EP20 - Judging Cannes and the Future of Creativity with Stephanie Yung

In this episode of CMA Connect, the CMA's CEO, Alison Simpson, sits down with Stephanie Yung, Chief Design Officer at Zulu Alpha Kilo. As a judge at the prestigious 2024 Cannes Lions, Stephanie shares her unique insights on the emerging themes in the creative industry, her experience reviewing groundbreaking work from around the globe and her predictions for the future of creativity.

00:00:00:17 - 00:00:21:13
Presenter
Welcome to CMA Connect, Canada's marketing podcast, where industry experts discuss how marketers must manage the tectonic shift that will change how brands and businesses are built for tomorrow, while also delivering on today's business needs. With your host CMA CEO Alison Simpson.

00:00:21:15 - 00:00:47:20
Alison
In today's episode, I'm thrilled to bring you an inside look of what it's like to be a judge in the prestigious Cannes Lions International Festival of Creativity. Joining us is the incredibly talented Stephanie Yung, a true creative powerhouse and also the chief design officer for Zulu Alpha Kilo. As a globally recognized design leader, - Stephanie has extensive experience in the strategic translation of brands into new product services and experience.

00:00:47:22 - 00:01:20:04
Alison
She's often sought out for her ability to establish brand visions for the future, and she has advised and collaborated with audiences ranging from the most recognized brands in the world to brand new startups, and from venture capitalists to nonprofit organizations. So she has a very diverse view and expertise that we are sure to benefit from today. Over the years, Stephanie's work has been recognized at every major award show, including DNAD, Cannes, The One Show, Fast Company's Innovation by Design and in fact, she has won eight Cannes Lions.

00:01:20:06 - 00:01:38:20
Alison
So with that pedigree, it's definitely not surprising that Stephanie was selected as a judge for the industry craft category at this year's Cannes Lions Awards. Stephanie is bringing a wealth of knowledge and insights to our audience today, from her early days as a young creative winning her very first Lion to now being on the other side of the judging table.

00:01:39:02 - 00:01:59:16
Alison
Stephanie's journey is definitely inspiring. So in this episode, we're diving deep into the Cannes Lion judging process and what it's like to review and discuss work from around the world. Stephanie will also share her early observations on trends and themes that she's noticed in the entries, and how the experience has really made her feel about the future of creativity in our industry.

00:01:59:18 - 00:02:02:07
Alison
So with that, a very warm welcome to Stephanie.

00:02:02:09 - 00:02:03:23
Stephanie
Thank you so much for having me.

00:02:04:01 - 00:02:15:18
Alison
So, Stephanie, many creatives and marketers absolutely dream about winning a Cannes Lion. And I'd like to start by having you share what your very first experience was like winning a Lion and attending Cannes.

00:02:15:21 - 00:02:37:12
Stephanie
Yes. I mean, it was, gosh, I'm going to date myself, but I think it was over 15 years ago, around, and so, you know, just where I was in my career is definitely the early days. And I was the senior designer. I mean, from that point of view, I feel like winning Cannes obviously is just such an honour, but really the ability to attend.

00:02:37:12 - 00:02:58:19
Stephanie
I think what it did, especially where I was in that point in my career, really expanded my aperture I'd say, just in terms of what creativity could do and the impact of it, as well as I'd say from the point of view of Canadians, Canadians being right up there, being able to set the benchmark with just the rest of the world or for the world.

00:02:58:21 - 00:03:19:07
Stephanie
And I feel like it really informed me in the sense that I don't know if I would have ever gone to New York,  because I did work there for over decades, because it's just the idea of like the possibilities. That's what it really did for me. And, you know, also obviously reinforcing that creativity really can impact business and people's lives.

00:03:19:09 - 00:03:46:19
Alison
That's such a great perspective. And often in Canada, we can be a little too humble about our capabilities and our talent. So to see how we really stack up and are outperforming our country's reputation on the global stage for creativity. I love the fact that that led to you taking a very different direction in your career and realizing that you could absolutely compete and succeed and thrive in New York City and some of the best advertising destinations in the world.

00:03:46:19 - 00:03:52:18
Alison
So that's a great to learning to come back with, and the fact that you brought back a Lion certainly doesn't hurt either.

00:03:52:20 - 00:03:53:03
Stephanie
Yeah, that's true.

00:03:53:03 - 00:04:17:08
Alison
When I think about how our country has progressed in the 15 years since I was in Cannes, probably about the same time. But every year I've been thrilled to see we're winning more and more Lions, and we seem to keep upping the ante and upping the success of our country every year. Now, to the point where we're actually rivaling London as one of the top countries in bringing home Lions.

00:04:17:10 - 00:04:37:22
Alison
So obviously, from a marketing profession and from a creativity perspective, that is incredibly inspiring and motivating for us as Canadians. And I'm excited to see us set yet  a new standard in the number of Lions we bring home this year. I'd love to hear your thoughts on what do you think is driving that, and our increased success at the Cannes Festival?

00:04:38:00 - 00:05:13:15
Stephanie
Yeah, that's well, first of all, just in terms of the count, the count of Lions growing. I didn't know it, I didn't know it was like to that extent, which is pretty amazing. That's a really good question. If I were to think about it, I think it's perhaps just in terms of, you know, when we look at how people viewed creativity back then and the possibilities, I feel like our marketers, brands, businesses and organizations, their realization that creativity can impact business as well as people's real lives

00:05:13:15 - 00:05:27:13
Stephanie
I feel like maybe opened up projects and opened up, I'd say, different types of problem solving and solutions. So that's probably why, because we are solving more problems through creativity.

00:05:27:15 - 00:05:31:05
Alison
So what inspired you to apply to be a judge for the Cannes Lions this year?

00:05:31:07 - 00:05:56:14
Stephanie
So it is very different in terms of like where I am now in my career. Obviously, I know it sounds really nerdy, but I think the opportunity to really be exposed to and connected to the most awe-inspiring work in the world is something that I really wanted to to do, but also, I feel like getting the time to actually get into rich discussions and learning different point of views and perspectives that are hopefully eye-opening.

00:05:56:14 - 00:06:15:13
Stephanie
And I say that because, you know, when you think about, even in Canada, and I know I keep on, you know, coming back, just the idea of being Canadian, I just think we're a country made of so many different ethnicities and cultures. I feel like to hear more from other people's perspectives will only really make us stronger, and our general understanding of how to reach people here.

00:06:15:15 - 00:06:26:23
Stephanie
And so I've always been just really interested in connecting with people and just in terms of learning about behaviours and cultures and what we can do to, I think, really add value.

00:06:27:01 - 00:06:46:05
Alison
Such a great perspective. Now, I know that you're going to be on the plane soon, heading to Cannes. And when you haven't judged before, I was under the perception that all the judging happened once you arrived. And clearly I was wrong. So I'd love to have you walk us through the judging process and the commitment involved, because I know it is significant.

00:06:46:06 - 00:07:05:21
Stephanie
So yeah, judging involves two stages. The first stage is actually virtual, which is the one that you're talking about, where we really do create a shortlist and that's done independently. And then the second stage is when we're on site and in that room, as we're saying, and having those rich discussions, and that occurs over a two day period.

00:07:05:21 - 00:07:27:13
Stephanie
And that's when we really award what is shortlisted a bronze, silver and gold Lion. But in terms of just like, what does it entail, and the commitment required when looking at each entry? Each entry has a written submission. So that's really a time where people can tell the jurors really what the creative strategy was, the concept execution.

00:07:27:15 - 00:07:52:02
Stephanie
And then there's a case film and then there's like presentation images and supporting material. And I mean, I think we all can recognize that Cannes really is a career changer and has a possibility to change people's lives. And in saying that, really do take the time to look at each entry and understand the social and cultural context, because this is a global kind of pool of work and platform.

00:07:52:04 - 00:08:20:10
Stephanie
And I think also take the time to have that unbiased point of view. And so really, when evaluating the work, I'd say it really is leveraging the same principles that you do, and like I do in my day to day job. And so that really is looking at like, does it have the concept, does it have that level of craft because that is the category, is it original enough and will it have impact or does it for the brand and for the people it's trying to reach.

00:08:20:12 - 00:08:33:05
Stephanie
And you know, so that's really how the process is and what we're looking for or what I'm looking for more specifically, when awarding or shortlisting the work.

00:08:33:07 - 00:08:53:06
Alison
So I love that you're taking this seriously because as you say, it is a career changer, so... And I can imagine, I've judged other awards when you're going through so many submissions, you really have to hold yourself accountable because you, you at times want to take a shortcut. And you also called out the being aware of the biases that we each bring to it.

00:08:53:06 - 00:09:08:03
Alison
So thank you on behalf of all the people that are hoping to win a Cannes Lion that you're judging, for making that a priority. Can you talk a bit about what you're doing to try to minimize your bias as well, as you're going through the process?

00:09:08:05 - 00:09:33:21
Stephanie
Well, thanks for asking that question. I, I do think it's about being really, taking the time, I'd say, to be thoughtful and to really go through the submission. To really ask yourself, like or myself, when I'm going through it, why am I having this reaction? Is it based on any maybe biased thinking I have, whether that's in something that I might not...

00:09:33:23 - 00:09:57:21
Stephanie
I'll give you an example. Something that might not be an issue that we face here. We might think, oh, is that, you know, not as important. But that's what I mean. That's based on our experience because we surely can't understand. So I feel like it's taking the time to understand the context of the work and then questioning, you know, is this delivering that versus making assumptions.

00:09:57:23 - 00:10:16:17
Alison
So, Stephanie, right now you're judging virtually and independently. When you get off the plane and arrive in Cannes, you're obviously going to be coming together in person with your fellow judges for the Industry Craft Awards. And I'd love you to share a little bit about how you think that dynamic will change and what you're most looking forward to in that.

00:10:16:19 - 00:10:38:11
Stephanie
I think when you're in person, you know, there's more of an ability to, I think, have an open conversation. And what I mean by that, so when we spoke about biases in the beginning, I feel like a person representing of that country could really talk about how the work might be effective or talk about some nuances that we might not understand.

00:10:38:13 - 00:11:05:08
Stephanie
And so I feel like it gives space and room for understanding and for looking at the work through a 360 lens and really having a debate around it and its merits and why it was successful, why it was shortlisted and why it deserves to win. And so I really do feel like it's that added context and being able to see points of view that I might not have alone, you know, being a designer, that's my background.

00:11:05:10 - 00:11:18:19
Stephanie
There are judges who have other backgrounds than me, and so I feel like that point of view altogether will really give out a well-rounded recommendation of really, what's the best? And our point of view of what the best is in the world.

00:11:18:23 - 00:11:35:15
Alison
That's great. I suspect there will be some very healthy debates as well, so I'm sure that will be a fascinating part of it. And I also think that given the intensity of what you're going to be going through in person, I suspect there's also going to be some really great relationships and friendships formed with your fellow judges.

00:11:35:17 - 00:11:56:16
Stephanie
This is what I hear. I mean, the past judges that I've spoken with, I mean, I feel like that's the biggest thing too, so when you asked earlier about, why did I want to judge? I feel like really the opportunity to meet creative people from around the world who are interested in the same things you are and who are trying to push their own field and work and in their own countries

00:11:56:16 - 00:12:00:23
Stephanie
I feel like is something that I'm really excited about as well, for sure.

00:12:01:01 - 00:12:06:12
Alison
Stephanie, I'd love you to share are there any early trends or themes that you're noticing in the entries that you've reviewed?

00:12:06:14 - 00:12:26:01
Stephanie
Yes, there definitely are. I think when we think of craft in general, you know, it has the ability to move you and to make you feel, and I think that's what I was saying is a superpower. And as well, you know, I feel like Cannes, a show like Cannes, really is a reflection of things that are happening in the culture at any given moment.

00:12:26:03 - 00:12:45:03
Stephanie
And so these are themes that, because as you were saying, I've also been judging a lot of different shows and and even like in speaking with people in  I would say parallel fields or people in the industry, not necessarily in advertising squarely, but in culture creating so on and so forth. I feel like there are some emerging themes.

00:12:45:05 - 00:13:05:18
Stephanie
And so if we're looking at craft as a way to really bring feeling to work, people do that in different ways. And so the things I'm starting to see is nostalgia as craft. So it's really about trying to connect with people by harkening back to like a past time, and I feel like you really do see that in music as well.

00:13:05:18 - 00:13:28:13
Stephanie
So whether you're referencing a different time and place through photography, typography or art direction, that is really something that we see. As well as imperfection as craft. And I feel like you see it everywhere, but things that, you know, it feels like something authored it. It's not about perfection. It's actually about seeing that human hand or that idea of a person behind it.

00:13:28:13 - 00:13:54:20
Stephanie
And perhaps I feel like with the hot topic of AI, that may be a reason why we are seeing more of that, or the want for that and the reflection of that. And then lastly, I'd say, reduction as craft. And what I mean by that is really boiling something down to its most purest form of expression. And so those were the three I've seen so far, mind you, that might change as we like talk.

00:13:54:20 - 00:14:02:02
Stephanie
And there might be more obviously, that emerge, but those are some themes that I've been noticing in craft in general.

00:14:02:04 - 00:14:16:07
Alison
Many thanks for sharing that, Stephanie. Now I'd like to close our discussion, you've got a such an enviable career. I know our listeners would love to hear from you, one piece of advice that you would offer for everyone that's tuned in today.

00:14:16:09 - 00:14:39:00
Stephanie
This is always a hard question, but I think in keeping, you know, if we're keeping with our topic of just creating like world class breakthrough work. So if I were to keep with that theme or topic, it's really, I'd say get comfortable with the uncomfortable. And you know, what I mean by that is whenever we're creating something new, it doesn't feel comfortable at all.

00:14:39:02 - 00:14:59:03
Stephanie
Whenever we're trying to do something different and go against what everyone else is doing, we really do have to, like, brave through it, kind of embrace uncomfortable and and work through it because, you know, just in terms of right now where we are in the world, I feel like we're very heavily reliant on data and things like that.

00:14:59:03 - 00:15:12:05
Stephanie
And so, we at this point and the point of that is we need to trust our own experience to really work through it and take that creative and strategic leap, because that's really when true transformation and impact can happen.

00:15:12:07 - 00:15:31:23
Alison
I love that advice from a professional perspective. I also love that advice from a personal perspective because every industry is changing, the marketing industry is going through massive change and at a pace that very few other industries are facing. So the reality is that everyone in our profession, if we don't get comfortable with being uncomfortable, it's not going to be a lot of fun.

00:15:32:01 - 00:15:57:16
Alison
So Stephanie, thank you for the great advice. Thank you for making time in your very busy schedule to share the first part of your Cannes judging process with us. It's absolutely been a delight. When our listeners are tuning in to today's discussion, you will be off the plane in Cannes, working with your co-judges on the industry craft awards and making some really great decisions and ultimately changing some careers with the decisions that you're making.

00:15:57:16 - 00:16:03:11
Alison
So I really appreciate the time you spent with us today, and I'm excited to connect with you when you get back from Cannes.

00:16:03:12 - 00:16:09:10
Stephanie
Thanks so much for having me.

00:16:09:12 - 00:26:31:00
Presenter
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