Do Salespeople Need FBI Hostage Negotiation Skills?
Sales Today
In this episode of The Sales Today Podcast, Fred Copestake is joined by Sebastian Hidalgo, co-founder of DURINDAL and creator of the SWAT method - a sales framework influenced by hostage negotiation principles. Fred admits he’s often sceptical when crisis negotiation gets blended with commercial sales, so this becomes a lively, grounded conversation: what genuinely transfers, what doesn’t, and how to use “hostage” techniques ethically to improve trust, discovery, and positioning. What you’ll hear in this episode Sebastian’s unusual origin story: becoming...
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Surprisingly simple ways to use AI in sales
Sales Today
In this episode, Fred is joined by Tom Ridley, an AI sales coach, for a refreshingly grounded conversation about AI in sales. Instead of racing through a list of tools, Tom makes a different point: AI isn’t the story - being human is. The real value of generative AI (ChatGPT, Gemini, Claude) is that it removes the admin-heavy work salespeople hate and frees them up to do what matters most: have better conversations, build stronger relationships, and help customers make sense of complex decisions. They explore how to use AI to research accounts, focus on the right...
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Ethical marketing meets ethical selling
Sales Today
In this episode, Fred is joined by Chelsea Burns - marketing psychologist, brand ethicist, and non-manipulative marketer to explore where ethical marketing and ethical selling overlap… and where they can go wrong. Chelsea introduces a practical way to draw the line between persuasion and manipulation: Agency - a person’s genuine ability to choose. From there, the conversation goes deep into real-world examples of questionable tactics, why “FOMO” can backfire, and how the brain evaluates purchases immediately after the transaction. Chelsea also shares her four...
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The secret to faster training and coaching result
Sales Today
In this episode, Fred is joined by John Richardson, Co-Founder and Director of Coaching at My Sales Coach, to explore a key question: how do you get faster, more meaningful results from training and coaching? Their answer is simple but powerful: start with the right assessment. They unpack why great coaches are always assessing (without judging), how the right diagnostics can shorten the path to meaningful improvement, and why revenue alone isn’t a useful starting point for development. John explains how My Sales Coach uses assessments to build coaching plans with focus,...
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Is 'good enough' good enough?
Sales Today
In this episode of The Sales Today Podcast, Fred Copestake is joined by sales thought leader, author, and one of the kindest people in the profession, David Brock. Together, they explore David’s new book “Is Good Enough, Good Enough?” and why it’s not another “do this, do that” sales methodology book. Instead, it focuses on the mindsets and behaviours that separate high performers from those who are simply checking the boxes. With win rates often accepted at 15–20% in many SaaS environments, David challenges the idea that “making the number” should...
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The secret to faster training and coaching result
Sales Today
In this episode, Fred is joined by John Richardson, Co-Founder and Director of Coaching at My Sales Coach, to explore a key question: how do you get faster, more meaningful results from training and coaching? Their answer is simple but powerful: start with the right assessment. They unpack why great coaches are always assessing (without judging), how the right diagnostics can shorten the path to meaningful improvement, and why revenue alone isn’t a useful starting point for development. John explains how My Sales Coach uses assessments to build coaching plans with focus,...
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How to avoid AI killing your communication skills
Sales Today
In this episode of The Sales Today Podcast, Fred Copestake is joined by communications and speech coach Susie Ashfield, author of Just F**king Say It and a third-time guest on the show. This is an “emergency podcast” sparked by a moment on LinkedIn: Susie posted a video where she stumbled and left it in. No polishing. No AI. No pretending. Because as AI-generated content gets smoother, faster, and more convincing, the thing that makes us stand out is increasingly simple:- being human. Together, Fred and Susie explore what we risk losing when we outsource too...
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What is Selling? (And Has It Changed?)
Sales Today
In the final episode of the Sales Today mini-series, Fred Copestake and James Michael step back to answer a deceptively simple question: Has selling really changed? The answer is both yes - and no. This closing conversation brings together the themes explored across the series and reframes selling not as persuasion or pressure, but as something far more human, thoughtful, and aligned with how buyers actually make decisions today. In this episode, they explore: What has stayed the same in selling - and what has genuinely evolved Why selling has always been about understanding...
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CEMMT vs SaaS and an Ethical Approach
Sales Today
In Episode 4 of the Sales Today mini series, Fred Copestake and James Michael tackle a growing tension in modern selling: the contrast between SaaS-led sales thinking and the realities of selling in CEMMT industries - construction, engineering, manufacturing, mining, and transport. At the heart of the discussion is Fred’s work on Ethical Selling and why ethics isn’t an abstract concept, but a practical, tactical necessity - particularly in complex, long-term, high-consequence sales environments. This episode challenges hype-driven sales narratives and asks a bigger...
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Why Great Sales Conversations Are Built on Process, Not Personality
Sales Today
In Episode 3 in this five part mini series of Sales Today Podcast, Fred Copestake and James Michael explore a question that challenges another long-held belief in sales: do great sales conversations succeed because of personality - or because of process? This episode looks at how the most effective salespeople consciously select their mode during conversations, switching between listening, questioning, sharing insight, and guiding the discussion - always with the buyer’s outcome in mind. Rather than restricting creativity, process and structure create the space for better thinking,...
info_outlineIn this episode, Fred is joined by Chelsea Burns - marketing psychologist, brand ethicist, and non-manipulative marketer to explore where ethical marketing and ethical selling overlap… and where they can go wrong.
Chelsea introduces a practical way to draw the line between persuasion and manipulation: Agency - a person’s genuine ability to choose. From there, the conversation goes deep into real-world examples of questionable tactics, why “FOMO” can backfire, and how the brain evaluates purchases immediately after the transaction.
Chelsea also shares her four pillars of ethical branding - consent, reciprocity, trust, and belonging and explains how relational psychology can turn ethics from “debating club theory” into day-to-day, tactical decisions that build long-term relationships (and better business).
Fred rounds things out with sales parallels like transparency selling, “lead with a flaw,” and a brilliant ethics conundrum involving goats, segmentation… and B1G1.
What You’ll Learn
- Why ethical persuasion is possible and why “all marketing is manipulation” isn’t true
- The ethical line: agency and a customer’s ability to choose
- A real example of manipulative tactics (and how they show up in launches)
- Chelsea’s four pillars of ethical branding:
- Consent
- Reciprocity
- Trust
- Belonging
- Why manufactured urgency and “never-ending discounts” blur ethical consent
- How FOMO can turn into FOMU (fear of messing up) and increase buyer anxiety
- Why buyers judge value immediately after purchase and how negative emotion backfires
- The “transformation arc” in marketing and selling: current state → desired state → bridge
- Why implementation is what people pay for (not just information)
- A practical ethics test: transparency + intent + consent + follow-through
If you want marketing and selling that drives results without crossing ethical lines, this episode will give you a clear framework and a few things you may never unsee again.
And if you’ve ever wondered whether a tactic “works” but feels a bit… off ,Chelsea’s agency test is a great place to start.
Connect with Chelsea
· LinkedIn: Chelsea Burns: linkedin.com/in/chelseaburns26
· Website: https://www.the-marketing-psychologist.com/
Follow Fred: https://linktr.ee/fredcopestake
Watch this episode on YouTube: https://youtu.be/2CHGDwCMtpc
Watch Fred’s FREE YouTube Course: Sales Mastery for Engineers: https://bit.ly/Sales-Mastery-For-Engineers
Useful resources
- Take the Collaborative Selling Scorecard – free
Check how well your sales approach fits today’s buying environment https://collaborativeselling.scoreapp.com/