390 Engaging with Values: Balancing Tradition and Progress in Leadership
Release Date: 02/16/2025
405 Leading Through Difference: Practical Tools for Inclusive Teams with Kelli Lester
The Future of Leadership
We explore the future of inclusive leadership with Kelli Lester, co-founder of Onyx Rising. Zoë opens with reflections on ageing, robotics in aged care, and the value of connection. And introduces Kelli, who shares insight on navigating today’s polarised workplace and equipping leaders for diverse, resilient teams. Kelli unpacks the backlash against DEI programs, reframing them as essential business strategies rather than politically charged mandates. She explores how organisations can move beyond performative initiatives by anchoring their diversity efforts in clear objectives—be it...
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404 Futurist Thinking at Work: Regenerating Teams from the Inside Out with Donna Dupont
The Future of Leadership
We explore the power of systems thinking and strategic foresight with futurist Donna Dupont, as we challenge assumptions about leadership, innovation, and our collective future. Zoë shares an exciting update on her new book Power Games launching on Kickstarter, and we dive into the emerging vision of a moon-based data centre and what it means for the future of digital infrastructure. In this episode, Donna brings clarity to the often-misunderstood world of foresight work. She breaks down how mapping complexity, anticipatory thinking, and systems framing can shift the way leaders respond to...
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403 Organisational Design and the Future of Work with Susannah Robinson
The Future of Leadership
We explore the vital intersection of organisational design, leadership culture, and power dynamics with special guest Susannah Robinson, author of Beyond the Boxes and Lines. Zoë kicks off the episode with exciting updates on the Power Games Kickstarter campaign and a groundbreaking Planet Human segment on brain-computer interfaces that enable near real-time speech interpretation for paralysed individuals. Then we dive into the conversation with Susannah, who brings over 30 years of HR and organisational design experience. She shares practical frameworks for rethinking job roles, enhancing...
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402 Utopian Concepts and Entrepreneurial Writing with Elle Griffin
The Future of Leadership
We explore the future of ownership, wealth, and rewriting the rules of capitalism with Elle Griffin, founder of The Elysian and author of the upcoming book We Should Own the Economy. Zoë shares updates on her recent bushwalking adventure and the exciting Kickstarter launch for her new book Power Games. Then, she welcomes Elle, a visionary writer reshaping the conversation on who truly benefits from economic systems. Elle shares her journey from journalist to entrepreneurial writer, how she built multiple revenue streams on Substack, and why she believes ownership—not employment—is the...
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401 What's Your Fight Language with Lena Morgan
The Future of Leadership
We explore the future of communication through the lens of conflict, with Lena Morgan, former midwife turned conflict resolution specialist. Zoë shares updates from Planet Human, reflecting on the scathing insights from the Edelman Trust Barometer and her return from the Australian Alpine Walking Track. The Kickstarter for her latest book, Power Games, is on the horizon. Then we welcome Lena Morgan, creator of The Fight Languages. Lena unpacks how understanding our instinctive conflict responses can turn tension into connection. Drawing on her experience in high-stress environments, she...
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Episode 400: Leadership Lessons from Nine Years of Podcast Interviews
The Future of Leadership
In this milestone 400th episode, I reflect on nine years of podcasting and the extraordinary leadership lessons I’ve gathered along the way. I explore the show's enduring themes—wise leadership, effective teamwork, and self-mastery—and celebrate the voices that have challenged and expanded my thinking. I revisit pivotal interviews, including a profoundly perspective-shifting conversation with non-binary advocate Yenn Purkis, and highlight standout episodes across three categories: moving stories, practical leadership tools, and game-changing insights. From ultra-endurance athlete Laura...
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399 Holocaust, Racism and Kindness in Humans - a personal story with Dr. Robert Wolf
The Future of Leadership
We explore the courage to confront tyranny and the roots of empathy through personal legacy and historical insight. Zoë shares reflections on billionaire-owned media and the future of truth-seeking in journalism, and updates us on her Australian Alpine walking track adventure and upcoming Kickstarter for Power Games. Then, we welcome Dr. Robert Wolf, author of Not a Real Enemy, a gripping biography of his father’s extraordinary journey through Nazi and Communist Hungary. Rob shares the harrowing yet hopeful story of his father’s four-time escape from tyranny, how he rebuilt his life as a...
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398 AI, Automations, and the Future of Business Operations with Emma Rainville
The Future of Leadership
We dive into the world of operational excellence and visionary leadership with guest Emma Rainville, author of Scope and founder of Shockwave. Zoë shares updates on her Australian Alpine walking track adventure and the behind-the-scenes of the Power Games Kickstarter launch. On Planet Human, she explores the unfolding Tesla brand rebellion and the deeper lessons on leadership, marketing, and impact. Emma brings a compelling perspective on how to scale businesses by bringing calm to chaos. She outlines the WAVE framework—Written Vision, Absolute Focus, Values-driven Future, and Execution...
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397 Life First: Designing Work and Money to Serve You with Tim Duggan
The Future of Leadership
We explore the revolutionary idea of designing your work life by starting with what matters most—your life. Zoë shares updates on her Australian Alpine walking track adventure, her latest developments with the Power Play game based on her book Power Games, and her new home for content on Substack. Then, we welcome Tim Duggan—award-winning author, media entrepreneur, and columnist for The Sydney Morning Herald and The Age. Tim shares thoughtful insights from his latest book Work Backwards, which challenges conventional notions of success and offers a practical framework for aligning your...
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396 Semester at Sea: Building Sustainable and Inclusive Futures with Scott Marshall
The Future of Leadership
We explore the power of challenging assumptions and building regenerative societies with innovative software called Regen. I also share updates on my upcoming Australian Alpine walking track adventure and my latest novels. Then, I welcome Scott Marshall, President and CEO of the Semester at Sea. Scott shares insights into the program’s impact on students’ understanding of global cultures and how it fosters curiosity and personal growth. He also provides practical advice for fostering intercultural sensitivity in the workplace. This episode dives deep into experiential education,...
info_outlineWe explore the future of leadership, focusing on cognitive levels, emotional intelligence, and trust with Todd Hollow Bist. We discuss the importance of self-awareness, using presence to regulate emotions, and fostering breakthrough conversations in challenging environments.
We consider the role of psychological age in leadership, how dialectic thinking can drive innovation, and practical techniques for building trust and enhancing team dynamics.
Key Quotes
- "Our work begins with understanding, not judgment, seeking common ground through shared strengths." Zoë Routh
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"The brain wants to grow, but ambiguity and stress can push us down in cognitive levels." – Todd Hollow Bist
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"Presence is the muscle we use to stay at our best cognitive levels and resist being triggered into reactive behaviour." – Todd Hollow Bist
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"Leadership is about understanding people at a deeper level—not just what they say, but how they feel about it." – Todd Hollow Bist
Questions Asked
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How can leaders have breakthrough conversations in a polarised world?
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What are cognitive levels, and how do they shape leadership effectiveness?
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How does psychological age affect adult behaviour in leadership settings?
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What is dialectic thinking, and how can it lead to innovative conversations?
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What are practical ways to develop greater self-awareness as a leader?
Take Action
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Reflect on how ambiguity and stress influence your decision-making and emotional responses.
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Practise presence as a way to regulate emotions and maintain leadership effectiveness.
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Engage in dialectic thinking: next time you have a disagreement, focus on understanding the other person’s feelings, not just their argument.
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Observe how psychological age manifests in yourself and your team. Are you reacting from a mature, adult state or reverting to earlier behavioural patterns?
Tip of the Week
Review the collaboration self-checklist - available for subscribers only. Join the community here. You’ll get 40 book summaries and recommendations on Leading Strategy and Performance, along with a special secret audio from my award-winning book, People Stuff.
Key Moments
00:00 - Welcome back to the show
00:28 - Reflections on the current political climate
01:07 - Personal updates and Magic Mind
06:39 - Introducing Todd Hollow Bist
07:45 - Todd’s journey into leadership
11:07 - Understanding cognitive levels
24:16 - Practical applications of cognitive levels
31:11 - Navigating emotional responses in leadership
32:10 - The role of empathy in building trust
34:45 - Recognising and testing trust in relationships
39:20 - Developing self-awareness and cognitive levels
49:52 - Dialectic thinking for innovative conversations
53:03 - Rapid-fire questions and leadership insights
58:43 - Book recommendation: Strongmen by Ruth Ben-Ghiat
59:47 - Closing thoughts and encouragement
Power Games Kickstarter Campaign, sign up here:
https://www.zoerouth.com/power-games
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