EP16 - Engaging Indigenous Audiences with Carolin Taubensee

In this episode of CMA Connect, Alison Simpson, CEO of the CMA, welcomes Carolin Taubensee, Executive Director of Marketing Communications at APTN. They discuss preserving Indigenous languages, how marketers can reach these diverse communities, and opening doors for the Indigenous worldwide.

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Speaker 1
Welcome to CMA Connect, Canada's marketing podcast,

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where industry experts discuss how marketers must manage the tectonic shifts that will change how brands and businesses are built for tomorrow, while also delivering on today's business needs.

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With your host, CMA CEO, Alison Simpson.

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Alison
With challenges in the industry's quest for inclusivity and representation. Marketers really need to navigate the journey of aligning brand narratives with the profound cultural heritage of indigenous communities. In this episode, I'm honoured to have a conversation with Carolin Taubensee, Executive Director of Marketing and Communications at APTN. APTN is the first national indigenous broadcaster in the world, and it's an organization that's not only carving out a critical space for indigenous voices in media, but also reshaping how brands can connect with this diverse and dynamic audience.

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Alison
So today, we're going to explore the business opportunity that marketing to the indigenous population represents. And we're also going to talk about the impact of indigenous media on brand strategies and uncover the diverse demographics of indigenous communities. We'll discuss the authentic ways that brands can engage with indigenous audiences, fostering social responsibility and long term loyalty. Plus, we'll discuss the pursuit of indigenous language preservation and how this cultural cornerstone is influencing the marketing sphere.

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Alison
Carolin, I'm absolutely thrilled to have you joining us today.

Carolin
Thank you so much, Allison. It's great to be here. 

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Alison
Now, I want to kick things off by having you share your insights on the size of and diversity within the indigenous population in Canada.

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Carolin
Sure. First of all, I'd just like to say that I'm coming to you today from Treaty One territory. I was born and raised in Winnipeg, first-generation Canadian from German heritage, and having worked at APTN for almost six years now, I'm happy to say that I'm an ally of the Indigenous peoples. 

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Carolin
In terms of the learning and the understanding in terms of Indigenous communities in Canada, it's really important to know that they're not one homogeneous group. They have shared values and experiences, but there are vast differences when we consider there's over 600 distinct First Nations communities in Canada with over 70 Indigenous languages spoken.

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Carolin
And so Indigenous people are represented by First Nations, Inuit, and Métis people. And First Nations is about 60% of the Indigenous population, Métis about 34-ish percent,

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Carolin
and then about four or five percent for Inuit, which are largely people in the north. And in total, the population in Canada for Indigenous people is almost 2 million.

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Carolin
It's 1.8 million, according to the last census. And that represents a total of about 5% of the population in Canada. But what's interesting in terms of going into looking at that audience and that community, is it's the fastest growing population in Canada,

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Carolin
and it also has the youngest population, where 28% are about under 25 years old. And so as marketers, we're often trying to reach younger audiences.

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Carolin
So it's very worthwhile noting that Indigenous people tend to be younger. And it's on average, the average age of Canadians is, you know, early 40s. Indigenous people, it's a decade younger. So quite interesting when we think about the opportunities that are out there for marketers today. 

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Alison
Carolin, I knew that I was going to learn a lot from you today. I had no appreciation for the size of the Indigenous community in Canada. And the fact that there are 600 communities and over 70 languages spoken. I also didn't know that they were the fastest growing community within our country. So thank you so much. That was incredibly illuminating.

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Carolin
You're welcome. It's also, I think, interesting to talk about a geographic distribution of Indigenous people as well.

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Carolin
Only 43% live on reserve and Indigenous people, they're more likely to live in large urban centres. And so in the largest Indigenous population in a city in Canada is actually in Winnipeg with over 100,000 people.

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Carolin
But there's large representation in Edmonton and Vancouver as well, in terms of city centre. But when you think about, on a provincial level, and you look at Ontario, the largest population of Indigenous people live in Ontario. It's almost 400,000 people. And so we really are in terms of Indigenous people spread throughout coast to coast to coast.

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Carolin
But when you think about sort of that distribution of reserve or rural, it's a large city population and the volume is across the country.

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Alison
Now, this multifaceted group certainly represents potential consumers for many brands and many of our listeners today. Carolin, in your experience, what are the opportunities that you see and how can marketers tailor their marketing strategy and approach to reach and resonate with Indigenous consumers?

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Carolin
You know, it's important. I think everybody realizes that Canada is a very diverse country, and so as marketers we strive to identify with consumers. So we need to represent diversity.

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Carolin
It's very important. And as marketers we can't get trapped into thinking what attracts me or what interests me as a consumer We really need to step into the shoes or the moccasins as the case may be into others and so that we can understand all all the different diverse communities that are in Canada,

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Carolin
including Indigenous people. Now, when we think about it, Indigenous people consume all the same products that non-Indigenous people do. They're buying groceries,

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Carolin
they're buying cars, they're buying houses, they're shopping in retail. And so it really is a matter of how do we associate with audiences of diverse

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Carolin
backgrounds because they are consumers of the products that were out there, products and services that we're presenting to as marketers out there. 

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Alison
So, with an increasing interest in diversity and inclusion, I'd love you to share some specific outcomes and success stories of brands that have forged partnerships with Indigenous media entities, like APTN.

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Carolin
So as APTN is the world's first national indigenous broadcaster, we are able to share our stories with our voices and it's our narratives that really matter. And that's the importance of what Indigenous media brings to Canada.

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Carolin
There are many Indigenous media out there, whether they are radio stations, whether they are digital news platforms, traditional print, television. television, and many reflect and celebrate the cultures and the languages and traditions and wisdom of Indigenous peoples.

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Carolin
And I'm very humbled in terms of the knowledge that Indigenous people collectively have in terms of the environment, the land, water, the animals.

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Carolin
They're such important aspects in terms of our overall environment. And so-- I think that when we go into working with Indigenous media as marketers that are out there,

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Carolin
they're connecting with that community directly and showing that support and that relationship. And so I think that's a very important aspect of looking at marketing and how do we connect.

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Alison
So how can brands demonstrate a genuine commitment to social responsibility when marketing in Indigenous spaces and ensuring that they're not falling into a performative allyship? 

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Carolin
I think the important thing here is for marketers to, as individuals, to take the time to learn and understand about different communities, including Indigenous peoples. There's a great course, the online course,

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Carolin
that the University of Alberta offers for free, and it's called Indigenous Canada, and it's great knowledge in terms of understanding the history and the perspectives of Indigenous people.

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Carolin
And so, as individuals, as marketers, I think it's important to put yourself in terms of learning about the communities and being sensitive in terms of ceremony,

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Carolin
spirituality. It's important not to just utilize traditional images in our marketing. It can be that there are people that are represented just in terms of diverse communities,

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Carolin
people of colour and so forth that they're integrated into advertising. But it's important to really learn about the communities and not, you know, utilize something that could be quite sensitive,

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Carolin
especially as it relates to culture and ceremony and spirituality. 

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Alison
So, Carolin, I'd love you to share some of the ways the indigenous community has shown appreciation or reciprocated when brands engage with them authentically and respectfully.

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Carolin
A big part of Indigenous culture is really building relationships with other communities. And so when it is opened up in terms of marketers,

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Carolin
recognizing and showing importance that they want a relationship with Indigenous people is a cultural thing to be able to reciprocate that.

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Carolin
And looking at shared values is very important in terms of what is important to Indigenous people. And so looking at those aspects of relationship-building is a big part of being able to share and identify potentially with marketers that recognize and the values and the importance of Indigenous peoples

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Carolin
as a whole and being very respectful in terms of Indigenous people. So that just is sort of, you know, the full circle of building respect and relationships, is a big part of what makes sense and what's important to Indigenous people.

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Alison
Now, Carolin, with APTN's initiative towards Indigenous language preservation, what role do you think media plays in cultural sustainability? And how should brands align with these efforts for meaningful engagement?

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Carolin
I was mentioning earlier that there's over seventy Indigenous languages in Canada, and some of them are at high risk of being lost. And when languages are lost,

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Carolin
culture is lost. And so one of the things that APTN is working through and has for a while is providing content that is in language.

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Carolin
For so long, Indigenous people were not even able to speak their language. But we've come to a place where finally there's the respect that is out there in terms of enabling those languages to be spoken.

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Carolin
And so it's really important in terms of the role that APTN plays in providing content that is in a variety of languages. languages so that people can hear,

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Carolin
get a sense of pride, and rebuild and reclaim those languages again. And so if there are marketers that are out there, that can help us achieve our goals collectively for the betterment of our communities,

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Carolin
then that would be so valuable in terms of meaningful engagement, and moving forward in terms of reconciliation. The Truth and Reconciliation Commission came out with a number of calls to action.

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Carolin
Number 92 in particular is really calling on corporate Canada to build the relationships and enable Indigenous people in terms of access,

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Carolin
whether that's jobs, education, whether it's learning and educating themselves on history and the legacy of residential schools. And so when we look at how do we challenge and what can organizations do in terms of achieving reconciliation,

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Carolin
that's an important part of it. And then even APTN has been called upon in terms of the call to action number 85. And how we support reconciliation together is being that leader in programming, and the culture, and being able to share those languages and help reclaim them again and build strength back up in the community to speak the languages that is such a strong representation of culture.

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Alison
Carolin, thank you so much. Now you've got an enviable job, you've got an outstanding career. So I'd love to close our discussion today by having you share one piece of advice for our listeners. It's a marketing audience, and I know they would benefit from some marketing advice and something you'd like to share with them.

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Carolin
You know, I started my career over 35 years ago. I was a media planner buyer at an ad agency and I've come full circle now sitting sort of at the media side,

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Carolin
within the media industry. And I would just say that what's important is knowing that media is an art and a science. We look at all the metrics.

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Carolin
Digital provides us so many metrics in terms of performance of marketing and advertising, and that's important. But it's also important to recognize the art side of it.

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Carolin
And intuitively, stepping out of the numbers and being able to identify communities, audiences, that may not always sort of meet the standards of the largest audience or impressions and those sorts of things.

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Carolin
And so my advice for young marketers is to recognize the art and the science of media and looking at numbers, but building in sort of those intuitive understandings of communities and what might be important to step outside of just the plain numbers themselves.

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Alison
That's great advice, Carolin. It's certainly very applicable to the media aspect of the marketing profession. I would say it's also very applicable across all aspects of the marketing profession. So it's a great note to end on. And I really want to thank you for being my guest today and sharing some really important insights into how marketers can resonate with and engage with our Indigenous community.

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Carolin
Thank you so much for having me. It's been a pleasure to be able to talk about this today. 

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