They break down how pricing, staffing, engagement design, scope management, reusable IP, and automation all interlock to create or erode healthy gross margins. Drawing from their experience across the Barrel Holdings portfolio, Peter and Sei-Wook share candid examples of where profitability leaks and provide a practical...
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Scaling Your Agency Beyond $2M | EP 16
The AgencyHabits Podcast
In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim dissect why agencies hit the $2M and what you can do to break through. They explain how founder-centric systems that work at a smaller scale become the primary constraint to growth, leading to breakdowns in client delivery, team management, and financial visibility. The hosts share actionable solutions, from improving onboarding and implementing debrief processes to strategically hiring for your weaknesses and deepening financial rigor. They also introduce the Agency Systems Playbook, a framework of five core systems that drive a scalable agency....
info_outlineMost agencies say they rely on referrals, but few treat them as a system. In this episode, Peter Kang and Sei-Wook Kim dismantle the "hope-based" approach to referrals and lay out a strategic framework for building a consistent pipeline. Drawing from the book The Referral Code, they redefine referrals as a transfer of goodwill and share actionable tactics for intentional referral generation.
Peter and Sei-Wook cover how to identify the right people to ask, the critical importance of timing your ask within a "state of appreciation," and how to craft effective, open-ended questions. They also discuss managing referral relationships long-term, staying top of mind, and when a transactional referral partnership might make sense. For any agency owner ready to transform sporadic referrals into a predictable engine for growth, this episode provides the blueprint.
Key Moments
1. Redefining Referrals: Moving from hope-based belief to an intentional system.
2. The Golden Rule: Never ask for a referral outside a state of appreciation.
3. Avoiding Common Mistakes: Vague asks, poor timing, and automated blunders.
4. Building Your Referral List: Identifying former clients, peers, and affinity networks.
5. The Art of the Ask: Using open-ended phrasing and framing it as helping others.
6. Cultivating a Shortlist: Focusing on quality relationships over volume outreach.
7. Managing the Engine: Following up, showing appreciation, and staying top of mind.
Real Talk Takeaways
1. A referral is a transfer of goodwill, not a favor. It’s built on the positive emotions someone felt working with you.
2. Only 5% of people are natural referrers. The other 95% need to be reminded, which means you must ask—and keep asking.
3. Timing is everything. The worst time to ask is when a client is unhappy; the best is when they are actively reflecting on your positive impact.
4. Be specific. Instead of "anyone who needs marketing," define your ideal client profile and the specific situations they face.
5. Your network is a multiplier. A first-degree connection may not be the direct referrer but can connect you to someone who is.
6. Referral management is relationship management. Always keep your referrer in the loop and show genuine appreciation.
7. For super-connectors, a formal, incentivized partnership might be appropriate, blurring the line between emotional referral and strategic partnership.
Timestamps
00:00 – Introduction: The Problem with Hope-Based Referrals
01:07 – Defining a Referral as a Transfer of Goodwill
04:16 – Wrong Ways to Ask: Vague Requests and Bad Timing
06:57 – How to Build Your Intentional Referral Engine
09:31 – Who to Target for Referral Seeking
11:24 – The Right Way to Ask: Phrasing and Mindset
13:07 – Managing the Referral Process and Staying Top of Mind
15:17 – When Referrals Become Transactional Partnerships
Notable Quotes
"We hear over and over again that agencies rely solely on referrals... but they don't treat referrals as a system. It's like a hope-based belief." — Peter Kang on the common agency referral trap.
"Only 5% of people are natural referrers... that leaves 95% of us who need the reminding to take that action." — Sei-Wook Kim on the necessity of consistent asking.
"A referral is essentially a transfer of goodwill. It's people sharing the feeling that they had working with you with other people in their network." — Peter Kang on the emotional core of referrals.
"The rule number one is you have to ask... and then they say rule number two is keep asking. The consistency over time will compound into meaningful impact." — Sei-Wook Kim on the foundational principles from The Referral Code.
Links & Resources
Peter Kang on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/peterkang34/
Sei-Wook Kim on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/seiwookkim/
AgencyHabits Website: https://www.agencyhabits.com/
AgencyHabits on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/agencyhabits/
The Referral Code by Larry Pinci and Phil Glosserman
The Shortlist by David Ackert