EP 231 Algorithm-Proof Your Retreat Brand: Social Media That Sticks with Robin Nathaniel

In this episode of The Retreat Leaders Podcast, Shannon Jamail is joined by social media strategist and author Robin Nathaniel (@robbinmarx) to dig into what it really takes to build a retreat brand that thrives online—without having to chase every trend.

Robin brings two decades of experience in social media and shares how to focus on authentic, audience-focused content that stands out in an AI-driven world. From aligning your content with your brand's voice to Robin's powerful SYNC framework (Simple, Yield, Natural, Change), this episode is packed with gems for retreat leaders who want to grow their impact without burning out online.

They also discuss:

• The myth of “going viral” and why it’s overrated
• How to identify your content bandwidth and platform sweet spot
• Why “100% human-made” content is gaining new value
• The power of speaking directly to your audience like a best friend
• A sneak peek into Robin’s Social Media Sync Bundle, made just for you!

Grab your free Social Media Sync Bundle from Robin: landthetalk.com

Connect with Robin: Website: https://robinnathaniel.com/

 

The Retreat Leaders Podcast Resources and Links:

• Learn to Host Retreats
• Join our private Facebook Group
• Top 5 Marketing Tools Free Guide
• Free Top 11 Tips for Building an Email List 
• Get your legal docs for retreats

 

Thanks for tuning into the Retreat Leaders Podcast. Remember to subscribe for more insightful episodes, and visit our website for additional resources. Let’s create a vibrant retreat community together!

 

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Full Transcript

Automatically Transcribed With Podsqueeze

Speaker 1 00:00:00  Welcome to the Retreat Leaders podcast, your sanctuary with retreat experts. Where we spill the tea on retreat success. Here we dive into crafting transformational guest experiences. Talk about how to avoid pitfalls and unlock marketing secrets. Whether you're a seasoned guru or a budding enthusiast, we've got the inside scoop for you. Join us as we learn how to flourish in this magical world of retreats. Hey guys, welcome to or welcome back to The Retreat Leader's podcast. I'm excited because I have another amazing guest today in. My guest is going to be talking about something that I think 99.999% of the people who are in our space think it's one of the most important aspects of marketing and growing your retreat business. And I would agree with you, although I also think email is important, but we are going to talk about social media. And so welcome, Robin Nathaniel to the show.

Speaker 2 00:00:54  Thank you so much for having me, Shannon. I'm pumped to talk to your audience about social media, and I'm confident that they'll walk away with some value today.

Speaker 1 00:01:03  That's fantastic. Robin, why don't you just first start off by telling us a little bit about who you are and what brought you to this space that you're in now.

Speaker 2 00:01:10  Yep. So I started my career off in music. I was a performer as well as an event organiser and a producer. And then in 2010, I had my first child, my, my, my son. And when he was born, I was like, I need to get a job. So I switched gears and joined the non-profit field, and I moved up in non-profit leadership. And then the pandemic hit. When the pandemic hit, me and my family left our busy life in New York City to move down to the green pastures of the Atlanta area. And I reset and, shifted from my career in nonprofit leadership to finally take a hold of my marketing, career, which I have a degree in which I had been doing social media since the days of Myspace and Friendster and just led me down this path of social media leadership.

Speaker 2 00:01:59  Now I lead a small team for local government with social media, and I also have an independent boutique agency where we support mission driven organizations and nonprofit with social media solutions.

Speaker 1 00:02:09  Oh my goodness. I love so much about this, and I love that you've been in the industry for as long as you have, because and I think it even said it on your website somewhere when I was doing some research, like it's, it's not heard of for someone to be in the social media space for over 20 years. So how have you hung on this long? I have to know.

Speaker 2 00:02:30  First of all, it's just like interest, right? So me getting into social media early, I got to see the beginning with sites like Friendster and Myspace, even six degrees before that. Right? And what I found was the power of being able to communicate with people in another place with a push of a button just blew me away, and I knew that there was going to be something there, so I just had a general interest for it.

Speaker 2 00:02:55  I think when I started getting into it on an academic level because I was an adult learner for college and I had to like write papers around social, do research. It just opened my mind on a whole, on a whole nother level. And I believe that's what separates me from other people in the industry. And if people read my book, they'll see some of my philosophies kind of butt heads with what the quote unquote gurus are saying in the space. I have some conflicting messages and we'll talk more about it, but generally it's just the love for being able to impact people all over the world.

Speaker 1 00:03:29  Okay, well, I'm glad that you are here, and I'm glad that you're in this space and that you've been in this space for this long. I have been a user since the Myspace days. I did start in marketing when Facebook first became kind of like to me, it seemed like the very first real engine of social media marketing. This is well over ten years ago. And so I've been marketing in the the social media space since then.

Speaker 1 00:03:55  However, it has been hard as hell for me to keep up. I'll just be honest with you. The algorithms change. The expectations change. The rules change what works. Change is a new platforms on the horizon, you know. Do you know what I'm saying? Like, there's so many moving parts now. Compared to when I used to just spend 100 bucks on Facebook and get a really good return. And so keeping up has got to be something I don't know. That's its own beast.

Speaker 2 00:04:20  It really is. And I and one thing that I mentioned early on in my book is that I work in this space, right? Like literally I wake up in the morning at 5 a.m. and I'm all, I'm all social media until I lay down right and I can't keep up. So don't feel bad. Just know that it moves so fast. And especially with the, the rise of AI, it's just increasing the pace of the, the growth and and and this the platform changes. So that's why in my teaching and in my philosophy, I focus on a concept that I call algorithm proof content instead of people becoming, you know, essentially slaves to what the platforms are doing or liking.

Speaker 2 00:05:01  Just focusing on human connection through their content and creating strong, intentional relationships with their audience.

Speaker 1 00:05:09  Okay, now you're speaking my language. So let's let's dig into it. Let's talk about some strategies. Did you want to start there with this algorithm proof concept or or talk to me. What do you want to start with.

Speaker 2 00:05:19  Yeah we can start with algorithm proof content. So one thing that I found in all of my years in social is that folks are glued to what the next big thing is. For example, years ago when Snapchat first came out, people were hyped about Snapchat and then Instagram totally stole their model, which they often do, right? And then they created stories and then everyone shifted the stories. So what I felt like is that essentially we're on this seesaw. Whichever way it's going, we're going to slide to that end. And when the weight shifts, we slide with it. And what happens is you get seasick. You're like you. You know, like we're overwhelmed. We're confused.

Speaker 2 00:06:02  We don't know which way to go. And we're just back and forth on this social media seesaw, if you will. And what I found is that staying in the center and identifying the fact that the one unique proposition value proposition that you will have in whatever business you do, whether it's organizing retreats or whether you sell donuts, is you is the person behind the brand, the the the person who fuels the wheels. And if we can lean into that and really find a way to communicate directly with our ideal target audience, that we create algorithm proof content, regardless of the platform, regardless of the medium. You can write it, you can videotape it, you can take a picture of it. It's still going to be authentically you.

Speaker 1 00:06:48  So you are speaking my language on so many fronts. The first one really being just being you. Like, don't try to be someone else. Don't try to copy this thing that looks really good or is doing really well. Don't try to follow just all the trends in the whatever.

Speaker 1 00:07:03  Like you can use some of this information, but it has to be authentically you. It has to have your voice, your spin, your whatever. So I love that. And then in conjunction with that, making sure that it is speaking to your ideal audience, you know, like I can't tell you how many times someone's like, oh, I did this post and it's really, really good. And I look at it, I'm like, it has nothing to do with your business at all. Like, you're doing it on socks and you're over here trying to sell, you know, mental health strategies or whatever. And so it has to be directed directly to your target audience. It has to be authentic to you. And I love that. That is like the whole concept behind algorithm proof, because you're right. If you're speaking to your people, like literally someone who's looking, looking, listening, watching, whatever, if they're feeling like, man, she or he is speaking directly to me, it doesn't matter what the algorithm is doing, right?

Speaker 2 00:07:54  It really doesn't.

Speaker 2 00:07:55  And I and I and I have a quick story to share with you. So I got on TikTok in 2020 and I had some success, and it kind of led to my independent boutique agency. I had a couple of videos go viral. Both videos had over 2 million views. But like you said, the videos weren't necessarily aligned with my mission. My, the the videos weren't necessarily speaking directly to my ideal target audience member. And essentially the, the the videos were just vanity metrics, right? They got me a lot of followers. They got me a bunch of views. Flip the other, flip that coin. And on the other side of that coin, I did a video on Facebook a few years later, I want to say it had 500 views, Shannon 500 views, and it was basically me sharing one of my signature frameworks. I got a call or I got a message I should say that led to a call that led to a long term client that that generated tons of revenue for my business.

Speaker 2 00:08:56  So the point is. Vanity metrics and chasing views, likes and the surface level performance metrics is not where we are in this era as I can. Continues to evolve. Human connection is going to be valued more than anything else. There's going to be a time where the way you go to a fair or a, you know, a craft fair and you go around the tables and it's like, you, you sold that together. Yeah. It was human made, I made it. It's made by me, the creator. The content will be the same way. Shannon. Mark my words. People will stamp 100% human made and it's going to have a premium value. So that's why I'm leaning into people or or encouraging people to lean into the human aspect of content creation and social media in general.

Speaker 1 00:09:44  Oh my gosh, I, I had to mute myself, but I could almost fall off my chair when you're like, it's going to be stamped human made because you are so right. You're so right.

Speaker 1 00:09:55  That is where we're headed right now. And it's getting easier and easier to spot AI. And we'll just call it sometimes IBS all over the place. And people are going to be like, they're done. They're over that. Scroll on, keep going. Tune it out. They're going to be looking specifically for human made content. Human made everything. And so I love that so much. Talk to me about what other strategies retreat leaders should be considering. maybe these are strategies that you've shared in your book that they should be considering when they're trying to grow their audience and grow their business.

Speaker 2 00:10:27  I think for retreat leaders, and again, I'm grateful to be on your platform, Shannon, because, this is an audience that I don't get to speak too often, but I've had some, life changing experiences at retreats. So for that reason, I'm really grateful for this opportunity. It really depends on what part of their journey they're on. So let's speak to the retreat leader who is not on social, is fearing social, has some trepidation around even starting like the journey.

Speaker 2 00:10:54  What I would encourage them to do is to first start with identifying their bandwidth. That's the first step. I think oftentimes when people say, you got to get on social media, we open an account on every single platform. We, we, we fire up Canva, we create images for everyone and we just let it rip. Right? While that is social media, that's not strategy, and I don't think it's the best use of your resources. Right. So I would first identify your your your bandwidth. Is it going to be you. Is it going to be somebody on your team? How much of our time for our marketing contributions can we commit to this? And as we go into 2026, I will also as a ninja trick just right now, as you're if you're working on preparing budgets for next year, you should really prioritize align for social media. So whether you bring in a team to help you, a consultant and strategists like myself, or if you empower somebody on your team. So that's the first step, is just figure out who's going to do it and how much time can they spend to it? Spend, spend on it.

Speaker 2 00:11:54  Next you want to clearly identify your ideal audience member. So we talked about it earlier. customer avatars. There's so many terms around ideal viewer, just the person that you want to speak to in your content. And I know what people are going to think. Well, Robin, if I speak to one person, how will I? I'm going to miss out on so many other people. It's a common concern that people, people have. One thing that I've seen is that when people speak to one ideal audience member in their content, especially smaller organizations who have like one, set of people that they're speaking to, the other people will get attracted. So even if you're speaking to Jane, 29, who lives in Ohio, Jimmy, 35, is her husband, and he'll hear you and listen to you, too. So that's the next thing. Identify your ideal, target audience member. So stop me at any point. Shannon, I'm going to kind of push through this.

Speaker 1 00:12:45  So you're speaking my language.

Speaker 2 00:12:48  So third step after you know your bandwidth, you know your ideal audience member. The third step. Now, what you want to really lean into is where your people are. Let's go and let's do some market research. Where are our folks hanging out? If you have an existing audience. Do a survey, send out an email, blast. Send out mailers. Whatever you do to communicate with your audience. Get on the phone. Even if it's 10 to 15 people, to do a small little experiment to find out where people are. Now here's where people sometimes get confused. Let's say all of your people are on Facebook, but now you have a intern who only knows how to use TikTok. So now you need to decide, do you want to teach this person how to operate on Facebook? Or do you want to start off on TikTok? Because having a person on your team who is equipped to actually do it is an important part of it. I lean towards going where the audiences, and if you want to do a balance of starting with two platforms, if you have someone who's skilled on another platform besides your audience's preference, then that's something you can consider as well.

Speaker 2 00:13:55  So now you know where you're going to be. You know who's going to do it and you know who you're speaking to. The next step is really figuring out the medium that the the person or that, that team member is comfortable with. Is it writing? Maybe if it's writing, you should focus on LinkedIn content. Maybe you should focus on Twitter. or X threads, maybe blue sky. If it's video, maybe you have a founder that's extremely comfortable on camera, like Shannon here. Maybe you shoot a long form podcast episode and then cut up the clips and create video content. Maybe you have a skillful photographer on your team, or a graphic designer that you can maybe use that content on a platform like Instagram or even X, Twitter or LinkedIn. So identify where your strengths are and then decide on the medium. And another ninja trick. Do not sign up or do not get active on every single platform, just pick one. Just start with one. Because what happens is people get burnt out there.

Speaker 2 00:14:58  They're trying to use social media management tools. If you want to reserve your handles on all of the platforms, that's okay. Put a profile picture, put a bio and put your flag in the ground. But pour your energy into the platform where your team member who's or leading this charge is comfortable and you have skills in that medium. And then the last step. Let it rip. Double down and triple down when things work well. If you have a photo post that goes off. Lean into that. If you have a video post that does well. Lean into that, but continue to experiment and just continue to contribute the energy, time, and space into this opportunity.

Speaker 1 00:15:40  Hey, retreat leaders, pause that retreat planning for just a second because I've got something you do not want to miss. I'm headed to London this October to host a live event that's all about teaching you how to host a retreat that's not just transformational, but actually profitable. Imagine sipping tea or champagne with other like minded leaders while mapping out your next sold out retreat.

Speaker 1 00:16:02  It's happening at the gorgeous Waldorf Hilton in London. I'm spilling all the secrets from pricing to planning, marketing to mindset, and you'll walk away with a strategy you can actually use. No fluff, no BS, just results. So head to Retreat mastermind and come join me across the pond. Okay, I love unpacking all of this. This is such good stuff. A couple of things that I heard, especially when you talk about like your bandwidth, like how much you know, time and energy are you able to dedicate to this? Because there's so like you said, there's so many people out there like you have to post ten times a day, you have to post 20 stories. You know, there's just all of this stuff and you could should yourself to death in this, this realm, right. In the social media realm, you could shoot yourself to death, but it really comes down to what's the bandwidth that you are going to deliver high quality, targeted, unique, authentic information. And if that's once a week and it's good shit, okay, go after it.

Speaker 1 00:17:04  You know, like just really understanding what your bandwidth is. On the flip side, I do love the fact of having some sort of consistency, and only because the social media platforms love some sort of consistency. They do like consistency. The algorithms may change, but they really no matter what. I think all of the algorithms are always going to like some sort of consistency. So consider that when you're when you're thinking about your bandwidth. And I do think, Robyn, people just need to hire it out if they don't have it, if you don't have the bandwidth, you've got to hire it out. If you if you think you can not have social media and grow your business in today's world, man, I don't want to tell you you can't. But holy shitballs, you're making it so much harder for yourself unless you already have some sort of giant following from way back when. Social media has got to be part of your your your your marketing. It just does. So whether it's you or hiring it out or whatever.

Speaker 1 00:17:58  I also love what you said about whoever's doing it. Where are where is their strength, right? Is it written or is it a video? Is it pictures? Is it graphics then? I love that so much. You don't have to do all the things right. It could just be where's the strength? The only key thing that I would say that I really focus on is if you're going to pick a platform, pick the one where your audience is. You know what I mean? Like, most of my audience is in Facebook. They just are like for my retreats, not necessarily for the Retreat Leaders podcast. Believe it or not, a lot of them are on Instagram, TikTok and Facebook. But if I had to pick out of all of them, I would probably be more Instagram. But my retreat guests who attend my retreats, they're on Facebook, right? And so where are your people? And man, all you have to do is a quick chat GPT or Google search and say, here's my target audience and describe that one person to the T.

Speaker 1 00:18:54  You know, what's their age, what's their gender, what's their religion, if any? What's I mean, I mean, describe them down to a T and then ask, where do they hang out the most in social media? Where does this demographic hang out the most? And that's what you go after. And I mean, like you said, double down, triple down, quadruple down, like nail it on that one platform. What's your thoughts?

Speaker 2 00:19:16  I love all of that. And I and I agree with you totally. I do want to just, piggyback off of, the idea of, you know, picking the platform and using. I, I get a bad rap because some of my, my philosophies appear to be anti AI, and I'm not. I use AI every day, and in my book I'm constantly going through it like I'm not an AI hater. Please. Like, like, don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to hate on AI because I'm not. So I think that if you don't have any access to audience right now, that that is a great suggestion for people to just put it in the chat.

Speaker 2 00:19:56  GPT and, try to get some results there.

Speaker 1 00:19:59  Yeah, I'm, I'm super pro I, but I'm pro I with your voice. And all I mean by that is I feed the information into AI and then ask for ideas or spin offs or adjustments or give me something that I haven't looked at or whatever. So like, like I mentioned like give AI all the information and then ask AI based on this, where are my people hanging out at? If you don't already have an audience and you don't already know where they are? Yes, I totally agree with you. But I also use AI every day. It is getting you know, I know we're going off subject, but AI is one of those things where it's like either you're going to use it or you're going to be behind. At some point. It just is going to happen. And I don't think AI is going to replace people, but it's going to replace people who are not using AI, if you know what I'm saying. Like, it's there's a difference, like AI is going to be your tool and it will replace people who don't use AI, is what I mean.

Speaker 1 00:20:51  So? So anyway, so yeah, I'm a big believer in all of that. Talk to me more about your book. Tell me what people can hear about or find in your book. Like why does someone need your book? Because it sounds like they do.

Speaker 2 00:21:01  Yes. So I gave a Ted talk back in 2024, and when I got off of the stage, I knew that I wanted to write a book. I just didn't know what the book would be. And then some things happened. I had some, personal issues come up, and it kind of went on the back burner, Shannon and I, and I was like, I guess I'll just do it when I do it. I went on a podcast, talk to a gentleman that really just spoke to my soul, like he was asking me questions about my mom, my brother, just all of these deep questions. And I'm ready to, like, talk social media, right. And like, literally was bringing a tear to my eye in this interview.

Speaker 2 00:21:37  And when I left the interview, I said, I have to finish the book, I have to I took all of my ideas, doubled down, talk to my wife, got her blessing, wrote in the morning, wrote in the evening, narrated and recorded in the car. Sent it to an editor and it used the framework from my talk, which I think is poetic because the talk is really about in person interactions, where this is the version for digital interactions, and really it's built on my sync framework. And what sync is, is basically a framework that we can use to build intentional human connections online. So S is for simple. Oftentimes online people want to be the smartest person in the chat room, right? Like, oh, the dexterity of the physicality of like dude. Like just just tell me it's rough around the edges. Right? and simple is really that, that that concept of boiling something down to make it super easy for people to receive and consume. Y is for yield to your intentions.

Speaker 2 00:22:44  It's all about being intentional. Before you start writing, before you start taking pictures, before you start filming a video. Thinking about what do I want? How do I want people to feel, and what kind of action do I want people to take? And if you really want to be an overachiever, how can I do it in a positive light, right? Like, what kind of positive impact can I have on folks? n is for natural. Oftentimes people step into online spaces with corporate speak needing to sound as professional, as clean, as as clean as possible. It's okay to say y'all. If you say y'all, it's okay to say wanna w a n n a. If that's what you say when you speak a little, cheat sheet that I give people or trick that I give people is when you write a piece of content, especially when you're thinking about written, form content, read it back to yourself and ask yourself, would I say that if I was talking to my best friend? And when writing, try to write like you're writing to your best friend.

Speaker 2 00:23:45  If you're if you look at your ideal audience member, target audience member as your best friend. That's a hack to like, write like you're writing to someone you love and you care about. And when you read it back, if it doesn't pass that test, you might need to go back to step one and make it a little more simple. And the last step is C for change it up online. We talked about the seesaw where we're just going with the flow. What did they what did Adam Mosseri from Instagram say. Oh we got to do stories. Let's do stories. No, no no reels okay. Let's go back to reels. And we're on this daggone hamster wheel of following the the trends of what the gurus are saying. What I would recommend is to change it up, listen to new voices, try new things. If everyone is zigging, try zagging and see what happens. If you always do written content, maybe change it up next month and try a couple of videos and that will give you the opportunity to give more flavors at your ice cream shop, and maybe folks will gravitate to one of those different styles of content.

Speaker 2 00:24:48  And that's a quick and dirty breakdown of the sync method from my book Social Media Sync.

Speaker 1 00:24:53  Hey, it's Shannon here. I'm just popping in really quickly to ask a big favor. Would you pause the show and go review it for us, please? Reviews really help us to be able to get more guests and more experts on the show to help you transform your retreats. So if you wouldn't mind pausing and leaving us a review, that would mean everything. And if you're not already subscribed, do that too. Heck yes. Oh my goodness, all of that stuff. I especially love the whole when you're writing and whether it's writing, talking or anything, do it like you're talking to your best friend. Oh my gosh, that should be the heart of all of the content that you deliver is like your best friend or someone that you love and care about. So. Yes, yes, yes. Well, we're going to wrap it up with you telling us about something that is for the audience. You have a little gift for the audience.

Speaker 1 00:25:39  You want to tell them about that?

Speaker 2 00:25:41  Yes, absolutely. So I was thinking about what I could do to provide you with next steps on where to go. If you're on your social media journey, especially if you're just starting out, and even if you've been in the social media, you know, world for a while and you've been putting out content for years, having a fresh perspective always helps. So what I created is what I'm calling my Social Media Sync bundle. What you get is two free eBooks. These are robust ebooks that give you a play by play of how to fine tune on social media and how to get started. But also, I'm going to give you a free preview of my book. It would mean the world to me if you took some time to check it out. I include a chapter. I also include the intro and a foreword. So you get like the intro of my book essentially, and you would also get onto my email list. So when when you sign up, all you have to do is reply to the email and I'll respond.

Speaker 2 00:26:37  I'll respond to all of my emails. So you if you have a question about anything we talked about today, if you want to go deeper, just reach out to me directly. I'm accessible, approachable, and honestly, I would enjoy connecting with you. And to get all of that, the Social Media Sync bundle, all you have to do is visit land the talk.com land the talk com that's also the name of my podcast.

Speaker 1 00:27:00  Heck yeah. That will all be in the show notes as well. So if you are driving and you're not able to grab it on the air, then just pause the show and grab it from the show notes. So Robin, thank you so much for being an incredible guest on the show and for your very valuable information on social media strategies. I really appreciate it.

Speaker 2 00:27:18  And I appreciate you. And I just want to say, Shannon, you are an amazing host, and thank you for sharing a little bit of your life with me today.

Speaker 1 00:27:24  Oh thank you. Thanks for listening to The Retreat Leader's podcast.

Speaker 1 00:27:29  Learn more at the Retreat. See you next time.